Supporting Large Families

[leonie]

It is hard, sometimes.

All of my friends with more than 4 kids have had flack from family. Weird, I know. My inlaws,to whom we live next door, give us lots of flack. It’s not fun. Like many moms, I’m often more afraid of having to deal with them than I am about any pregnancy problems. Even faithful Catholics can be uncharitable about babies. weird.

I have one very good friend who waited until she was 8 months pregnant to tell her parents she was expecting her 9th. It only worked because her parents went to Florida for three months.

One thing that occurs to me is that it’s possible that your parish doesn’t know that you need help. I would call the parish secretary or pastor and just explain that you are feeling overwhelmed. Then, I would ask if there was any organization or persons that have a heart for helping moms. I know one lady who was in a deep clinical depression and had 6 kids moved to a new parish. She called her new pastor and explained the situation. He got in touch with the Legion of Mary at his parish and they spent time praying with/for her and also gave childcare/household help.

The secretary generally knows everyone and will have an idea of a person or two who loves to serve others one on one.

 

[PennitentMan]

I am trying to understand where God stands in all of this.

I know where you are coming from with that, truly I do. I’ll leave it there, but I know.

PennitentMan, we have crossed paths before. I hope you don’t mind if I pray for you.

I don’t mind at all. I’m not really holding my breath for an actual answer, but I don’t mind that you are praying for me.

Thanks DM for the gesture.

I also wish you all the best and that you find the answers you are looking for. I found mine and I finally found peace and happiness.
I really hope that you find your peace.

Sincerely, PM.

 

[gardenswithkids]

I think the Catholic Church is beautiful! And I love God with all my heart! I would not abandon either. The truth of the Church is not dependent on the faithfulness of her members, and the value of my suffering is not dependent on whether I receive help from others. But I am still disappointed. And I still need help.

What is the value of greater suffering? I asked this question before, and most posters objected to my idea that some people have greater suffering than others. But I still think that it is a fair question. In light of St. Catherine’s vision, God recognizes that some people (parents of large families) suffer more than other people. Is there a greater reward (on earth or in heaven) for the people who suffer more than for the people who suffer less (if both suffer well)?

Please pray for me. I REALLY need help.

God Bless!

Prayers for you.

As to your question on rewards in heaven, Jesus didn’t say much about the specifics of what the rewards in heaven are like beyond “eye has not seen, ear has not heard what God has ready for those who love Him.” Many of the mystics in the Church did view greater and lesser rewards in heaven. There’s some hint of that in the Bible with the parable of the talents, but there’s also the parable of the workers, so it’s not exactly clear what the rewards in heaven will be like. Same for everyone or different according to their works?

As far as the value of suffering, this is something that is much clearer in our theology. Suffering brings redemption. The crux of our faith is the Cross–and we can immitate Christ and also help bring salvation through our personal suffering. While carrying our crosses leads to Calvary, Good Friday is followed by Easter Sunday.

John Paul II called this a “culture of death”. Mother Theresa said something like “if you want to end abortion, have babies.” Live birth and the openess to life is quite the opposite of abortion and openess to death. Large famiies in this culture are the “sign of contradiction”–here women have “choices” and some of us choose personal sacrifice for the sake of large families. The mere existance of our mulitiple children often tugs at the consciences of some who have made other choices.

 

[gardenswithkids]

…Our problems come from a couple of different directions. 1) My family. We announced #5 to my family last weekend. My dad was pretty silent at first, but then the next day regained his composure and was pleasant and congratulatory. That was pretty good. But all I got from my mother was a comment about how the diaphragm is a great method of birth control. And she hasn’t said anything to me since. I am so sad and hurt by my mother’s attitude…

I think one of the hardest struggles I’ve encounter is family members with negative attitudes at the announcement of another family member’s impending birth. I get it from my non-Catholic MIL, and it’s tough enough to take from her. I can’t imagine your pain from hearing this type of thing from your own mother–the very woman who gave birth to you. Announcement of #5 was greeted with swearing. Similar responce to #6 without the swearing, My husband asked me to announce #7 to his parents when he wasn’t around; she tried to walk out the door without saying anything but FIL didn’t follow. This time around with #8, we just sent an e-mail to announce the pregnancy. That way she had a chance to pull herself together before she vocalized the first ugly thought that came into her head.

