Staying in Parent´s house versus healthy marriage

[alice24]

We prepared for moving to my future in-laws after wedding the last months. Planned was an single floor for us with seperate spaces.
Now my mother in law -to- be got cancer. Bad prognose. The theme of moving the “living spaces apart” are far away now, but with MIL, the only reasonable finacial planner of this family left and I fear it will be chaotic. We have no personal space for us, I have to discuss now everything personal - pet care, household etc - so I fear they want me living their life, not ours. I feel I can´t breathe. Father of fiancé want to get a loan to rebuy the house they are living in (they lost it in a financial crisis) and needs our rent to get the security for the loan. As my MIL´s income isn´t longer availible, we would cause them losing the house as his brother doesn´t work because he has problems with his life and don´t manage it well.
Fiance would leave the house because of me, but not -as I see it - because he understands the situation would destroy our marriage.He is 28 and never moved out, but now the sickness of his mother is a strong argument. I feel he think it isn´t morally right to leave.
What do you think?

 

[Xantippe]

Gosh, that sounds tough. What are the requirements that your future in-laws have for you living there?

I’m American and my sister married a German and they lived very happily with their baby on the lower floor of BIL’s parents’ house for a number of years. The in-laws even put in a small kitchen on the ground floor for my sister, which was SO NICE. They live separately now, but continue to have a close relationship, with lots of visits. So it can be done.

Here’s what I would suggest (and discuss this in detail with your fiance before moving in):

–Short term, live with your in-laws, but try to have as much privacy as you can. At some point in the evening, move downstairs to your space and stay there. If you don’t have a kitchen down there, maybe have a little fridge? After a certain time in the evening, you are not available, except if there is a special occasion or an emergency. You don’t want your in-laws calling your husband away in the middle of a “private moment,” right? Also, make sure you two go out on dates and go out.

–Long term, you probably don’t want to live with these people forever, at least not as a tenant. I normally would not encourage you to live with your in-laws as a newlywed, but it would probably give a lot of comfort to your MIL in her final months or years to have her son nearby, and it will give him a lot of comfort to know that he did everything he could for mom. I would suggest a lot of compassion and flexibility now, but having long-term plans to be elsewhere, or at least on a different footing. You deserve to have a home of your own, or at least to be respected in your own home, not to be a second class citizen.

This is very tricky, because it would be easy to be too harsh or too soft, and it would be easy to be so soft that one winds up stuck in a bad situation. But keep talking to your fiance/future husband about this.

Good luck!

 

[alice24]

Gosh, that sounds tough. What are the requirements that your future in-laws have for you living there?

It´s very much not outspoken but harsh. I experienced it as I spent much time in the last months there, time to get to know their household.
They gave us a free room third floor, where our bedroom will be, too. Bedroom of his parents is there, too, where his father sleeps and his wife is in the basement because of the stairs. This bedroom should we get, but know, “it has changed because they have to do so much”. There is one shower in the third floor everyone needs to use. Beside our bedroom. The small room beside is full of the stuff of his parents, after further asking, they toild me to “do what we want” with it. I packed the books etc in boxes for them to chose what to do with it. I would like to have a kitchen there . Reaction: “you could have done the stuff better in many boxes in this and this way”…(it would have taken me weeks and it´s not my stuff) and “no kitchen there, because of…reasons…space…(no reasons given”.
Living chamber of us is on the middle floor. His brother lives on this floor, too, and has daily visits from a married woman he has an affair with. It´s for some weeks now. I hoped they would speak out against this, but nothing happened. I don´t see them often, but I hate even the idea.
I have a dog. Dog is well trained by me, but they start to make fun with him in a way he starts to behave less good because they question my authority… They discuss even the dog food with me. Sorry, but I fear the day this will happen with my children.
I am pushed to do everything MIL has done and I start feeling like that, which is horrible. I feel her son is dependend as everyone in this system and I won´t be “bad cop” for the next years to keep everything well. His parents would freak out when we decide to go as they couldn´t pay the house alone.

 

[alice24]

The grass isn’t greener on the other side

Sorry, what do you mean?

 

[alice24]

nd discuss this in detail with your fiance before moving in):

Too late - As I needed to cancel my contract for the flat we drived much of the stuff in this house because we didn´t want to do this in the week right before marriage. So, technically, my contract is over in december and my stuff is in the new house.

 

[Xanthippe_Voorhees]

I’m with Xan the Greater.

Short term–this seems like it could be tenable.

Long term–this seems like bad news.

The fact that they are needing your money in order to keep their head above water is bad news.

Do you have elder-law attorneys in Germany? I would have a professional who’s been there done that help you ascertain your rights. For instance, legal obligations to your in-laws may be very different based on your country. In the US, tenants rights are highly protected. In other countries, landlords can sue beyond the terms of a lease if they can show a reasonable expectation that the person planned to stay longer.

