Survey: Pope Francis popular; Mass attendance unchanged over past year

[McCall1981]

I am not surprised by this news.

 

[gilliam]

I don’t think someone who doesn’t go to mass is all of a sudden going to go because they like the Pope. They may start to more self identify as Catholic and they may read more about the Faith; but if they aren’t attending mass it is probably because they don’t feel welcome there or find it boring or whatever and I don’t think liking the Pope is going to get them going back; especially if you are only looking at people going once a week or more.

my 2-cents

 

[ProVobis]

Now add in 2 times a year which is what the church requires

Um…the Church requires (weekly) Sunday and HolyDay attendance.

One can only imagine how few would go if it were only 2 times a year.

 

[Jeanne_S]

I think these surveys should be read more carefully.

First, the question was who attends mass once a week.

I don’t. I only attended about 45 times. Between vacations sickness And life I missed a few

So reading the question 40 percent is good. Think about it in standard deviation standards.

40 percent go to church once a week then add those who go almost once a week that’s around 50 percent. Add this who go had the time and
I speculate that would bring the numbers to 75 percent. Now add in 2 times a year which is what the church requires and we have 95 percent.

All march those numbers with any formal
Religion.

Just my two cents

Where did you get the idea you are required to attend Sunday Mass only twice a year?
You are required to attend weekly in
addition to Holy Days of obligation.
Otherwise you are in a state of mortal sin,unless you have received a dispensation,are ill

 

[rightofcenter77]

I think these surveys should be read more carefully.

First, the question was who attends mass once a week.

I don’t. I only attended about 45 times. Between vacations sickness And life I missed a few

So reading the question 40 percent is good. Think about it in standard deviation standards.

40 percent go to church once a week then add those who go almost once a week that’s around 50 percent. Add this who go had the time and
I speculate that would bring the numbers to 75 percent. Now add in 2 times a year which is what the church requires and we have 95 percent.

All march those numbers with any formal
Religion.

Just my two cents

I wish your logic would hold up. However, I suspect that people who miss mass occasionally due to illness or being over-the-road would count themselves as weekly attendees. Much as I go to mass 5 or 6 times a week but consider myself a daily attendee, even thought that would not be technically true. Unfortunately, even a clear question like this can be subjective.

Peace,
Sean

 

[ProVobis]

I wish your logic would hold up. However, I suspect that people who miss mass occasionally due to illness or being over-the-road would count themselves as weekly attendees. Much as I go to mass 5 or 6 times a week but consider myself a daily attendee, even thought that would not be technically true. Unfortunately, even a clear question like this can be subjective.

Peace,
Sean

Not to worry. The bishops and priests are fully aware of the attendance figures. Obviously also know how much at the collection plate as well.

 

[Colorad007]

Yeah, catechesis hasn’t been a strong point of the American Church. But I suspect that most of these folks believe whatever they want and couldn’t care less what some bishop or priest has to say about it. The consumerist mentality has clearly been felt in the Church, too., where the Catholic faith is viewed as a spiritual sampler paired with your daily yoga or eastern meditation time. Whatever floats your boat, man, is what we tell ourselves.

We have spent decades believing that to be Catholic means getting baptized, drinking good beer, rooting for Note Dame every. Saturday, and giving something up for Lent.

Personal conversion? Isn’t that for Protestants?

And so the Church in America set itself up for decline. The problem isn’t that they aren’t catechized, but rather that they aren’t converted, although they aren’t catechized either. But you can give all the arguments in the world for not contracepting or having relations before marriage, but an unconverted person will only take you seriously if there is a lot of social pressure backing you up. The social pressure is today running in the other direction, so all that’s left is helping souls to encounter Christ and experience conversion.

So, skeptics of what Pope Francis is doing, here is your real world example of why his evangelical emphasis is what it is. Do you really believe that it would make a difference if the pope preached on contraception or the male-only priesthood every day? Everyone here would clap their hands and nod their heads and the other 90% of America would scoff and deride.

But the key to the Pope’s approach is probably more than anything to get priests and bishops and you and me off of our rear ends and into a zealous apostolic lifestyle that recognizes the fact that we live in a mostly pagan country that needs Christ now. Then you’ll see a Francis-effect, only then we’ll see it for what it is: the Holy Spirit.

 

[FollowChrist34]

I think Catholics have always been a little spoiled - we have the largest Church presence in the world. But think about that for a second - is that a guarantee of holiness? The earthly organization has a hard time avoiding over emphasizing her self-preservation rather than ensuring the conversion and salvation of each individual soul. In the modern age, especially for the last 50 years or so, this has led to incredible laxity about catechesis. Why? Because it’s unpopular. About as uncool as you can get. People won’t listen to it. The Church fears earthly hardship and doesn’t want to drive herself out of business or give way to the Protestants or God knows who else. Not sure that’s the best approach. Leads to our current state of affairs.