My MIL used contraception to plan her family. I think she’s thrown off by her inability to plan her grandchildren. She often brings up the subject of contraception. She explains that her parents only had a large family because they “didn’t know any better.” I’ll refrain from further comment, but you get the idea.

I know some other large Catholic families that come from large, faithful Catholic families. I think they may have an easier time because they get support from each other. And they grew up seeing how their parents raised a large family. It almost seems like they come from a different culture.

 

[Bluegoat]

I think one of the hardest struggles I’ve encounter is family members with negative attitudes at the announcement of another family member’s impending birth. I get it from my non-Catholic MIL, and it’s tough enough to take from her. I can’t imagine your pain from hearing this type of thing from your own mother–the very woman who gave birth to you. Announcement of #5 was greeted with swearing. Similar responce to #6 without the swearing, My husband asked me to announce #7 to his parents when he wasn’t around; she tried to walk out the door without saying anything but FIL didn’t follow. This time around with #8, we just sent an e-mail to announce the pregnancy. That way she had a chance to pull herself together before she vocalized the first ugly thought that came into her head.

My MIL used contraception to plan her family. I think she’s thrown off by her inability to plan her grandchildren. She often brings up the subject of contraception. She explains that her parents only had a large family because they “didn’t know any better.” I’ll refrain from further comment, but you get the idea.

I know some other large Catholic families that come from large, faithful Catholic families. I think they may have an easier time because they get support from each other. And they grew up seeing how their parents raised a large family. It almost seems like they come from a different culture.

I’m expecting my third child now. I am sure if we have more kids, family members will comment. I can understand them being concerned about practicalities - moms always worry, but there is something more in this general disapproval of big families. It bothers me that I am hesitant to have a large family because of the reactions of my immediate family.

 

[kage_ar]

Since modern society expects us to move away from our blood families (who used to be the natural support system for families of all shapes and sizes), the key is to cultivate an adopted extended family who can and will help share the joy and burdens of family life.

Get to know your neighbors, your fellow parishioners - put effort into it. It is really amazing to see how these little “villages” of sorts spring up within a parish.

 

[maryjk]

Since modern society expects us to move away from our blood families (who used to be the natural support system for families of all shapes and sizes), the key is to cultivate an adopted extended family who can and will help share the joy and burdens of family life.

Get to know your neighbors, your fellow parishioners - put effort into it. It is really amazing to see how these little “villages” of sorts spring up within a parish.

This is a really good idea.

Now, I don’t have a large family, but there are many large families that attend Mass at our parish. Word spreads quickly when a new baby is born. And meals pour in. I only know this because the emails fly. There was a time last year it seemed that I made a meal a week for about 3 months.

So get to know your fellow parishioners.

 

[mom24boys]

So get to know your fellow parishioners.

I agree with this sentiment, but we live in a rural area and most of those in our parish are elderly. The large families in my area are either LDS or fundamentalist protestants. Do you think it is possible to form an ecumenical support network?

 

[kage_ar]

The heart of the question is, can someone have a close friend who is something other than Catholic? Of course!

 

[leonie]

I agree with this sentiment, but we live in a rural area and most of those in our parish are elderly. The large families in my area are either LDS or fundamentalist protestants. Do you think it is possible to form an ecumenical support network?

I have a friend who is very close with the women in her ecumenical homeschooling group. She’s had to do some apologetics over the years–only when asked about a issue. In fact, one family she is close friends with is very close to converting due to their discussions and sharing of apologetic books–only holding off because of social/family concerns.

She says that it took awhile to let down her guard and sometimes she still feels like she is censoring the Catholic out of her speech. But, she loves her group very much and the kids have strong friendships with the other kids.

One of her friends in the group told her that she didn’t know Catholics could be Christians until she met her. So, it’s also a mission field to reach out into nonCatholic circles.

 

[gardenswithkids]

I agree with this sentiment, but we live in a rural area and most of those in our parish are elderly. The large families in my area are either LDS or fundamentalist protestants. …

Chances are that some (or many) of those elderly parishioneers raised large families. I don’t know about your parish, but in my parish I think many of them appreciate seeing young, large families. My husand and I often recieve supportive looks (and sometimes nice comments at the “peace be with you time” from the elderly.) One sweet, lady leaned over to whisper to me how many children she raised too. If you recieve those kind of comments, take them as support. Maybe you could suggest to you pastor or other staff something they could do to help formally foster these relationships that would probably prove mutually beneficial to everyone.

