Still Looking

[SonSearcher]

Who says the Earth is not the center of the universe??? Who defines what is “center” anyway??? God put us here. We aren’t going anywhere else anytime soon. So as far as I can see - for humans, and the Children of God…the Earth IS the center of our universe!!!
Don’t let science confuse you with unimportant details…

Why can’t we claim that the Church is exactly as Christ made it. Look at who he chose to start the Church!!! Fishermen, a tax collector, men who fought amongst themselves over who would be “first in the kingdom”. Men who denied and deserted Him at the passion.
Yes the Church has sinners and sinners can cause problems. But isn’t that exactly how Christ made it. The great advantage is that, in matters of teaching on faith and morals, the Church does not err.
Are there problems now? Yes. Mostly with people who like to call themselves Catholic but then flout church teaching.

Peace
James

Are you calling me a problem? I didn’t think I was flouting teaching just seeking deeper understanding.

 

[TimothyH]

1. The fact that you would even think about leaving the Catholic Church, changing from the Latin Church to an Eastern Church or to one of the Orthodox Churches, suggests to me that your conversion is still in progress. When one has reached that point of no return and no wavering, one tends to simply look at the faults and weaknesses of those around us as par for the course. The human condition is found everywhere. While the Church is perfect, human beings are not. I would stay put and give myself time to settle into the Church and ignore what everyone else is thinking right now. It sounds like you may not be ready to take on these battles yet.

This is what I was thinking. One year in the Church is still spiritul infancy. I don’t mean that in an insulting way, but there is often much healing which has to happen before we are healthy enough to change the world.

I would suggest cultivating a life of prayer first. We go nowhere without prayer.

-Tim-

 

[Scoobyshme]

But in the past the Church has been wrong in some of Her teachings, such as the Earth is the center of the universe teaching. But the Church moved on from that and accepted that it was wrong at some point. There should be discussions about this. How do we say we are right on everything and say it is a teaching of the Church when Christ never said the Earth is the center or on the outskirts?

We can’t claim the Church through the years is exactly as Christ made it. But eventually He works through it to correct problems. Take Luther’s theses, it was posted and then dealt with by the Council of Trent. So the Church fixed apparent problems then, are there any right now?

Actually, the Church never declared a “doctrine” on the Earth being the center of the universe. And, the Church has never changed any of the doctrines handed on to her by Christ, because the Church has received her doctrines from Christ, and does not claim the authority to correct Him.

The Church was established by Christ. It is a living, Divine entity. It is the Body of Christ. Do not be confused. There have also always been sinful men within it, both within the hierarchy (start with the Apostles!) and the laity. There is no infallible claim to matters of discipline or administration, but there is with regard to the doctrines of the Church.

 

[James924]

I get ya on that. Then how do we know without doubt that all of us don’t just believe a certain way about a certain subject is just how “everybody thinks” right now?

And of course I am not speaking about Catholics as a whole checking out of the world, because it seems Catholics do well when it says you must not be of the world.

BTW what is hypostatic union?

Fortunately the church is always very explicit about what it is infallibly teaching vs what might just be a consensus. The Pope might even declare what soccer team he thinks is best in the world, but it will be clear that that is not an actual doctrine of the church.

The Hypostatic union is the union of Christ’s two natures (Human and Divine) in one person. I’m sure someone with more theological authority might be able to explain it more thoroughly.

 

[Anniejoe]

Sonsearcher,

My patron saint, St. Edith Stein, said “All who seek truth are seeking God”. To me, you sound like a sincere seeker of truth. I agree with the poster who suggested that the enemy is trying to draw you away.

Since your RCIA left a lot to be desired (a common complaint), maybe you need to begin a serious self-study program. A sympathetic priest or spiritual director can guide you, but you could start with some of the excellent books by Scott Hahn and Brad Pitre. It sounds to me as if you really need to learn more about Catholic teachings. I wouldn’t pay much attention to the attitudes of my friends. Your relationship with Christ is much more important; try focusing on that for a while.

