Stop the Solo's in the Liturgical Music!

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NotWorthy

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I went to a Mass at another church other than my own parish this weekend. There was this lady singing in the choir that had a beautiful voice. She sang some beautiful songs throughout the Mass, but hardly anyone sang along with her. I for my part, didn’t recognize several of the songs, especially the “Gloria”, the “Holy, Holy, Holy”, and the “Christ has Died”. I’m sorry if I don’t know the proper Latin names for these prayers.

My point is, these are prayers for all of the faithful to sing! This isn’t American Idol!

Am I the only one that feels this way? I really enjoy Liturgical Music, but I strongly feel it should be all inclusive, except maybe for the Meditation after Communion. I hope I’m not being overly sensitive about this.

What are your thoughts?

Thanks,

NotWorthy (But wanting so sing along).

P.S. My brother used to be a Priest, but he couldn’t carry a tune in a bucket. He would tell the congregation that, unless they sang loud enough to drown him out, they’d have to put up with his off-key voice. They’d end up shaking the rafters with their combined voices, hoping it would overcome the cacophy coming from the altar!
 
Most modern liturgical music is of the OCP variety (Oregon Catholic Press) which means it is tuneless, unsingable dreck.

The congregation has no choice but to sit back and listen to the choir or soloist sing, because only a trained professional could make sense of it.

Until we return to traditional hymns, or get some modern writers capable of producing proper congregational hymns, we’re stuck with “Gather Us In” and other aural horrors. :bigyikes:
 
I sometimes agree with you on “Gather Us In”. At some churches, it is mindless drivel. But at our Cathedral, I used to really enjoy the choir belting that song out to open the Mass.

But what really gets my goat, is the parts of the Mass that are sung as solo’s. These are prayers, and should have full participation!!! Don’t get me wrong, at my home parish, these parts are sung in a way that I love to sing along with. But if these prayers are sung in a way that the congretation can not accompany, then they should be said instead of sung.

NotWorthy
 
In our church everyone just sings stuff from the Catholic Book of Worship.

members.aol.com/diosg2/

That’s a link to a page with the songs on it. It’s provided by the St. George’s Diocese in Newfoundland which recently had to sell all of it’s assets (aside from cemeteries) to pay for sex abuse scandal settlements.
 
Agreed 100% wiht your post.

At my home parish, the choir isn’t - eh - all that good to begin with (trying to be charitable here). But there’s an extra bonus, they like to do that thing where half of the chorus is singing one thing, the other half another thing…kind of like the ol’ “row row row your boat” from grammer school. Now if you can just imagine this scenerio…singers who aren’t good now doing a dual chorus or whatever. The congregation is distracted at best and unable to sing along…or at worst, trying to keep from laughing.

Now I’m not trying to personally riducule the chorus at my hope parish, and God bless them for their efforts. But no one seems to have the heart to tell them just how really bad they are.

Must be the price to pay for having one of the best rock-solid homilists in the diocese for a pastor.

Peace in Christ,

DustinsDad
Dr. Bombay:
Most modern liturgical music is of the OCP variety (Oregon Catholic Press) which means it is tuneless, unsingable dreck.

The congregation has no choice but to sit back and listen to the choir or soloist sing, because only a trained professional could make sense of it.

Until we return to traditional hymns, or get some modern writers capable of producing proper congregational hymns, we’re stuck with “Gather Us In” and other aural horrors. :bigyikes:
Click to expand...
 
NotWorthy,
You are not the only one who feels this way! I also love to sing, and when we are treated to a “performance” I just sing along anyway. If our choir is singing, and has not invited the congregation to join in, I look up the song, and sing. I’m not belting it out, but I really can’t help myself. If I can’t find the song, I will hum. I try not to irritate the people around me. A couple of weeks ago I heard someone else doing the same thing, and I turned around to see my sister sitiing behind me!

Be grateful, though, for those soloists who have nice voices. We have a woman at our parish who has a horrible voice, and she jumps at the chance to do any solo. She cultivates her own unique style of singing, which can be described as moaning.
 
Dr. Bombay, you have said it very well. The music in our liturgy, thanks to organizations like OCP, is just awful. I have to admit I DO NOT sing along with the choir as I would prefer to meditate on the Mass rather than participate in the music…thus my “active participation” is not what the liturgists envision so some might not consider my action correct, i.e. not the orientation to the Novus Ordo that would be considered proper.

To which I say…so what. When they restore liturgical music, I’ll reconsider.
 
I have sung in our cathedral choir for years. Some choral music is written for both choir and soloist. Could this have been the cantor singing or have I misunderstood?
 
Your thread has convinced me to make everything more singable. I think this Sunday we will enter and recess on Kum Ba Yah. To change things up I will use Peace is Flowing Like a River.

(Before I get strung up by a posse, I have never used either song)

One of the greatest reasons songs are unsingable is the range. I transpose the music to keep it below C. Another problem is the rate at which new songs are introduced. We strive for 2-4 a year at my parish, although one musician does their own thing and puts way too much new stuff in.