Way back when, before I had a large family, my oldest son used to play with the youngest child of an LDS family that lived across the street. I never imagined at the time that I would one day have more children than they did. But I remember some of the things their family did in raising a large family, (like teaching my son’s young friend to bus his own dishes.) While other parents of large families may not share our Catholic theology, they do know some helpful tips and the share the struggles and joys of raising a large family.

I also find that Catholics who struggle or have struggled with infertility often have a great understanding of the blessing of children than the average Catholic parent in the pew. A couple of my friends who provide the most support, (offering rides and passing along good used clothing, etc.) have what looks like the “perfect” family of two–yet I know what some looking at them don’t: they struggled with infertility and female problems that left them unable to have more children.

You may find help, suggestions and support from other parents who at first glance you don’t think have much in common with you… Maybe they raised their families long ago. Or they may not be Catholic but also have large families. Maybe they have small families, but like you accepted all the children God gave them. Developing those relationships can help you find the support you desire and you, in turn, can help provide support for them.

 

[leonie]

My good friend Mary has two sisters who couldn’t have children, so they actually have sought out large families to befriend. They offer babysitting, household help, etc. Mary has 7 siblings, so the sisters grew up in a large family.

So, don’t overlook single folks/childless couples. Maybe they are just waiting to be asked.

 

[jwatza]

To get back to the original post, our parish is doing something to help any families in need during this difficult economic time, large families included. Our pastor has a 2nd collection taken up each month to be used for any family that is in need. Also, we have a community garden on the church property that supplies vegetables to those in need. And our St. Vincent DePaul group aids those families who are in dire need–a few from our parish are large families that have lost their jobs and have been helped by St. Vincent DePaul group. The parish school has scholarships that they offer to families who want to attend the school, but can’t afford it–a large family that I know benefits from this. So, it all depends on what people in the parish are willing to do to help support large families or families in general.

Besides, the Church doesn’t force anyone to have a large family–God has called us to be generous with our fertility and to bring forth life. I am sorry that some are so bitter and hurt by people of the Church who have not offered help. We all can do better to help support each other no matter the size of our families. I have 8 children and know the difficulties of raising a large family, but with such difficulty comes great joy! What can be more important than cooperating with the Lord of the universe to bring about a new immortal soul??

 

[maryjk]

My good friend Mary has two sisters who couldn’t have children, so they actually have sought out large families to befriend. They offer babysitting, household help, etc. Mary has 7 siblings, so the sisters grew up in a large family.

So, don’t overlook single folks/childless couples. Maybe they are just waiting to be asked.

That is a good point.

When I first offered to make a meal for a large family, those planning the meals didn’t feel that I could handle it. I have an only child, what did I know about making a meal for a family of 8?

How many other small families could help, if only they were asked?

 

[mom24boys]

Besides, the Church doesn’t force anyone to have a large family–

Can you explain this statement within the context of your answer? I’m not sure why you said that? Truthfully, if most Catholics were faithful to the teachings on ABC and being open to life, you would see alot more large families. And to a certain extent, God has “forced” me to have a larger family (but I am thankful). Practicing NFP has led to two more children than I would have personally planned.

I think that not overlooking asking help of small families is a great point! The reason I specifically spoke of the isolation of not knowing any other large families is because one of the “helps” I’m looking for is moral support and advice from mothers of other large families on how to handle it all. I didn’t intend to insult small families or say that they couldn’t help.

As far as practical help, I really needed help with cleaning, cooking and taking care of my older children after I had my fourth baby and was really sick (I mean deathbed kind of sick). My parents helped us financially, so that kind of help was covered. After this baby, I am anticipating that I won’t be physically ill (God willing), but I will have all the demands of taking care of a newborn, my other children and the house. So, the kind of assistance I will need is help with the meals and my other children.

 

[pabakmil]

We used NFP and had two children. We really wanted four, but God knows what he wants and he decides your gifts. I grew up in a family of six kids which I truly enjoyed, but I also saw many of the problems that have been mentioned. I especially have seen the lack of discounts in here in the Memphis area for additional children in schools.