 

[JRKH]

Are you calling me a problem? I didn’t think I was flouting teaching just seeking deeper understanding.

No I was not calling you a problem. It is good that you are seeking deeper understanding

It is a problem though, and a barrier to communication, when people read into posts things that are not there. If I have something to direct specifically to you, I will do so.

You asked if the Church has problems. Yes it does. In fact you reference it in your opening post. One of the problems that YOU have is with people who do not understand Church teaching. Add to this, the ones who openly flaunt teachings on contraception and abortion, like HHS secretary Selebius (sp?)…

The Church’s teachings are good and they are sound, protected as they are by Christ Himself, our Lord and King. How much better our world would be if more Catholics would seek deeper understanding and live in obedience to our Lord and King in His Church. What a force for good that would be.

Peace
James

 

[SonSearcher]

No I was not calling you a problem. It is good that you are seeking deeper understanding

It is a problem though, and a barrier to communication, when people read into posts things that are not there. If I have something to direct specifically to you, I will do so.

You asked if the Church has problems. Yes it does. In fact you reference it in your opening post. One of the problems that YOU have is with people who do not understand Church teaching. Add to this, the ones who openly flaunt teachings on contraception and abortion, like HHS secretary Selebius (sp?)…

The Church’s teachings are good and they are sound, protected as they are by Christ Himself, our Lord and King. How much better our world would be if more Catholics would seek deeper understanding and live in obedience to our Lord and King in His Church. What a force for good that would be.

Peace
James

Sorry You are about as touchy about this as I am. I agree completely and thank you for sharing.

 

[JRKH]

Sorry You are about as touchy about this as I am. I agree completely and thank you for sharing.

Perhaps I am a bit touchy. But I’ve been through this before.
I am very careful in how I post. I do not “imply”. If I need to make a statement of a personal nature, you will know it.

Peace
James

 

[SonSearcher]

Perhaps I am a bit touchy. But I’ve been through this before.
I am very careful in how I post. I do not “imply”. If I need to make a statement of a personal nature, you will know it.

Peace
James

I hear ya. I have been reading posts on here for quite some time, and seen some sarcastic remarks, and it usually doesn’t translate well into written language. I apologize for jumping to a conclusion. You seem to be very careful in your wording.

 

[Annabelle_Marie]

Hey y’all,

Just hoping to find some answers to some questions about Catholicism. I feel that when I went through RCIA last year I was poorly catechized. I was brought up Catholic but walked away when I was confirmation age.

I feel my faith wavering at times. Not wavering from Christ, but the Church. Please be sensitive to me too guys I have read some harsh stuff here before. I understand that Jesus is truly in the Eucharist, but it is in the practice that I dissent.

I guess not the actual practice of Catholicism as much. I feel a portion of my old self has died which is good,(died in Christ) but I am less compassionate when I look at most of my Catholic friends at Church. They are all pro-war, very rabidly against homosexuality(I have several members in my family who are gay), and they don’t necessarily give any particular care towards the Earth in general. Let me clarify, I am not saying I am less compassionate to them, I fall right in line with them and begin subscribing to their ideals. Whether politically motivated or socially motivated or religiously motivated.

Now my problem is this how do I detach myself from these people that surround me and continue to be Catholic? Do I change parishes? Tell them where I disagree? Do I leave Catholicism altogether? Maybe eastern Catholicism? Maybe Orthodoxy? Do I try to change their minds? I feel (and maybe thats my problem, feelings are not reality most times) that we as Catholics don’t show people the Love that Jesus spoke of that would really show the world we were his disciples. We stick to our guns(issues not the weapons) and our Church and argue with the rest of humanity that they are wrong and we are right. The world people don’t necessarily perceive Love in our Church, just argumentative folks who have checked out and guarantee our own righteousness.

