Sunday obligation and Christmas

[Br.Rich_SFO]

Another question on this: what if you go to Sunday am, Sunday evening & Christmas Day? Which one can you not receive at? If you receive Sunday night, you can’t on Christmas Day, right?

You could receive at all three.

A Pastor can also grant you permission to receive at additional Masses if necessary. Lets say you are an altar server and will serve two Masses Sunday morning and two Masses Sunday evening. You could be granted permission to do so, however without specific permission you are limited to two in one day and the second must be at Mass.

 

[kim3260]

Try this Kim…
ewtn.com/vexperts/showmessage.asp?number=487776&Pg=Forum4&Pgnu=1&recnu=1

Thanks I meant to tell you sooner I printed it out and showed it to him. His wife Theresa, said thank you also

 

[Digitonomy]

netmil(name removed by moderator):

Try this Kim…
ewtn.com/vexperts/showmes…nu=1&rec

nu=1Thanks I meant to tell you sooner I printed it out and showed it to him. His wife Theresa, said thank you also

Just to repeat the caution about this link by Br Rich SFO in Post #15: The explanation was worded rather poorly. What the author meant is that no mass on Christmas Eve Day before 4 pm will count toward the Christmas obligation.

 

[Sir_Knight]

Example: Monday Jan 1- Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God is a Holy Day of obligation, but because it on a Monday in the USA the obligation has been removed. Therefore a Catholic in the USA is NOT obligated to go to Mass on Monday Jan 1.

It depends on the diocese. For my in-laws, who live in a different part of the country from us, their bishop has done it the way that you outlined and there are no additional Masses on Monday. Our Bishop did not and we have a full schedule of Masses REQUIRING us to attend.

 

[decn2b]

FWIW going to Mass on saturday morning of any week OR attending Mass at Saturday weddings Does NOT fulfill the Sunday Obligation as well.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

It depends on the diocese. For my in-laws, who live in a different part of the country from us, their bishop has done it the way that you outlined and there are no additional Masses on Monday. Our Bishop did not and we have a full schedule of Masses REQUIRING us to attend.

I hope you mean Monday Jan 1st?
I do not believe that is possible for a Bishop to “do away” with the Christmas obligation. Matter of fact I’m 99.99% certain.

 

[kim3260]

Just to repeat the caution about this link by Br Rich SFO in Post #15: The explanation was worded rather poorly. What the author meant is that no mass on Christmas Eve Day before 4 pm will count toward the Christmas obligation.

Thanks, not a problem, we are a very small Parish there is only one Sunday Mass (10AM), Christmas Eve Mass is 5:00PM, and a Midnight Mass, and a 10AM on Christmas morning (so dear brother can’t play his mind games hahaha)

 

[katiemonster]

Hiii,

Since Christmas Eve is on Sunday this year, does going to Christmas Eve Mass fulfill the Sunday obligation?

-K

 

[francesco920]

No, it does not. You have to go once for your Sunday obligation and once for your Christmas obligation. The Vigil of Christmas mass doesn’t count for the Sunday obligation.

This might help: ewtn.org/vexperts/showmessage.asp?number=487776&Pg=Forum4&Pgnu=1&recnu=2

 

[SeekerJen]

You could go to a Saturday evening Mass (tonight) if you don’t want to attend two Masses tomorrow, or go to Sunday morning Mass tomorrow and a Christmas Day Mass. But yes, you still need to attend one for the 4th Sunday of Advent and one for Christmas.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

Hiii,

Since Christmas Eve is on Sunday this year, does going to Christmas Eve Mass fulfill the Sunday obligation?

-K

Yes, attending a Christmas eve mass on the 24th can fulfill your Sunday obligation. BUT you also have to attend another Christmas Mass (midnight, morning or daytime Dec 25th) to fulfill your Christmas obligation.

 

[decn2b]

Yes, attending a Christmas eve mass on the 24th can fulfill your Sunday obligation.

Huh?

Christmas eve liturgy fulfills the Christmas obligation. Attending Mass on X-mas eve and then again on Christmas day are both fulfilling the CHristmas obligation. Sunday is OVER before christmas eve happens traditionally around 3:30 PM. on Sunday.
I am almost dead certain on this one. If you cannot go to mass on Saturday or Monday then you have to go to Mass Sunday Morning and again in the evening to get both days. Christmas eve is the vigil liturgy for the following day so there is no way it can cover for Sunday. The more I think about this the more I get confused. Some churches have a SUnday evening Mass for their Sunday. .

 

[decn2b]

BUT you also have to attend another Christmas Mass (midnight, morning or daytime Dec 25th) to fulfill your Christmas obligation.

WIth this in Mind a person could fulfill both days obligation in around a 2.5 hour time span. Example Church A has 7 PM eve mass and CHurch b has an 8:30 mass that same evening. You could go to church A then leave and drive over to church B and attend their mass. It has been done before!

Stranger things have happened.

 

[leaner]

WIth this in Mind a person could fulfill both days obligation in around a 2.5 hour time span. Example Church A has 7 PM eve mass and CHurch b has an 8:30 mass that same evening. You could go to church A then leave and drive over to church B and attend their mass. It has been done before!

Stranger things have happened.