Some songs (mostly of the Haugen-Haus variety) are are singable without a lot of repetition. These songs (I do not call them hymns) are not used.
 
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NotWorthy:
I went to a Mass at another church other than my own parish this weekend. There was this lady singing in the choir that had a beautiful voice. She sang some beautiful songs throughout the Mass, but hardly anyone sang along with her. I for my part, didn’t recognize several of the songs, especially the “Gloria”, the “Holy, Holy, Holy”, and the “Christ has Died”. I’m sorry if I don’t know the proper Latin names for these prayers.

My point is, these are prayers for all of the faithful to sing! This isn’t American Idol!

Am I the only one that feels this way? I really enjoy Liturgical Music, but I strongly feel it should be all inclusive, except maybe for the Meditation after Communion. I hope I’m not being overly sensitive about this.

What are your thoughts?

Thanks,

NotWorthy (But wanting so sing along).

P.S. My brother used to be a Priest, but he couldn’t carry a tune in a bucket. He would tell the congregation that, unless they sang loud enough to drown him out, they’d have to put up with his off-key voice. They’d end up shaking the rafters with their combined voices, hoping it would overcome the cacophy coming from the altar!
Click to expand...
Good point! For years we sang the Gloria in a certain manner. It BOOMED throughout the church. Everyone sang a long, the singing was doing its job – preparing us for the Sacrifice at Calvary.

In the last year we have had 4-5 different tunes. Few people sing anymore, it’s most a trio that sings. It’s very sad.
 
Dr. Bombay:
Most modern liturgical music is of the OCP variety (Oregon Catholic Press) which means it is tuneless, unsingable dreck.

The congregation has no choice but to sit back and listen to the choir or soloist sing, because only a trained professional could make sense of it.

Until we return to traditional hymns, or get some modern writers capable of producing proper congregational hymns, we’re stuck with “Gather Us In” and other aural horrors. :bigyikes:
Click to expand...
Er, ‘dreck’ is a naughty yiddish word meaning s%&t, my friend. What would Jesus’ mother say??? :tsktsk: :ehh: :hmmm:

P.S. I agree that there is a lot of saccherine dreck out there. :cool:
 
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WhiteDove:
Er, ‘dreck’ is a naughty yiddish word meaning s%&t, my friend. What would Jesus’ mother say??? :tsktsk: :ehh: :hmmm:

P.S. I agree that there is a lot of saccherine dreck out there. :cool:
Click to expand...
“Dreck” means “dirt” or “mud” in German.
 
Pariah Pirana said:
“Dreck” means “dirt” or “mud” in German.
Click to expand...

I was always told it meant s&%t, but I could be wrong… Webster says it means trash or rubbish… 🙂
 
To use a good yiddish word from this site, I would say that some modern liturgical music is schmaltzy… 🙂

SCHMALTZ: Literally chicken fat. Usually refers to overly emotional and sentimental behavior
 
Hay, all.
I really want to join in on this thread so please don’t let it be hijacked befort I can get my dos centavos in, o.k.(?). Time today does not allow me to formulate a reply this thread demands. Not defense of the music or solosts, merely (hopefully) constructive (name removed by moderator)ut on how to handle those liturgical earsores.
:hmmm:
 
But, there is way too much kvetching that goes on on this venerable site. 🙂 Lots of shmegeggesies here, with nothing better to do… 😃 Everyone here is sucha maven… :rolleyes: but they end up being a total noodge in the end… 😉 So, instead of being a nudnik, be a mensch!

**KVETCH: To annoy or to be an annoying person, to complain. **

**SHMEGEGGE: A petty person, an untalented person. **

**MAVEN: An expert, a connoisseur. **

**NOODGE: To bother, to push, a person who bothers you. **

**NUDNIK: A pest, a persistent and annoying person. **

**MENSCH: A person of character. An individual of recognized worth because of noble values or actions. **
 
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WhiteDove:
I was always told it meant s&%t, but I could be wrong… Webster says it means trash or rubbish… 🙂
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We’ll be kind to you and assume s&%t stood for “soot”. That way both of ya’ll are satisfied. Of course two Hail Mary’s for the one who thought S&%t was naughty!

NotWorthy
 
Back to the original point, though! The songs may be a matter of taste and tradition. I’ve got less of a problem with that, and more of a problem with a choir that will sing the Liturgical Prayers (i.e. the Gloria, the Holy-Holy-Holy, Christ Has Died…, etc.) in a way that does not encourage Parish Participation. Until I see Paula Abdul and Simon Cowell as part of the Church Magesterium, I do not consider Mass as a spectator sport.

I relinquish control of the soap box, and remain NotWorthy.
 
It’s ok to have solos for some things. Many of the sacred choral works from the classical period and later have solos in them, and there are tons of sacred solos as well. They shouldn’t be put on a shelf in a music library, and left to collect dust, or only be performed by high school, college and professional soloists and choirs- they should be used in church- that’s what they were written for! There shouldn’t be so many solos that it looks like the soloist is just showing off though.
 
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