Suicide

[laylow]

Do you think God will forgive suicide? No one wants to suicide, but I think some people get very desperate. The bible does not specially condemn it, and there seems to be many worse sins out there, since again, like I said, very few actually WANT to end their life.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

Do you think God will forgive suicide? No one wants to suicide, but I think some people get very desperate. The bible does not specially condemn it, and there seems to be many worse sins out there, since again, like I said, very few actually WANT to end their life.

1. I think it can be forgiven through the same reasoning as other sins. Of course confession is out… but perhaps perfect contrition, though that might be hard.
2. Some people do want to commit suicide. But some may not meet the qualifications of mortal sin. Grave matter is met but knowledge and full will may be not met.
3. Have you ever read the Bible? It specifically condemns it. It’s in the Ten Commandments. Specifically, number 1, and number 5.
4. Mortal sin is mortal sin. If you ask someone in the morning if they WANT to cheat on thier wife maybe they say no, but that night…
5. Putting this post together with your first, you need spiritual help immediately. And not from CAF. A poll of strangers is not what is needed here. And it matters none to your salvation or damnation.

What are your thoughts on redemptive suffering?

Get help now.

 

[laylow]

1. I think it can be forgiven through the same reasoning as other sins. Of course confession is out… but perhaps perfect contrition, though that might be hard.
2. Some people do want to commit suicide. But some may not meet the qualifications of mortal sin. Grave matter is met but knowledge and full will may be not met.
3. Have you ever read the Bible? It specifically condemns it. It’s in the Ten Commandments. Specifically, number 1, and number 5.
4. Mortal sin is mortal sin. If you ask someone in the morning if they WANT to cheat on thier wife maybe they say no, but that night…
5. Putting this post together with your first, you need spiritual help immediately. And not from CAF. A poll of strangers is not what is needed here. And it matters none to your salvation or damnation.

What are your thoughts on redemptive suffering?

Get help now.

Actually, murder is defined: Murder is the unlawful killing of **another human **without justification or valid excuse, especially the unlawful killing of another human being with malice aforethought

I have a friend is is suffering immensely even more than me. They are in constant physical and mental pain. The only thing that gives them relief of the mind is having it over with. They have suffered a lot! They have crossed virtually every avenue of getting help and were already depressed before they’re incurable chronic conditions.

A see value to redemptive suffering to a point. People can only take so much for so long sometimes.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

Actually, murder is defined: Murder is the unlawful killing of **another human **without justification or valid excuse, especially the unlawful killing of another human being with malice aforethought

I have a friend is is suffering immensely even more than me. They are in constant physical and mental pain. The only thing that gives them relief of the mind is having it over with. They have suffered a lot! They have crossed virtually every avenue of getting help and were already depressed before they’re incurable chronic conditions.

A see value to redemptive suffering to a point. People can only take so much for so long sometimes.

Get help. Strangers on the internet are not going to help you here. If you think suicide is not in the Bible, if you think it is pro life, if you think the 5th command doesn’t apply and if you think Judas was justified, we can’t help you. Actually we can’t help you at all.
This will be my last post on this thread.
I will be reporting it.

Get help! Immediately, now! Don’t respond and debate on this thread. Get help!

 

[laylow]

Get help. Strangers on the internet are not going to help you here. If you think suicide is not in the Bible, if you think it is pro life, if you think the 5th command doesn’t apply and if you think Judas was justified, we can’t help you. Actually we can’t help you at all.
This will be my last post on this thread.
I will be reporting it.

Get help! Immediately, now! Don’t respond and debate on this thread. Get help!

It’s just a question. Opinions of people are welcomed, not everyone has the same thoughts.

 

[pianistclare]

Actually, most Catholics do have the same thought.
Get a copy of the catechism if you doubt posters.
You really need Spiritual Direction. Not a criticism, just a fact.
People who really want answers seek them in the primary places.
Like the pastor’s office.
Good luck.

 

[laylow]

I will talk to my friend, but so far help has not worked well for them.

 

[Crusaderbear]

Actually, most Catholics do have the same thought.
Get a copy of the catechism if you doubt posters.
You really need Spiritual Direction. Not a criticism, just a fact.
People who really want answers seek them in the primary places.
Like the pastor’s office.
Good luck.

Best advice as usual…go to the source, not the editorial.

 

[Lost_Sheep]

The Catechism, Part 3, Section 2, Article 5, paragraph 2283:

We should not despair of the eternal salvation of persons who have taken their own lives. By ways known to him alone, God can provide the opportunity for salutary repentance. The Church prays for persons who have taken their own lives.