– said the man with no small children, obviously –

(lol, I’m totally joking…I don’t know if you have kids or not, but the thought that occurred to me was "oh wow…could you imagine the kids thru that??? They’re good for a 1hr mass, quiet, respectful etc. almost every week, but I think 2hrs -even with the car ride in between to break it up - would just be too much… Nope…LOL!!!)

 

[JButky]

My in-laws (in visiting from the Diocese of Marquette, MI) told me that their was an announcement last weekend at their church that the Bishop (Sample?) has apparantly dispensed them from Sunday obligation this week because of a Monday Christmas.

How can a Bishop dispense anyone’s regular Sunday obligation???

I hope it’s not true…

Joe B

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

My in-laws (in visiting from the Diocese of Marquette, MI) told me that their was an announcement last weekend at their church that the Bishop (Sample?) has apparantly dispensed them from Sunday obligation this week because of a Monday Christmas.

How can a Bishop dispense anyone’s regular Sunday obligation???

I hope it’s not true…

Joe B

That would seem strange to me. Dispensed from Sunday obligation? A priest or Bishop could but would need very good reason. I understood that a Bishop dispensed from Sunday obligation the whole dioceses because of riots and danger to be on the streets.

 

[Swiss_Guard]

Christmas is a Holy day of obligation and it is NOT transfered to sunday.

Not yet anyway. Give the US Bishops a few years and it will be.

 

[cameron_lansing]

That would seem strange to me. Dispensed from Sunday obligation? A priest or Bishop could but would need very good reason. I understood that a Bishop dispensed from Sunday obligation the whole dioceses because of riots and danger to be on the streets.

The law requires the judgement by the diocesan bishop that a spiritual good of the faithful will be assisted.

Thus, canon 87 §1, "As often as he judges that a dispensation will contribute to the spiritual good of the faithful, the diocesan bishop can dispense from both universal and particular disciplinary laws established for his territory or for his subjects by the supreme authority of the Church. He cannot dispense, however, from procedural or penal laws or from those laws whose dispensation is especially reserved to the Apostolic See or to another authority. "

Dispensation from the obligation in canon 1247 is not reserved.

Further, canon 1245, “With due regard for the right of diocesan bishops which is mentioned in can. 87, for a just reason and in accord with the prescriptions of the diocesan bishop, the pastor in individual cases can dispense from the obligation to observe a feast day or a day of penance; or he can commute it to other pious works; the superior of a religious institute or a society of apostolic life of pontifical right if they are clerical can also do the same for his own subjects and others staying in his house day and night.”

This power to dispense from a day of precept or penance can also be delegated to other priests and deacons, but they would not possess it unless so delegated. Note that pastors can dispense or commute in individual cases. This would not seem to include dispensing or commuting an entire parish en masse.

Finally see canon 89, “The pastor and other presbyters or deacons cannot dispense from a universal or particular law unless this power has been expressly granted to them.” The canon above gives it to pastors and superiors as noted but not all priests.

We do not know Bishop Sample’s reason nor need not know it, but the presumption is that he considered the situation and judged the matter according to the requirement of a contribution to the spiritual good of the faithful before exercising his authority in this matter.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

The law requires the judgement by the diocesan bishop that a spiritual good of the faithful will be assisted.

Thus, canon 87 §1, "As often as he judges that a dispensation will contribute to the spiritual good of the faithful, the diocesan bishop can dispense from both universal and particular disciplinary laws established for his territory or for his subjects by the supreme authority of the Church. He cannot dispense, however, from procedural or penal laws or from those laws whose dispensation is especially reserved to the Apostolic See or to another authority. "

Dispensation from the obligation in canon 1247 is not reserved.

Further, canon 1245, “With due regard for the right of diocesan bishops which is mentioned in can. 87, for a just reason and in accord with the prescriptions of the diocesan bishop, the pastor in individual cases can dispense from the obligation to observe a feast day or a day of penance; or he can commute it to other pious works; the superior of a religious institute or a society of apostolic life of pontifical right if they are clerical can also do the same for his own subjects and others staying in his house day and night.”

This power to dispense from a day of precept or penance can also be delegated to other priests and deacons, but they would not possess it unless so delegated. Note that pastors can dispense or commute in individual cases. This would not seem to include dispensing or commuting an entire parish en masse.

Finally see canon 89, “The pastor and other presbyters or deacons cannot dispense from a universal or particular law unless this power has been expressly granted to them.” The canon above gives it to pastors and superiors as noted but not all priests.

We do not know Bishop Sample’s reason nor need not know it, but the presumption is that he considered the situation and judged the matter according to the requirement of a contribution to the spiritual good of the faithful before exercising his authority in this matter.

Would not the Bishop need to decree this in some public manner to the faithful and include his reasons for doing so?

 

[cameron_lansing]

Some kind of public communication and record would be required, and it would seem at least to the pastors of the diocese. The reasons for a dispensation need not be communicated for the validity of the act, but given the nature of something like this, it would seem to make sense.

Whether there was such a dispensation was actually given in this matter is a whole other issue, of course. Having consulted the online version of the UP Catholic, at upcatholic.org/, I read an article titled “Fourth Sunday, Christmas both require Mass attendance.”

While a diocesan bishop could do so as I noted, that article leads me to question the assertion that the bishop actually did so dispense in this case. There would seem to be more to the story than we know or some confusion somewhere in the details as they reached this thread.