In our parish, the KofC and other orgs. charge for a max of four per family making it much more manageable. We also do food for funerals and the sick though I had not considered newborns, it is a great idea.

I was out of work in the mid '90s and found the most difficult thing about getting help was; 1) I had to ask for it 2) I had to accept it. Due to pride I had trouble with both of those. It is true though, most people will not realize you need help unless you ask. And the people who ask if you need help are serious, you have to be honest with them about what you need. Old (older than you) people enjoy helping. They are a great resource you shouldn’t pass up and they usually surprise you with the energy they have.

I have the capital sins of envy and jealousy of you with large families. I pray for you and may God bless your parenting.

PBM
revert

 

[paperwight]

Can you explain this statement within the context of your answer? I’m not sure why you said that? Truthfully, if most Catholics were faithful to the teachings on ABC and being open to life, you would see alot more large families. And to a certain extent, God has “forced” me to have a larger family (but I am thankful). Practicing NFP has led to two more children than I would have personally planned.

.

I honestly think that the reaction of most people, Catholic or not,would be that nobody had asked couples to have more children that they could afford. If they couldn’t manage, financially or practically, they shouldn’t have had so many, and why should other couples, who were more careful (or abstained more?) pick up the tab. Their own finances might be stretched to the limit already, supporting elderly parents.

A young mum being widowed or abandoned, that’s a different case. But being irresponsible enough to just go on having children but then expect others to finance them? No way.

 

[Bluegoat]

I honestly think that the reaction of most people, Catholic or not,would be that nobody had asked couples to have more children that they could afford. If they couldn’t manage, financially or practically, they shouldn’t have had so many, and why should other couples, who were more careful (or abstained more?) pick up the tab. Their own finances might be stretched to the limit already, supporting elderly parents.

A young mum being widowed or abandoned, that’s a different case. But being irresponsible enough to just go on having children but then expect others to finance them? No way.

I agree that many people would feel that way.

But given Catholic teachings on family, community, and care of one’s neighbours, I wouldn’t expect to find it in Catholic circles.

 

[mom24boys]

I honestly think that the reaction of most people, Catholic or not,would be that nobody had asked couples to have more children that they could afford.

Do you honestly think that most people who have smaller families simply abstained? No, I don’t think so. Most Catholics with smaller families either have infertility problems or use ABC. Some successfully use NFP, but I would venture that is a small percentage of NFP families.

The entire point of my post was: IF a Catholic is faithful to the teachings of the Church and doesn’t use ABC, they may end up with a large(r) family. Contrary to what some posters have said, NFP isn’t flawless for everyone and you are supposed to be using it with the idea that God may bless you with more children than you planned. So, that being the case, what can the Church do practically speaking to support larger families? Because if most of us were obeying Catholic teaching the average size of a Catholic family would be bigger.

Am I to understand that your position is that if a couple is struggling financially or otherwise with a larger family, they should just abstain? Use artificial birth control? That the responsibility lies with them alone, not with the Church who declares the teaching? What about unforseen circumstances? A couple may believe they can handle another child but then something happens to them, such as in my case when I was struck with a life threatening illness. What is the Church’s responsiblity? What is YOURS?

 

[maryjk]

Do you honestly think that most people who have smaller families simply abstained? No, I don’t think so. Most Catholics with smaller families either have infertility problems or use ABC. Some successfully use NFP, but I would venture that is a small percentage of NFP families.

Hi Small family here. NFP family here.

The entire point of my post was: IF a Catholic is faithful to the teachings of the Church and doesn’t use ABC, they may end up with a large(r) family. Contrary to what some posters have said, NFP isn’t flawless for everyone and you are supposed to be using it with the idea that God may bless you with more children than you planned. So, that being the case, what can the Church do practically speaking to support larger families? Because if most of us were obeying Catholic teaching the average size of a Catholic family would be bigger.

Am I to understand that your position is that if a couple is struggling financially or otherwise with a larger family, they should just abstain? Use artificial birth control? That the responsibility lies with them alone, not with the Church who declares the teaching? What about unforseen circumstances? A couple may believe they can handle another child but then something happens to them, such as in my case when I was struck with a life threatening illness. What is the Church’s responsiblity? What is YOURS?

My responsibility is to help where I can.