What I’d actually suggest–and do in your situation–is suggest that the current house be sold/given up on. then find a house that has an in-law apartment and have the parents move in. When she passes the father can choose to continue to “rent” or to move out to which you can rent the in-law apartment to another.

I do think that it sounds like the chaos would be unhealthy. Not only that, it’s not going to be easier to leave the father and the layabout brother after the mother passes—if she’s all thats keeping them together the fall out is going to be bad.

 

[alice24]

My rights in the contract are very small as it was a student appartment of university with reduced quitting terms. I would find something new, but we will get married in less than a month, so it would mean “I don´t want to live with you”.
Finding a new house is difficult. First, they won´t leave, no one. No one can realy deal with financial issues, they planed to buy a highly riscant house next to them and make mutual modification on the house they think they “need” (storing rooms) before even making the second shower work. To be honest, I fear dealing in a finacial way with them. Father is to soft with fiancés brother and I think it will end in an desaster as no one is critical enough to see it won´t work.
We need to search our place for post-university trainee and education and we could perfectly fine go for a new flat in eastern germany where rents are smaller, but we need to decide in a few months where to search for this jobs. So, decision will be there when his mother is still alive and the house is in that unplanable state.

 

[1ke]

What do you think?

Based on this and your other posts, your fiancé is not ready to be married and it would be a huge mistake to move forward with marriage to him.

 

[Xanthippe_Voorhees]

My rights in the contract are very small as it was a student appartment of university with reduced quitting terms. I would find something new, but we will get married in less than a month, so it would mean “I don´t want to live with you”.
Finding a new house is difficult. First, they won´t leave, no one. No one can realy deal with financial issues, they planed to buy a highly riscant house next to them and make mutual modification on the house they think they “need” (storing rooms) before even making the second shower work. To be honest, I fear dealing in a finacial way with them. Father is to soft with fiancés brother and I think it will end in an desaster as no one is critical enough to see it won´t work.
We need to search our place for post-university trainee and education and we could perfectly fine go for a new flat in eastern germany where rents are smaller, but we need to decide in a few months where to search for this jobs. So, decision will be there when his mother is still alive and the house is in that unplanable state.

Honestly, I think you and your fiancee need to take a step back from this.

His father is in a deep untenable hole and one of his sons is seeming to merrily play along.

They want storage but are ignoring basic plumbing?

This is not healthy–nor is it safe. Having 3 adults and one shower is going to be taxing, especially since one is going to be disabled and may need hours a week to care for themselves. Having 5 adults–one who’s going to be ever further and further disabled–and one shower sounds like a nightmare. I have 3 brothers who are close in age to me. We all shared a bathroom. It required constant orchestration and a TON of respect.

It sounds like you are already being set up to get the “whatever” when everyone else gets what they need. Are you really willing to do that?

The mother’s cancer is unfortunate, but I think that it would be better to "love from a distance.

You hope to have children and it sounds like it would be a risky proposition to have them in this house. And it sounds like there are less than zero ways you can extricate yourself from this situation easily.

They have no plan but to rely on your fiancee’s rent to keep their heads above water.

If you choose to move in, you need a clear plan, a limited lease and an very clear way to get out when it’s good for you.

 

[alice24]

They have no plan but to rely on your fiancee’s rent to keep their heads above water.

This.
Problem is my fiancé feels resonsible. We talked and he said he would move out, and that he understands it is probably the best for him and us, but this dependence system was a well running system for years. He is sad and desperate now and I don´t know what to do, pushing him and saying “let´s move” or waiting at least until his mother dies, as harsh as it may sound.

 

[alice24]

Based on this and your other posts, your fiancé is not ready to be married and it would be a huge mistake to move forward with marriage to him.

Hard words…I get you don´t mean it harsh, but I don´t think it´s that bad. Moving out a situation of dependence of a full family, without strong support of friends, with a sick mother, is hard…

 

[1ke]

but I don´t think it´s that bad.

I do think it’s that bad. I think the whole picture, his friends and his family, his patterns of behavior are things you need to think seriously about.

 

[Xanthippe_Voorhees]

With children families spend more time with everyone in the family than they ever imagined and welcome the gatgering.

This is the ideal. However, life dosn’t always work that way.

The family already ill-uses this woman’s fiancee. They now want to lay down the law for her living there that sounds oppressive if not abusive.

 

[cmjmevans]

I think I’m clueless and haven’t understood this question from the beginning of the post. It sounds complicated. Sorry Dear.

 

[Xanthippe_Voorhees]

Xanthippe_Voorhees:

They have no plan but to rely on your fiancee’s rent to keep their heads above water.

This.
Problem is my fiancé feels resonsible. We talked and he said he would move out, and that he understands it is probably the best for him and us, but this dependence system was a well running system for years. He is sad and desperate now and I don´t know what to do, pushing him and saying “let´s move” or waiting at least until his mother dies, as harsh as it may sound.

Alice.

When you get married, you have the chance of having a child. Let’s just say it happened…didn’t plan for it…but it happened.

