Suicide

[ErichsGurl2]

Last week, I recieved a phone call from my childhood best friend, who sadly told me that her father had been shot and killed the night before. Because of the circumstances surrounding his death it is difficult to determine whether or not his death was suicide or murder. He was not in good health, and the family believes that it was basically self-euthinasia. Anyhow, my friend is having a very difficult time grieving the loss of her father. Although she claims to be Christian, her family and a local pastor sort of have invented their own faith in which giving yourself to God is all that’s needed to be forgiven. I am having a very difficult time supporting her through this, because I do not agree with their practices, and how in the world do you comfort someone who has lost a loved one you believe is condemned forever? You obviously can’t tell them that they are with God now. She will not agree to support groups or visits from clergy and is solely depending upon the advice of friends. I just don’t know what to tell her. Any ideas?

 

[ErichsGurl2]

No suggestions at all?

 

[Darrel]

Last week, I recieved a phone call from my childhood best friend, who sadly told me that her father had been shot and killed the night before. Because of the circumstances surrounding his death it is difficult to determine whether or not his death was suicide or murder. He was not in good health, and the family believes that it was basically self-euthinasia. Anyhow, my friend is having a very difficult time grieving the loss of her father. Although she claims to be Christian, her family and a local pastor sort of have invented their own faith in which giving yourself to God is all that’s needed to be forgiven. I am having a very difficult time supporting her through this, because I do not agree with their practices, and how in the world do you comfort someone who has lost a loved one you believe is condemned forever? You obviously can’t tell them that they are with God now. She will not agree to support groups or visits from clergy and is solely depending upon the advice of friends. I just don’t know what to tell her. Any ideas?

Is the suicide for certain? Suicide is not an absolute damnation and God is the God of mercy. Only he knows if a person was rational and sane at the moment of suicide. You can tell your friend that we as Catholics can’t ever assume to know what God will do in the time of judgement. I would tell your friend that you are going to pray the divine mercy chaplet for her father and just be a support element for her while offering prayer for her fathers soul. Perhaps ask others to remember him in there intentions. This is certainly not the time to debate her fathers final destination. Hope this helps.

-D

 

[mommyof4]

Sorry it took me so long to answer - I had to do a search. This is what the Catholic Church says about suicide:

**Grave psychological disturbances, anguish, or grave fear of hardship, suffering, or torture can diminish the responsibility of the one committing suicide. **

2283** We should not despair of the eternal salvation of persons who have taken their own lives. By ways known to him alone, God can provide the opportunity for salutary repentance. The Church prays for persons who have taken their own lives**.

Have a mass or masses said for him. Pray for him. We should never despair for another human. Even if the family isn’t catholic, have a mass or a couple of masses said for him at your parish.

 

[Andruschak]

Sorry it took me so long to answer - I had to do a search. This is what the Catholic Church says about suicide:

**Grave psychological disturbances, anguish, or grave fear of hardship, suffering, or torture can diminish the responsibility of the one committing suicide. **

2283** We should not despair of the eternal salvation of persons who have taken their own lives. By ways known to him alone, God can provide the opportunity for salutary repentance. The Church prays for persons who have taken their own lives**.

Have a mass or masses said for him. Pray for him. We should never despair for another human. Even if the family isn’t catholic, have a mass or a couple of masses said for him at your parish.

Nowadays, when I pray my daily Chaplet Of The Divine Mercy, I make it clear at the start that the primary intention is for those who have taken their own lives. I ask Mother Mary to carry my prayers to the broken soul, so that Jesus will have a chance to stand between the wounded and The Father. I hope this helps

 

[mommyof4]

Nowadays, when I pray my daily Chaplet Of The Divine Mercy, I make it clear at the start that the primary intention is for those who have taken their own lives. I ask Mother Mary to carry my prayers to the broken soul, so that Jesus will have a chance to stand between the wounded and The Father. I hope this helps

Thank you. As a person who has lost a couple of family members to suicide, I appreciate your prayers.

 

[puzzleannie]

I am having a very difficult time supporting her through this, because I do not agree with their practices, and how in the world do you comfort someone who has lost a loved one you believe is condemned forever?
. Any ideas?

if you somehow have an inside track with the Almighty and are able to state for certain that this man has been condemned forever, please do not attempt to comfort your friend, it will do more harm than good.

by your own testimony there is no proof that he did commit suicide, and if he did, good reason to believe that the balance of his mind and ability to make full, free will consent might very well have been disturbed by illness. both good reasons to suspend judgement. In any case, comforting a bereaved person never requires a commentary on the deceased persons spiritual condition. we should neither canonize nor condemn him.

the fate of the father may safely be left to God. Your friend will benefit more from friends concerned with her grief, her well-being and her comfort.

 

[vinarabo]

One thing you could tell the family that would not conflict with your faith is " He’s in Gods hands now" This would be true, and would convey that he might be in heaven (to them) but really his fate is in gods hands.

Mike

 

[AlanFromWichita]

One thing to look out for is that family members don’t carry guilt for the death. Usually this would show up in “should’ve” terms, such as “we should’ve known” or “we should’ve done something different.” There is no value in taking blame for it, although it can be hard to get that across to someone who’s “should-ing” on themselves over it.

Alan

 

[Maranatha]

While the fate of you friend’s Father is now truly in the Hands of our Lord, it is not a foregone conclusion that he is suffering eternal separation from God. Because of his circumstances, he may not be in Hell but may be suffering in purgatory right now.

