Struggling to trust the Church

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Last night, I got into a Facebook debate with a “mad-trad” who went on the typical screed of the popes, Vatican II, and the Ordinary Form being evil, masonic counterfeits. When I shared an article by Dave Armstrong that shows Pope Francis is pro-orthodoxy and against Modernism, he dismissed it as “lies from Satan’s but hole”.

I know his kind are wrong; if they’re right, then it means Jesus went back on His promise of “the gates of hell will not prevail” and “I am with you always”. At the risk of sounding uncharitable, I don’t think they’re very bright, either. When they start accusing popes JPII and Paul VI of being secretly Jews, Masons, atheists, Muslims, and communists all at once, I know they don’t have both oars in the water.

However, I can’t shake the fear of, “what if they are right?” Even when I stay away from those websites or Facebook pages, this worry intrudes my every waking thought. I don’t talk to family or friends about this, because I’m certain they will have no idea what I’m talking about.

It’s starting to make me worry about my church friends and whether they espouse heresy. I don’t know who to trust anymore. And it makes me toe the line of Jansenist despair, that all people will go to hell.

What can I do about this? Why am I worrying about ideas that I know are so patently divorced from reality that they don’t deserve my time or attention?
 
JackVk said:
this worry intrudes my every waking thought.

What can I do about this?
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Worrying about what other people think about the Church every waking moment isn’t healthy. It’s obsession.

Do you have hobbies? Why not ride a bike or take up fishing or dance lessons or a bowling league or something?

-Tim-
 
JackVk said:
However, I can’t shake the fear of, “what if they are right?” Even when I stay away from those websites or Facebook pages, this worry intrudes my every waking thought. I don’t talk to family or friends about this, because I’m certain they will have no idea what I’m talking about.

It’s starting to make me worry about my church friends and whether they espouse heresy. I don’t know who to trust anymore.
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When worries come into your head, please don’t ask yourself who is right and who is wrong. None of us really and truly understand the mystery that is God. What you CAN do is ask yourself if you love God. Are you caring for His people the best you can? Are you being the person God has asked you to be? And then you put it all in His hands.
 
Speaking purely as an ordinary traditional fringe Catholic - which probably disqualifies me - I say Pope Francis is utterly reliable.
 
FB is a den of conspiracy theorists.
Forget it. Be at peace.
 
Praying to the Holy Spirit to give you guidance, direction, strength, fortitude & wisdom in your time of need.
 
In a nutshell (pun unintentional, but worth it!)

Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest thou also be like unto him. —Proverbs 26:4
 
pianistclare said:
FB is a den of conspiracy theorists.
Forget it. Be at peace.
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Agree with this ^^^

It sounds to me like you very much need to avoid Facebook, or at least avoid getting into debates with non-believers on Facebook. You should focus on strengthening your faith by reading and interacting with Catholics of orthodox beliefs and not heretics.
 
The following site is good at answering many ultra-traditionalist claims:
matt1618.freeyellow.com/TRADIT.html

On top of that, consider that St. Padre Pio and many other holy souls were obedient to Bl. Pope Paul VI and subsequent Popes. Take *St. *John Paul II, for example; he was greatly admired by the mystic Symphorose Chopin; he was seen in a prophetic vision by Bl. Blessed Bartolo Longo; he was chosen by Mary, according to Ven. Marthe Robin; he was perhaps alluded to in the writings of St. Faustina…

I could add similar things, but there is no need. If there is ever an anti-Pope, it will be evident to all souls of good-will; such a thing could only happen during a time of such chaos and unrest that it would be virtually impossible to elect a Pope.

Be at peace, knowing that your desire to seek the truth (and therefore God) comes from Him. “I am the light of the world: he that followeth me, walketh not in darkness, but shall have the light of life.” (Jn. 8:12) Yes, there is much scandal in the Church today; yes, there is much liturgical abuse; but let none of these things distract you from the truth that Jesus is present in the Tabernacle.

God bless.
 
JackVk said:
Last night, I got into a Facebook debate with a “mad-trad” who went on the typical screed of the popes, Vatican II, and the Ordinary Form being evil, masonic counterfeits. When I shared an article by Dave Armstrong that shows Pope Francis is pro-orthodoxy and against Modernism, he dismissed it as “lies from Satan’s but hole”.

I know his kind are wrong; if they’re right, then it means Jesus went back on His promise of “the gates of hell will not prevail” and “I am with you always”. At the risk of sounding uncharitable, I don’t think they’re very bright, either. When they start accusing popes JPII and Paul VI of being secretly Jews, Masons, atheists, Muslims, and communists all at once, I know they don’t have both oars in the water.

However, I can’t shake the fear of, “what if they are right?” Even when I stay away from those websites or Facebook pages, this worry intrudes my every waking thought. I don’t talk to family or friends about this, because I’m certain they will have no idea what I’m talking about.

It’s starting to make me worry about my church friends and whether they espouse heresy. I don’t know who to trust anymore. And it makes me toe the line of Jansenist despair, that all people will go to hell.

What can I do about this? Why am I worrying about ideas that I know are so patently divorced from reality that they don’t deserve my time or attention?
Click to expand...
I suggest staying away from those sites AND getting help for scrupulous/obsessive thoughts.
 
JackVk said:
Last night, I got into a Facebook debate with a “mad-trad” who went on the typical screed of the popes, Vatican II, and the Ordinary Form being evil, masonic counterfeits. When I shared an article by Dave Armstrong that shows Pope Francis is pro-orthodoxy and against Modernism, he dismissed it as “lies from Satan’s but hole”.

I know his kind are wrong; if they’re right, then it means Jesus went back on His promise of “the gates of hell will not prevail” and “I am with you always”. At the risk of sounding uncharitable, I don’t think they’re very bright, either. When they start accusing popes JPII and Paul VI of being secretly Jews, Masons, atheists, Muslims, and communists all at once, I know they don’t have both oars in the water.

However, I can’t shake the fear of, “what if they are right?” Even when I stay away from those websites or Facebook pages, this worry intrudes my every waking thought. I don’t talk to family or friends about this, because I’m certain they will have no idea what I’m talking about.

It’s starting to make me worry about my church friends and whether they espouse heresy. I don’t know who to trust anymore. And it makes me toe the line of Jansenist despair, that all people will go to hell.

What can I do about this? Why am I worrying about ideas that I know are so patently divorced from reality that they don’t deserve my time or attention?
Click to expand...
Use the next Lent to fast from FB, and hopefully you will realize the worthlessness of that uber-wordly program, and end participation in it for good.
 
Deus_tecum said:
Use the next Lent to fast from FB, and hopefully you will realize the worthlessness of that uber-wordly program, and end participation in it for good.
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Why wait for lent?

again he sets a certain day, “Today,” saying through David so long afterward, in the words already quoted, “Today, if you hear his voice, harden not your hearts.” (Hebrews 4:7)

-Tim-
 
JackVk said:
I know his kind are wrong; if they’re right, then it means Jesus went back on His promise of “the gates of hell will not prevail” and “I am with you always”.
Click to expand...
How was the smoke of Satan able to enter the church?
 
As a Lutheran, I’d ask you “Ae you receiving the Gospel and the Sacraments at your Catholic Church?”

If you can answer “Yes!” then be at ease. Don’t let a sower of bad seeds allow their seed to take root in your mind.
 
Please forgive my trifling understanding of scripture but I have always wondered why Jesus used the equivalent phrase “…gates of hell…”?
Could anyone please take pity upon this simple, truth seeking soul and enlighten me?
May God bless you, yours, and all who seek him.
 
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