I apologize for the long post. But I hope I can get some words that will explain some things. Jesus is the Man with the master plan and I am sure He has something to say to me through you all.

I have that problem with some fellow Catholics…hey we are all human. It’s just that they are all Republican all the time…even if those Republican are NOT pro-life. I just distance myself from them and when they start talking about it…I keep quiet. It doesn’t matter if they think I am for those canidates or not…who cares what they think or the world thinks?

We all have our conversion…and people have different problems then others. BTW…you will find this in other churches as well. I would spend time in prayer and adoration…Christ will never steer you wrong.

 

[tradcatjen]

Change their minds?..about homosexuality?

wow…way to help someone with their questions. just…wow.

 

[SonSearcher]

wow…way to help someone with their questions. just…wow.

He is all good. no probs. we moved past it, he actually turned out to be quite helpful. no worries.

 

[tradcatjen]

Mostly the attitude of most parishioners. I have been told by multiple priests that I should be finding a different attitude among the parishioners but have found all but one unified political and social mindset (which could be good but sometimes dangerous).

and also the complete acceptance of their teaching on homosexuality is difficult for me to subscribe to. It is just too personal.

Look…you can’t do much about the way others think and what others say. That’s just life. What you can do is leave it up to God to judge another’s actions and deeds. In the end…it’s only God who decides people’s eternity, not the people sitting next to you in mass. I have my own difficulties with questions I have about the Church…but I also know this is where I am supposed to be because this is where God has led me. All that matters is if we are in the state of Sanctifying grace. That’s it. Nothing else matters. God will take care of everything else…he always does.

Your job is to be a faithful Catholic, to fight the battles that try your faith and to follow the examples of the saints who have lived before you and have had to fight their own battles, whatever those may have been. The one thing I know is that being a Catholic is not easy. If it were, everyone would be Catholic and the Catholic Church would have no enemies. Which means we are doing something right because in general, when it comes to religion, no one like the hard ways and will despise anything that makes us sacrifice a part of our selves for God.

It’s not up to you to change people’s minds or figure out what they think about or why they think that way. I would have given up on the Church a long time ago if I worried about some of the things that have crossed my path.

Don’t give up on the Church because of another person’s judgements, opinions or condemnations…please realize that God, in his mercy, is the ultimate judge. He decides, in the end, what is to be. No one else.

That’s my 2 cents.

 

[SaintPatrick333]

Mostly the attitude of most parishioners. I have been told by multiple priests that I should be finding a different attitude among the parishioners but have found all but one unified political and social mindset (which could be good but sometimes dangerous).

and also the complete acceptance of their teaching on homosexuality is difficult for me to subscribe to. It is just too personal.

As has been suggested before you’re going to Mass for Christ my friend, not for the parishioners. Living the faith is very difficult. We should “all” be against homosexuality but NOT at the expense to the dignity of homosexual persons. Showing love to someone does not mean supporting or turning a blind eye to their sin. It also doesn’t mean condemning them either. It’s hard for many people to strike that appropriate balance the Church points out, primarily because it’s such a social issue for us in society today. But don’t let your parishioners ruin your experience. You aren’t at Mass to receive your parishioners or their opinions. You’re there to receive the Lord in the Eucharist. If you absolutely must try seeking out another parish (personally my parish is phenomenal, VERY loving community and I haven’t come across any of that so those parishes are out there). But don’t let the actions or personal beliefs of others separate you from your Lord! God Bless!

 

[James924]

wow…way to help someone with their questions. just…wow.

Apologized and moved on from this about 35 posts ago. Thanks for joining the conversation and digging up old news, great way to start a flame war.

 

[SonSearcher]

Apologized and moved on from this about 35 posts ago. Thanks for joining the conversation and digging up old news, great way to start a flame war.

Said the same very thing. I mean… wow… not helpful, just…wow.

 

[James924]

Said the same very thing. I mean… wow… not helpful, just…wow.