One thing you can do is to get a plenary indulgence and dedicate it to your friend’s Father. If he is suffering in purgatory, this may be the best thing you can do.

Information from Our Lady’s Warriors web site:

This list is a convenient compilation of all the ways to obtain a plenary indulgence. ourladyswarriors.org/indulge/plenary.htm

To acquire a plenary indulgence it is necessary to perform the work to which the indulgence is attached and to fulfill the following three conditions:

1. 
   *]sacramental confession,
   *]Eucharistic Communion, and
   *]prayer for the intention of the Sovereign Pontiff.

 

[Andruschak]

I am having a very difficult time supporting her through this, because I do not agree with their practices, and how in the world do you comfort someone who has lost a loved one you believe is condemned forever? You obviously can’t tell them that they are with God now. She will not agree to support groups or visits from clergy and is solely depending upon the advice of friends. I just don’t know what to tell her. Any ideas?

The Catholic Church Catechism is quite clear that salvation for suicides is possible through the Grace of God working in ways unknown. It is not for mere mortals to judge.

If you can accept this, and REALLY want to help out, purchase a set of Gregorian Masses for the deceased. If you need a link, I can provide it. $150

 

[fin]

have greath faith

just keep on praying for that friend. God’s mercy is infinite.

 

[wcknight]

Comforting a friend of relative is always a praise worthy act of charity. As folks mentioned before no knows for certain what the eternal fate of anyone is. You don’t even have to say anything, sometimes just being there to support them is enough.

 

[ErichsGurl2]

if you somehow have an inside track with the Almighty and are able to state for certain that this man has been condemned forever, please do not attempt to comfort your friend, it will do more harm than good…

the fate of the father may safely be left to God. Your friend will benefit more from friends concerned with her grief, her well-being and her comfort.

Excuse me, I mistyped. I meant that the “family believes they are condemned forever.” That has nothing to do with my belief. I can explain to her all I want what the Church believes, and I can rant and rave about what I believe. I thought you all would have some ideas in what I could tell her to comfort her.

I don’t appreciate the sarcasm. Thank you very much. All you had to do was ask me what I meant by that.

As a matter of fact, a lot of the people I have spoken to here are RUDE and SARCASTIC. I dreamt all my life that I could be a part of the Church because I believed that the Catholic Church and it’s people were forgiving and understanding. Unfortunately, I waited to convert until I was an adult, although I did convert and am very happy. I have made a lot of mistakes in my life contrary to Catholic beliefs and practices, and if the people in my parish were as callous and judgemental as the people I’m talking about here, I would have run as far from the Church as I possibly could have. No wonder there are anti-Catholic groups! Now, how is that being a Christian witness? How is that helping those who come to you in need with questions here?

Where was I when these posts contained nice, decent conversation and peaceful debate?

 

[ErichsGurl2]

Last week, I recieved a phone call from my childhood best friend, who sadly told me that her father had been shot and killed the night before. Because of the circumstances surrounding his death it is difficult to determine whether or not his death was suicide or murder. He was not in good health, and the family believes that it was basically self-euthinasia. Anyhow, my friend is having a very difficult time grieving the loss of her father. Although she claims to be Christian, her family and a local pastor sort of have invented their own faith in which giving yourself to God is all that’s needed to be forgiven. I am having a very difficult time supporting her through this, because I do not agree with their practices, and how in the world do you comfort someone who has lost a loved one you believe is condemned forever? You obviously can’t tell them that they are with God now. She will not agree to support groups or visits from clergy and is solely depending upon the advice of friends. I just don’t know what to tell her. Any ideas?

I am not able, for some reason to edit my quote. So here you go…

I am having a very difficult time supporting her through this, because I do not agree with their practices, and how in the world do you comfort someone who has lost a loved one “THEY” believe is condemned forever? You obviously can’t tell them that they are with God now. She will not agree to support groups or visits from clergy and is solely depending upon the advice of friends. I just don’t know what to tell her. Any ideas

 

[b_justb]

Last week, I recieved a phone call from my childhood best friend, who sadly told me that her father had been shot and killed the night before. Because of the circumstances surrounding his death it is difficult to determine whether or not his death was suicide or murder. He was not in good health, and the family believes that it was basically self-euthinasia. Anyhow, my friend is having a very difficult time grieving the loss of her father. Although she claims to be Christian, her family and a local pastor sort of have invented their own faith in which giving yourself to God is all that’s needed to be forgiven. I am having a very difficult time supporting her through this, because I do not agree with their practices, and how in the world do you comfort someone who has lost a loved one you believe is condemned forever? You obviously can’t tell them that they are with God now. She will not agree to support groups or visits from clergy and is solely depending upon the advice of friends. I just don’t know what to tell her. Any ideas?

My ideas:

Put theology on the shelf and just be a Christian.

Hold your friend when she cries. Ask to pray with her and pray for her and her father in private.

Ideological differences have no place here. If she is your friend then be a friend now.

 

[ErichsGurl2]

Thank you for the advice to all those who weren’t mean. I will put it to good use.

 

[mommyof4]

ErichsGurl2, I’m sorry if I said anything that was/is offensive to you.

 

[ErichsGurl2]

ErichsGurl2, I’m sorry if I said anything that was/is offensive to you.

Oh no! You haven’t offended me in any way ! I am a peaceful person, and I avoid confrontation as if it were the plague, but I will voice my opinion. It just upsets me when I see that not so nice things are being said to others (or me). We are all children of God, and we should treat others the way we would want to be treated, regardless of whether or not we had a bad day. Thank you, dear.