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MugenOne
Guest
Amen my brother! It is time to end this one way street known as Islam.
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jakasaki
Guest
Like is said… Just because they haven’t been used yet in Switzerland… IT DOES NOT mean they will not use them in the future when the muslim population is equal in numbers of the Swiss population.
It’s only a matter of time.
Perhaps you poster “Kadaveri” being a muslim can go to Saudi Arabia and build a Church for us Christians with a Cross on it, and like I said… forget the bells… we Christians DON’T NEED to be reminded when to attend the Chuch,
And YOU Kadaveri can help build many Churches in the huge land of SA, and allow Christians to practice their faith within their House of Worship, and hold their Bibles… and convince your islamic SA to do so, well then, I’ll have a change of heart.
Otherwise… God Bless the Swiss and may many other states & nations follow their path!
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1ke
Guest
Oh yeah, great logic there.
As if a majority wouldn’t be able to change the constitution and build all the minarets they please.
Ignorance abounds. Ugh!
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jakasaki
Guest
Very well - it is what it is.
I live in NY and where I am, in my part of area, none of this stuff with muslims and mosques & minarets exits.
But I’ve seen them in Manhattan protesting about islamic stuff, and stomping on OUR/MY US FLAG!
It’s only a matter of time.
Hey, here is a suggestion for you 1ke.
How about you go to Saudi Arabia and grab their SA flag in public view and stomp on it with your shoes.
But before you do that, why don’t you build a Church for the Christians. If you can accomplish that, I’ll stop being “a bigot” as you called me as well as being “ignorant” as you called me.
BTW, I’ll be in the background to see how long your head will stay on your body.
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trophybearer
Guest
I wish I could buy Switzerland a beer! 
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Kadaveri
Guest
I don’t think there’s much chance of Muslims (who now constitute 4% of the population) becoming a majority in Switzerland, unless you want to go for wacky anti-Muslim conspiracy theories.
And why the ‘YOU Kadaveri… and your islamic SA’? I’m a British Muslim, I have nothing to do with Saudi Arabia. If you want to try establishing a church there then I wish you all the best. I happen to not want Europe to become like Saudi Arabia (even if you seem to find this appealing). Especially since Europeans have this particularly nasty history of exterminating unpopular minorities. Most Swiss Muslims by the way are Bosnian or Albanian and came there after fleeing the anti-Muslim genocide in the Balkans by Milosevic, Karadzic etc.
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ralphinal
Guest
What are the rules on the call to prayer? What determins if they will be done or not?
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StrawberryJam
Guest
Is the tone here that as long as it is not a restriction on my religion in any way, it’s good?
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John_Larocque
Guest
The threats by Islamic militants should be met head on, as they are expressed in such things as the Nevsky terror attack, or those at Ford Hood. But what the Swiss are doing (and others in Europe) is not a reaction against that. These restrictions are a form of fascism and based on a fear of “the other.” And this isn’t the first time in European history that they have given into this impulse.
Secularism and legal restrictions against the practice of Islam are not a solution. In fact it should be bluntly stated that secularism (which is a materialist worldview) cannot compete with Islam. It would be better if Europe recovered its Christian identity.
Secularism and legal restrictions against the practice of Islam are not a solution. In fact it should be bluntly stated that secularism (which is a materialist worldview) cannot compete with Islam. It would be better if Europe recovered its Christian identity.
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StrawberryJam
Guest
Are you suggesting the popes for many years had fascist millitary protection by the Swiss guard and you did not object to that? I am outraged and scandalized sir.
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moondweller
Guest
So far it looks like their politicians are the only one’s who aren’t deadened by the “political correctness” that has plagued many countries in Europe and here in the U.S., which will eventually kill us.
When I see the majority of Muslims in the world protesting the religious restrictions in Saudi Arabia and other Islamic countries; and when I see the majority of Muslims in the world speaking out against Islamic radicals and actually turning their names in to the authorities, then maybe, just maybe, I might learn to trust a Muslim. Until then, I don’t, I can’t. Keep in mind “Islam” means surrender or submission. It’s not a religion of faith, but of submission. And when enough are gathered in a city or country they demand shri’a law be instituted. I say, “bravo” Switzerland. Don’t back down, don’t cave in. Look at the mess they have in London and Amsterdam. Remember, radicals are recruited from the rank and file.
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moondweller
Guest
Are you a British Muslim or a Muslim in Britain? There’s a difference.
Good! Then will you turn in the names of any radical Muslims you know of in your community?
I thought you said you’re “British?”
So they went there for protection, not to become Swiss. Many Muslims come to the west but they’re not of the West.
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planten
Guest
Well said.
That is also good. WE must all protest about such restrictions on religious freedom. Nowadays, there is a different (backward) interprettation of many Muslim principles, by the Muslim religious leaders. I am telling the real 2 principles.