 

[laylow]

Thank you. I’ve praying abour 25 to 30% of every day for the past 6 months or so. I try to pray the rosary once and the chaplet of divine mercy 3 to 4 times a day, along with my normal prayers.

 

[ColdComfort]

In many cases suicide is selfish. It leaves behind broken hearts. The sin is against God always but also against other people.

 

[laylow]

In many cases suicide is selfish. It leaves behind broken hearts. The sin is against God always but also against other people.

Well I understand that. But if someone has gone mentally crazy and has tormenting physical issues, it seems the only people that would be selfish would be the people blaming them (after the fact, which hopefully wouldn’t happen) for doing something harmful because they saw no other solution.

 

[laylow]

Did not Paul, the Apostle, kill innocent Christians. NOT saying it was right, but he was forgiven.

 

[Wesrock]

Well I understand that. But if someone has gone mentally crazy and has tormenting physical issues, it seems the only people that would be selfish would be the people blaming them (after the fact, which hopefully wouldn’t happen) for doing something harmful because they saw no other solution.

Someone who commits suicide might not be culpable for the sin, depending on whether he’s in a right state of mind, and we can still have hope that they will be saved. So yes, it can be forgiven if lacking the criteria to be a mortal sin. However, that doesn’t make the suicide right or acceptable or something that can be approved of in any circumstances. The act itself is still wrong, whether it counts as mortal sin or not.

Note that cooperation in such a sin can be grave matter in itself.

1868 Sin is a personal act. Moreover, we have a responsibility for the sins committed by others when we cooperate in them:

• by participating directly and voluntarily in them;
• by ordering, advising, praising, or approving them;
• by not disclosing or not hindering them when we have an obligation to do so;
• by protecting evil-doers.

 

[laylow]

Mental health patients are treated horribly in this country. They are put under torturous conditions, unimaginable suffering. People do not willingly go to these places, but are forced. Many would rather not go.

 

[Robert_Sock]

Very often, I believe as a psychologist, free will gets suspended when people kill themselves. It’s as if they were under a hypnotic trance, and I believe their culpability is nil.

 

[goout]

Many despairing people can rightly be considered victims of our culture.
Our culture is nihilist. It points us to nothing that can satisfy and steers us to a bloated, overfed void. Our culture could easily be considered a “structure of sin”, in my opinion.

I know some people close to me that have attempted suicide, and I find it hard to believe they are mortally culpable of an act that is so counter to human nature. As I know it, they are not capable of full consent even if they know the gravity of the act.

By the way, if anyone finds themselves struggling with their sense of self worth, check out Romano Guardini. Especially “Learning the Virtues that lead you to God”.
amazon.com/Learning-Virtues-That-Lead-You/dp/0918477646

Guardini struggled with suicidal thoughts early in his life and severe depression throughout his life, and so he speaks powerfully and profoundly about God and our value in his eyes. His writing brought me out of a severe depression.
He is a wonderful writer that knows the inner spiritual life well.

 

[Wesrock]

Did not Paul, the Apostle, kill innocent Christians. NOT saying it was right, but he was forgiven.

Not to cause despair, but Paul was able to repent. You can’t repent once life is over.

That’s not to overrule what else has been said, though. It’s always grave matter and wrong, but it’s hard to think someone who would do such a thing made a truly rational choice.

 

[laylow]

Not to cause despair, but Paul was able to repent. You can’t repent once life is over.

That’s not to overrule what else has been said, though. It’s always grave matter and wrong, but it’s hard to think someone who would do such a thing made a truly rational choice.

There are Catholic teachings that say Jesus gives you 3 chances after you die to choose him. Fr Chris Alar in one of his sermons says that before he became a Priest, his Priest told him that the soul has 3 opportunities to accept Christ before he turns away from him. For that reason, prayers on earth will help that soul and their relationship with Jesus.

youtube.com/watch?v=GY3Ukwgzxhc

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

There are Catholic teachings that say Jesus gives you 3 chances after you die to choose him. Fr Chris Alar in one of his sermons says that before he became a Priest, his Priest told him that the soul has 3 opportunities to accept Christ before he turns away from him. For that reason, prayers on earth will help that soul and their relationship with Jesus.

youtube.com/watch?v=GY3Ukwgzxhc

That is the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever heard.
You need to become familiar with Catholic theology.
That is not possible in Catholic teaching. The Church could not be clearer.
Do you have access to the catechism if the Catholic Church?