Strange occurrence during prayer

[Karen10]

ThisOne:

Some of this activity, which I discovered by observing my own body, is actually what we usually call self-stimulation. When I realized what I was doing, I was horrified and stopped. Women, especially, I am sure are not aware of this because the effect is very subtle. Yet it is real. In other words, foot tapping, leg moving, and so forth, are forms of masturbation, though a person may well not be aware of it. Young women should be encouraged not to do it, without explicit mention of sex.

I think your body must be set up a little different than most, because that took me quite aback. I can honestly say that’s not stimulating activity in any way. It’s just fidgeting, like sometimes I tap my fingers or twirl my hair. Such activity has never made me hot and bothered or feel any sensation in that other area. How can tapping your toes, which is way down at the ankle joint, do anything in *that *region? Yikes, are you able to walk without getting excited?

 

[ThisOne]

Karen10:

I think your body must be set up a little different than most, because that took me quite aback. I can honestly say that’s not stimulating activity in any way. It’s just fidgeting, like sometimes I tap my fingers or twirl my hair. Such activity has never made me hot and bothered or feel any sensation in that other area. How can tapping your toes, which is way down at the ankle joint, do anything in *that *region? Yikes, are you able to walk without getting excited?

Muscle movement in the legs and feet cannot take place without the participation of other muscles higher up in the body and closer to the spinal column. Yes, twirling hair and tapping fingers is a different ballgame entirely. But swinging crossed legs or any movement of the entire leg when legs are crossed or even movement of just the foot with legs crossed can stimulate other parts of the body. And no, I am not anatomically abnormal. I think with a little self-observation, you will discover that I am not mad.

In an earlier post, I mentioned the rocking phenomenon itself, and I think we agree on that, but I pointed out its origin in the body. It’s soothing because we remember it from our nine months in the womb.

 

[Karen10]

ThisOne:

Muscle movement in the legs and feet cannot take place without the participation of other muscles higher up in the body and closer to the spinal column. Yes, twirling hair and tapping fingers is a different ballgame entirely. But swinging crossed legs or any movement of the entire leg when legs are crossed or even movement of just the foot with legs crossed can stimulate other parts of the body. And no, I am not anatomically abnormal. I think with a little self-observation, you will discover that I am not mad.

In an earlier post, I mentioned the rocking phenomenon itself, and I think we agree on that, but I pointed out its origin in the body. It’s soothing because we remember it from our nine months in the womb.

Hey, I do think we’re different. I’m not saying this to get at you, but I’ve been testing this out and I feel nothing in the way of excitement–hardly anything at all. For this reason I think it’s absurd to say *“In other words, foot tapping, leg moving, and so forth, are forms of masturbation, though a person may well not be aware of it. Young women should be encouraged not to do it, without explicit mention of sex.” *If it causes you a problem such that you feel yourself having a good time down there, don’t do it. I don’t have this problem. I don’t even feel anything down there when I’m tapping my toes. N-A-D-A. I can’t believe I’m having this conversation.

Even if I did feel something, you’re allowed to feel if you have nerves there. It doesn’t necessarily mean you’re getting excited or enjoying it, because not all sensations are arousing. Otherwise you’d never ride in a car, use a tampon, nobody would ride motorcycles, or even walk and sit. We’d just be lying down all the time.

 

[ThisOne]

Karen10:

Hey, I do think we’re different. I’m not saying this to get at you, but I’ve been testing this out and I feel nothing in the way of excitement–hardly anything at all. For this reason I think it’s absurd to say *“In other words, foot tapping, leg moving, and so forth, are forms of masturbation, though a person may well not be aware of it. Young women should be encouraged not to do it, without explicit mention of sex.” *If it causes you a problem such that you feel yourself having a good time down there, don’t do it. I don’t have this problem. I don’t even feel anything down there when I’m tapping my toes. N-A-D-A. I can’t believe I’m having this conversation.

Even if I did feel something, you’re allowed to feel if you have nerves there. It doesn’t necessarily mean you’re getting excited or enjoying it, because not all sensations are arousing. Otherwise you’d never ride in a car, use a tampon, nobody would ride motorcycles, or even walk and sit. We’d just be lying down all the time. I think you must get actually frisky a lot more easily than most people.

I made no personal judgments or evaluations of you, Karen, and I think your doing so to me is entirely and completely inappropriate. If you disagree with my ideas, fine. But ad hominems are not permitted here, I don’t think.