As for learning the catechesis, I’m still shaky on it. Came back to the Church as an adult. What I know I taught myself (Bible, CCC, Augustine, Aquinas, Desert Fathers, Luther, Kierkegaard, Popes, Saints, etc.). EWTN probably helped more than any parish I’ve ever attended. Protestants gave me backbone.

 

[Tigg]

Majorities of Catholics report that their excitement about their faith, their time spent in prayer, and their time spent reading the Bible “has not changed much” in the past year.

Everyone, but everyone (in our circle) loves Pope Francis. They say this while the excitement centers around the changes they believe will happen in the Church. Where are we going with this if we love the pope but don’t strengthen our interior life and desire to become holy?

 

[McCall1981]

Everyone, but everyone (in our circle) loves Pope Francis. They say this while the excitement centers around the changes they believe will happen in the Church. Where are we going with this if we love the pope but don’t strengthen our interior life and desire to become holy?

And this is exactly the problem. Much of his worldly popularity stems from the expectations that he will change Church doctrines.

 

[TCEL]

Yeah, catechesis hasn’t been a strong point of the American Church. But I suspect that most of these folks believe whatever they want and couldn’t care less what some bishop or priest has to say about it. The consumerist mentality has clearly been felt in the Church, too., where the Catholic faith is viewed as a spiritual sampler paired with your daily yoga or eastern meditation time. Whatever floats your boat, man, is what we tell ourselves.

We have spent decades believing that to be Catholic means getting baptized, drinking good beer, rooting for Note Dame every. Saturday, and giving something up for Lent.

Personal conversion? Isn’t that for Protestants?

And so the Church in America set itself up for decline. The problem isn’t that they aren’t catechized, but rather that they aren’t converted, although they aren’t catechized either. But you can give all the arguments in the world for not contracepting or having relations before marriage, but an unconverted person will only take you seriously if there is a lot of social pressure backing you up. The social pressure is today running in the other direction, so all that’s left is helping souls to encounter Christ and experience conversion. It makes me think of St. Paul in 1 Cor., where he says he laid the foundation, and others built on it.

So, skeptics of what Pope Francis is doing, here is your real world example of why his evangelical emphasis is what it is. Do you really believe that it would make a difference if the pope preached on contraception or the male-only priesthood every day? Everyone here would clap their hands and nod their heads and the other 90% of America would scoff and deride.

But the key to the Pope’s approach is probably more than anything to get priests and bishops and you and me off of our rear ends and into a zealous apostolic lifestyle that recognizes the fact that we live in a mostly pagan country that needs Christ now. Then you’ll see a Francis-effect, only then we’ll see it for what it is: the Holy Spirit.

I hear you.

I love JP II and Benedict’s work. Combine that with Francis’ style, and the Holy Spirit will work in leaps and bounds. I’m not preaching, just musing from things I’ve learned. We have to be prepared to settle down for the long haul, and be willing to suffer. I’ve found that sometimes, it doesn’t matter how charitably you present the gospel; people’s hearts are often very hard and wounded. There’s a deep-rooted tendency of autonomy, and pain, that I think is far more challenging than any kind of catechesis problem, and this is deeply engrained in the American psyche. (I know, I’m already saying stuff everyone knows.) That being said, I’m so thankful to God that I had some good teachers who presented what the Church teaches. It lays down a lot of groundwork preparing for conversion.

I think what the American Catholic psyche doesn’t understand is St. Paul’s message that our bodies are not our own, and that we are temples of the Holy Spirit. That is a powerful, powerful statement of our dignity, and turns all of our sexual ideology on its head.

Conversion is the work of the Holy Spirit. It can’t be forced, no matter how much I want people I love to encounter Christ! What I’ve found, in my case, is that it is best is to pray, present the gospel in word or deed, and leave it in God’s hands. I personally think we have to be prepared to really offer up any suffering we have. St. Monica and Augustine are common prayer-friends of mine.

 

[GangGreen]

JPII said that we have a crisis in the Church never seen before in its history. He called it a Global Apostasy. Are these statistics and various other surveys (include the Vatican’s own) not proof of what he said is true?

IMO, Pope Francis has been too ambiguous in his statements. Leaving too much open for interpretation. I like what he’s been talking about in terms of cleaning things up starting with the Bishops. However, he needs to start taking a firm stand on Catholic doctrine. These apostates are getting a false “hope” in that he’s going to change the Church in ways that just are not possible and should never even be considered. It’s time he firms up and tells the world how it is.