STEM is incomplete

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tobias

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STEM (space, time, energy, matter) is supposed to account for everything that exist that reason can comprehend.

But it does not account for intelligenc.

What say you?
 
Atheists believe that STEM assembled due to undirected natural forces into an intelligent supercomputer that is capable of considering and solving the deepest secrets of existence. Seems pretty improbable to me…
 
tobias said:
STEM (space, time, energy, matter) is supposed to account for everything that exist that reason can comprehend.

But it does not account for intelligenc.

What say you?
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There are lots of things that are supposed to, but don’t.
 
tobias said:
STEM (space, time, energy, matter) is supposed to account for everything that exist that reason can comprehend.

But it does not account for intelligenc.

What say you?
Click to expand...
So has a proof behind it, or is it being taken axiomatically? 😛
 
tobias said:
STEM (space, time, energy, matter) is supposed to account for everything that exist that reason can comprehend.

But it does not account for intelligenc.

What say you?
Click to expand...
I think it does… No STEM no existence no intelligence. 😛
 
Intelligence is able to act contrary to the laws of STEM. How can it therefore be part of STEM?

No STEM, no existence, no intelligence.? I think you have it backwards. No intelligence, no STEM, no existence.

Without intelligence to interprete the sense of hearing there is no sound, only vibration. Without intelligence to intrprete the sense of sight there is no light, only rebounding of energy off of matter. Without intelligence to percieve temperature there is no hot and cold, only variance of energy. Without intelligence to percieve being there could only be movement of matter, for the matter that makes up the form of an intelligent being is still in motion when intelligence ceases to be the driving movement of said matter, therefore I would say existence is linked to intelligence.
 
Hmm… isn’t existence linked to God, regardless of our ability to comprehend it?
 
tobias said:
Intelligence is able to act contrary to the laws of STEM. How can it therefore be part of STEM?

No STEM, no existence, no intelligence.? I think you have it backwards. No intelligence, no STEM, no existence.

Without intelligence to interprete the sense of hearing there is no sound, only vibration. Without intelligence to intrprete the sense of sight there is no light, only rebounding of energy off of matter. Without intelligence to percieve temperature there is no hot and cold, only variance of energy. Without intelligence to percieve being there could only be movement of matter, for the matter that makes up the form of an intelligent being is still in motion when intelligence ceases to be the driving movement of said matter, therefore I would say existence is linked to intelligence.
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What kind of intelligence are you referring to? Divine Intelligence is eternal no STEM there; if you mean the intelligence of created beings then you need to have space, time, energy and matter.

As for the rest: If a tree falls in the forest and no one is around to hear it does it make a sound?
 
tobias said:
STEM (space, time, energy, matter) is supposed to account for everything that exist that reason can comprehend.

But it does not account for intelligenc.

What say you?
Click to expand...
First, I am very glad that my little acronym (STEM) is gaining acceptance.

Now why does it not account for intelligence? What do you mean by intelligence?
 
tobias said:
STEM (space, time, energy, matter) is supposed to account for everything that exist that reason can comprehend.

But it does not account for intelligenc.

What say you?
Click to expand...
First, I am very glad that my little acronym (STEM) is gaining acceptance.

Important to note: STEM does not negate the concept of information, nor the concept of emerging attributes. The intelligence (so far very loosely defined) does not have to be reduced to the dance of the electrons. Not even in principle.

After all, the properties of molecules cannot be reduced to the constituent atoms, yet no one appeals to a deity when pondering that the water molecules have certain attributes, which cannot be explained by having an oxygen atom and two hydrogen atoms. Sometines (though not always) the whole is more than just the sum of its parts.
 
ateista said:
First, I am very glad that my little acronym (STEM) is gaining acceptance.

Important to note: STEM does not negate the concept of information, nor the concept of emerging attributes. The intelligence (so far very loosely defined) does not have to be reduced to the dance of the electrons. Not even in principle.

After all, the properties of molecules cannot be reduced to the constituent atoms, yet no one appeals to a deity when pondering that the water molecules have certain attributes, which cannot be explained by having an oxygen atom and two hydrogen atoms. Sometines (though not always) the whole is more than just the sum of its parts.
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The point where theists would disagree is that “intelligence” may not emerge in the way it has to for knowledge to be meaningful, per atheism. It may emerge, certainly, but not necessarily in the way we might assume.
 
ateista said:
First, I am very glad that my little acronym (STEM) is gaining acceptance.
Click to expand...
I like it as well, because you don’t have to put the “energy and matter is the same” disclaimer whenever you talk about it.
 
Sarpedon said:
The point where theists would disagree is that “intelligence” may not emerge in the way it has to for knowledge to be meaningful, per atheism. It may emerge, certainly, but not necessarily in the way we might assume.
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Disagreement is fine. We all thrive on disagreements, don’t we? How boring it would be if we all agreed on everything? 🙂 Now what would be the reason for you to disagree?

Not to go into details, but “intelligence” has a tremendous survival value. Observation, conceptualization, hypothesis forming, prediction all help the individual to survive in a changing and sometimes hostile environment. It all “stems” (pardon the pun ;))from the biological “imperative” to survive.

Simple “built-in” reaction to outside stimuli is great, as we can observe with the most successful of all the species - namely the insects (as a whole, though not necessarily in distinct species) - but when the environment changes rapidly, those beings who have the capability of making predictions are at a definite advantage. Once the “spark” of intelligence emerges, it becomes a self-perpetuating attribute.
 
Wildgraywolf said:
As for the rest: If a tree falls in the forest and no one is around to hear it does it make a sound?
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As Klick and Klack (the Tappet brothers) once put it: “If a man is alone in a forest, and says something, and no woman is present… is he still wrong?” 🙂
 
tobias said:
STEM (space, time, energy, matter) is supposed to account for everything that exist that reason can comprehend.

But it does not account for intelligenc.

What say you?
Click to expand...
All of it was produced by the source of intelligence. Man, who has only limited and derivative intelligence, has difficulty comprehending many things. This is but one such example.
 
ateista said:
As Klick and Klack (the Tappet brothers) once put it: “If a man is alone in a forest, and says something, and no woman is present… is he still wrong?” 🙂
Click to expand...
Um… I’ll have to check with my wife and get back to you. :o
 
tobias said:
STEM (space, time, energy, matter) is supposed to account for everything that exist that reason can comprehend.

But it does not account for intelligenc.

What say you?
Click to expand...
How do you include intelligence in the equations concerning matter, energy, time and space?
 
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