 

[Karen10]

ThisOne:

I made no personal judgments or evaluations of you, Karen, and I think your doing so to me is entirely and completely inappropriate. If you disagree with my ideas, fine. But ad hominems are not permitted here, I don’t think.

I don’t think I made any personal judgments, did I? I just have a hypothesis that you get frisky more easily, which would explain why you’re dead wrong about what must happen to my body when I fidget. I’m not going to say “I disagree with what you say happens to my body” when I know you’re dead wrong about what happens to my body. I did say that to make such a blanket statement about all women in the way of masturbating when they’re fidgeting is an absurd statement, based on what only happens to YOU.

 

[ThisOne]

But I am not the only one who’s saying it. There’s plenty of references to it in the psychological literature, of which you may not be aware, but here’s just one laywoman’s account. Search for “crossed” on this page:

cakenyc.com/cbsolitaire.html

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Your personal comments about me continue to be unwarranted. The closest thing I said to anything directly about you personally was this, and it was very clearly not accusing you of anything: “I think with a little self-observation, you will discover that I am not mad.”

I said “I think,” and your response could easily have been, “I think you are mistaken” instead of the choices you continue to make to continually characterize me personally.

 

[Karen10]

ThisOne:

But I am not the only one who’s saying it. There’s plenty of references to it in the psychological literature, of which you may not be aware, but here’s just one laywoman’s account. Search for “crossed” on this page:

cakenyc.com/cbsolitaire.html

Here’s what it says, and I agree with you that it is disgusting:

One time, by using the seam on the crotch of my jeans and carefully crossed legs, I “pleasured myself” in the middle of a physics lecture by swinging my legs. I guess the laws of gravity can really get a girl hot!!

This is supposedly a woman who intentionally pleasured herself by using the crotch of her jeans, probably scooting in just such a position for maximum effect. This is apples and oranges. And I hope you do not mistsake this for anything “scientific”, as if this even might hint that there is more scientific evidence out there to support your position. There’s more scientific evidence that men are friskier because of the external nature of their organ, and by your standards, they should hardly move their legs at all, lest they accidentally “masturbate”.

You cannot make an comparison about anyone innocently fidgeting and who could be wearing anything and someone who is intentionally saying, “Ohh, I think I’ll use the stiff threaded crotch of my jeans to have a good time” and who deliberately positions herself in order to do it. I know that you’re saying that it is possible to accidentally turn yourself on because it has happened to yourself. I’m glad you recognized a problem and I will acknowledge it based on what you say. I won’t dare to “disagree” with what you state is a fact about yourself. But even if it’s possible in some cases, it’s certainly not what most women have in mind when they’re just kicking out a little extra energy. Some just have high metabolisms and can’t sit completely still without fidgeting with something.

I’m just saying, it’s absurd to assume this must happen to everyone, based upon the nasty blog article you posted where it’s a whole other thing what this woman is doing, and maybe you’re reading too much secular media where sex is overemphasized, and where women are made to feel ashamed if they’re NOT turned on by the caricatures of ever-frisky “women” ever-present in entertainment media. The same media who wants us all to believe X Y and Z really really turn women on, when we know better.

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ThisOne:

Your personal comments about me continue to be unwarranted. The closest thing I said to anything directly about you personally was this, and it was very clearly not accusing you of anything: “I think with a little self-observation, you will discover that I am not mad.”

I said “I think,” and your response could easily have been, “I think you are mistaken” instead of the choices you continue to make to continually characterize me personally.

I still do not see that I’ve made any personal attack on your character. Please, could you be more specific? It was never my intention and although I don’t know why you think so, I’m sad that you think that was my intention. I’m just pointing out some flaws I see in your claim, is all.

I think you might be too sensitive to the word “absurd” when I say that I do think it’s absurd to say, “Women should be discouraged” and “It’s a form of masturbation” based on no evidence other than what shaking your leg does to yourself. And I’m not going to say, “This One, I disagree with what you think I’m doing when I shake my leg”, because “disagree” and “agree” are terms used in matter of opinions, not facts. You don’t get an opinion on what’s happening in my own personal observation when I know what the facts about me are. Only I know, and you don’t, and I’m saying for a fact that you’re wrong about at least some women, if not most.

 

[Catherine_Grant]

Thanks to all who participated in this discussion.

As it has been sufficiently answered, this thread is now closed.