- There is no compulsion in any religion. (Quran 2:256)
- Muslims are to protect the sanctity of all religious buildings of Hindus and christains and Budhists and Jews where the name of God is being remembered.
It is an old practice of calling people to prayer. It was done vocally from top of a minarate in the past. Nowadays, it is done by using the loudspeakers. I am sure that Muslims have to learn many good lessons.
There is no need to announce the call to prayers with loud voice on speakers nowadays. It was necessary in the very past to make a call. But now it is not necessary. There are good watches and clocks every where. The Muslims should be knowing the times of prayers. There need not be a shake up routine by use of loudspeakers in any country, (not needed even in Muslim countries.)
It is a sin to make a very loud call for prayers in any western country. There is no need. A just gentle low volume call ( symbolic call) may be made which is not disturbing to the public. Same should be done in Muslim countries. I am sure there are some sects of Muslims who are practicing that very low volume call in western countries.
The case of the minarate is valid. It is also symbolic and should not be forbidden. The height may be restricted. It would be the equivalent of a cross symbol on church buildings.
]quote]In days before electronics, these served a real purposes (both bell towers and minarets). Now they are more symbolic of the call to worship, but our Catholic Churches still ring the bells regularly. Would you support bans on Catholic bell towers or spires in new church construction? I think not, somehow.
The entire post of 1ke is the best balanced one. That is the good way of dealing with other faiths. I know that Muslims are misbehaving in many ways in western countries, to their own harm by their own hands.
They should not do that.When I was there for long time, I followed my religion but not so strictly. I never disturbed any one and nobody hurt me. I never had to tell a lie and there was no problem to me. All were happy with me. I even used to attend the very special religious functions of the Christians, not knowing they were Catholics or Protestants, functions such as X-mas and New Year.
Even now I go to greet the christian friends (in my Muslim country) on special days and have food with them ( some X=mas cake. etc.)
May Allah bless all souls to care and stand for tolerance.
P.S. jakasaki is switching from one idea to another, shifting in favor and against the minarates. It is better that a lenient way may please be taken and not consider all Muslims as fanatics. In that way they will reduce in numbers.
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Libertarian_FL
Guest
I will simply note the Swiss COURTS will very likely overturn this as a violation of religious rights and practice, since the government allows Christian Churches to have bell towers and crosses and Jewish holy places to have architectual uniqueness. That can be seen as practice of faith since its advertising. The call to prayer is another issue of public law making noise at too early an hour and the like.
At a personal note I find this offensive to have done, if Islamic elements are indeed dangerous then deal with them as they come up.
At a personal note I find this offensive to have done, if Islamic elements are indeed dangerous then deal with them as they come up.
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Kadaveri
Guest
I don’t answer such obscure questions. Ask whatever you mean properly.
I don’t have any reason to be handing in anyone’s names.
"Kadaveri:
I fail to see the issue.
Many immigrant groups did so to escape persecution in their own countries, that doesn’t mean it’s ok to persecute them in their new country. But the reason I reminded everyone of that was to refute this nonsense that Muslims are somehow the persecutors in Europe, when any rational analysis would illustrate the boot being on the other foot.
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ralphinal
Guest
Kadaveri,
What are the rules on the call to prayer? What determines if it will be done?
What are the rules on the call to prayer? What determines if it will be done?
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moondweller
Guest
How about secular buildings like the twin towers in N.Y. city. Especially when they’re fully occupied with men, women and children? Shouldn’t Muslims protect them?
Actually, it’s to the harm of others.
Interesting you call it your “Muslim country.” What country is that?
Then why did he give you some of the very intolerant verses in your Q’ran? What will you do when the Muslims in your “Muslim country” practice those intolerant verses toward the Christians, and maybe Jews, who live there? What will your Muslim government do?
I don’t understand the logic. How can one tell the difference between a fanatical (zealous) Muslim and a non-fanatical Muslim, before it’s too late?
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crazzeto
Guest
I don’t see how one can celebrate this, and I don’t see how you could possibly target fundamentalist muslims and not every muslim. There are fundamentalist Catholics out there beleive it or not, Catholics who beleieve in a 6 day creation and all that. How do you target them, and not the rest of Catholisism? And how is any ban on religious freedom a good thing? How much longer until uniquly christian archetecual points are banned as well. How about, no crosses in church? Because “funadmentalist churchs”, famous for “discrimination against gay people” have them. So we’re not trageting all Christians, we’re just targeting Christian fundamentalists by banning all crosses everywhere (sound familiar actually?).
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theistgal
Guest
Did you know some of the men, women and children in those buildings were Muslims? islam.about.com/blvictims.htm
Were they responsible for their own deaths?
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barb_finnegan
Guest
I ‘ditto’ that!
At last-a European nation willing to stand up against the Moslems!
:extrahappy:- Status