I want you to think of how much you love your pet and times that by 100. I want you to think of every inconvenience, danger, and inequity to you and times that by 100.

Even with perfect NFP—even with perfect ABC— children happen. Pregnancy is difficult as it is without living with a terminally ill person, an out-of-sync excentric and a resentful layabout. Nevermind once you have a baby.

Are you going to be expected to take out the dog at midnight just because you’re “already up” feeding the baby? Are you going to be expected to clean out litter boxes pregnant because MIL can’t, FIL won’t and BIL is nowhere to be seen and your husband’s working an ungodly number of hours to ensure that BIL gets his steak dinner?

The more you talk, the more the answer NEEDS to be no.

Your fiancee is insisting that you come live with him in his dysfunction. It’s as if you’re a barbie in a 10 yo’s dollhouse who’s getting married off because----reasons.

You stated he would leave for you.

Choose that path.

Get the most modest living arrangements you can find. Set aside money for visits and to provide food for your MIL.

What is immoral is his supporting three ADULTS who are choosing to do nothing (although, now, it’s two). We are called to be good stewards of what God gives to us. The last thing that God wants is for us to squander our time, money and energy. If this were just about the sick MIL, it’d be a different story…but there are two other people here–the FIL–who should be stepping up–and the BIL who’s basically stealing from his parents and his brother in order to live.

And yes, what the BIL is doing is stealing. He is taking from his parent’s resources and giving back nothing. He’s perhaps being enabled in his thievery, but it’s still wrong and immoral.

 

[Rosalie]

Living with in-laws can be a strain even if everyone involved gets along and is respectful. This is obviously not the case with this family. I would not move in with them, and you absolutely need to get this straightened out before getting married, even if it means delaying the wedding.

 

[Xantippe]

Finding a new house is difficult. First, they won´t leave, no one. No one can realy deal with financial issues, they planed to buy a highly riscant house next to them and make mutual modification on the house they think they “need” (storing rooms) before even making the second shower work. To be honest, I fear dealing in a finacial way with them. Father is to soft with fiancés brother and I think it will end in an desaster as no one is critical enough to see it won´t work.

You should be scared to death to have your finances mixed up with theirs.

I don’t quite understand the floor plan details, but it doesn’t sound like you’re going to get a lot of privacy, independence or respect. Also, the third floor stinks for your particular needs–it’s really bad if you have a dog to walk and if you get pregnant, the setup will be increasingly unworkable. Also, as a previous poster mentioned, the stage is set for you to become the putzfrau or the Wendy to their Lost Boys. If you agree, you’ll be Cinderella, and if you refuse, you’ll be the bad guy. Plus, it will be no picnic for your fiance, either–if he’s doing his job, he will need to be a buffer between you and all of this dysfunction.

With regard to your fiance’s mom, one night and one day a week would be a very generous amount from your fiance once you get married (or something like that). (She does, after all, have two other able-bodied adults living with her.) Is she getting appropriate in-home nursing help? I think your fiance should look into that if he hasn’t already, because from what you’ve said, the other family members don’t sound very organized or competent. You can provide food deliveries, do shopping, do errands, whatever–but from the privacy of your own home.

The financial stuff with your in-laws is hard. My best thought is for you to get a very small temporary apartment as close as you can and plan to help them out a little bit financially. Your fiance would need to warn his dad that he is doing what he can, but that this is short-term.

Like another pastor, I am also concerned about your fiance’s maturity, but hopefully he has many other wonderful qualities. This is going to be very taxing on him to speak up for both of you under such difficult circumstances. Be very kind to him, but make sure he says what needs to be said.

 

[Xantippe]

In a pinch, you can blame not moving in on realizing that it would be hard with so many of you and one working bathroom. That alone is huge.

 

[alice24]

Your fiancee is insisting that you come live with him in his dysfunction. It’s as if you’re a barbie in a 10 yo’s dollhouse who’s getting married off because----reasons.

You stated he would leave for you.

Choose that path.

Get the most modest living arrangements you can find. Set aside money for visits and to provide food for your MIL.

What I really fear is that he does this because I said him to do, even if he see the situation is not healthy. On the other side, I understand him when he says that it´s unfair how I act- when he says he will leave, I am not content, when he says he stays, I will go. Not really a win-win situation, I hoped he will grow and feel more free to decide things when we are allone… He´s in no way unsupportive, but I don´t know how to deal with the fact that he is probably not as independent as I wish.
The next thing is the reaction of his parents. I fear they would freak out, as FIL already took all my stuff into the house and I never said a word before - some things just weren´t that easy for me to see in the last weeks.

 

[alice24]

In a pinch, you can blame not moving in on realizing that it would be hard with so many of you and one working bathroom. That alone is huge.

They don´t get it. In my student appartment, we have one shower for 8 adults. They now this and think it´s far better in their house, what they don´t get is the lack of privacy. In the student appartment, there was more anonymity because everyone needs it.