Synod on the Family survey and domestic violence.

[CharlieDoe]

I just participated in my diocese’s survey on the Synod on the Family.

I want to make sure that my Bishop and the Synod fathers know about the experience of being beaten by your father, watching him assault your mom, and having your childhood punctuated by parental arguments that involved yelling, screaming, throwing object and visits from the police.

I want them to know how that makes you feel about the “beauty of fatherhood” as an adult. How it makes you view divorce, contraception, and abortion as blessings, and the idea of a ‘happy family’ as a sick joke.

And I do hope they hear me.

 

[Lookingforjoy]

I’m so sorry you had those experiences. I hope they hear you as well.

 

[nodito]

CharlieDoe,

I’m so sorry for the suffering you endured.

What would be your ideal outcome of the synod if they take your comments under consideration? Is there something you feel they should be doing to help meet the needs of adults with a similar history?

 

[CharlieDoe]

That given a background like mine, that it’s totally understandable and acceptable to seek marriage without wanting children, and having a vasectomy to ensure it.

 

[Anglewannabe]

I too am terribly sorry about your past, but I do need to speak the truth in love

That given a background like mine, that it’s totally **understandable and acceptable **to seek marriage without wanting children, and having a vasectomy to ensure it.

Understandable, yes at first. But acceptable, NEVER. It is normal to be hurt, but the problem is, you seem to want to stay in that hurt. You don’t strike me as being at a point where you are ready to seek healing. And my heart bleeds for you. It is God’s love that heals us. It is not easy and it will require swallowing a lot of pride and giving up your right to resentment … however God can and does work miracles. It is NEVER acceptable, to have a vasectomy and go against God’s will. Shutting God out is ensuring He will never help you and giving the devil a great opportunity to make things worse

 

[CharlieDoe]

I It is not easy and it will require swallowing a lot of pride and giving up your right to resentment … however God can and does work miracles. It is NEVER acceptable, to have a vasectomy and go against God’s will. Shutting God out is ensuring He will never help you and giving the devil a great opportunity to make things worse

Yes, you’re right, I have no reason to be resentful at being beaten and threatened to be shot by my dad.

Is it true that the Church will always have more sympathy for abusers of children than the children who were abused?

I’m also terribly prideful. So prideful that my childhood makes me feel like I am damaged garbage who would be toxic to any potential child.

And, having a vasectomy will mean “God will never help me?” I had no idea that God worked that way.

Thanks for your concern.

 

[Xantippe]

Yes, you’re right, I have no reason to be resentful at being beaten and threatened to be shot by my dad.

Is it true that the Church will always have more sympathy for abusers of children than the children who were abused?

I’m also terribly prideful. So prideful that my childhood makes me feel like I am damaged garbage who would be toxic to any potential child.

And, having a vasectomy will mean “God will never help me?” I had no idea that God worked that way.

Thanks for your concern.

Do you think you’re in a good position to be a good husband? Because to me, it sounds like you have a lot of unresolved issues that will make life difficult for you and a future wife, kids or no kids. A wife is a person, too, and is vulnerable to toxicity.

What if it you discover that the woman you love wants kids more than anything else? Will you deprive her of children?

Also, if you date old enough women, children are a moot point. There would be nothing immoral about confining yourself to post-menopausal or nearly post-menopausal women.

And, come to think of it, your mental situation could be deemed a “serious reason” for delaying children. And as long as your mental situation continued to be the same, you would continue to have a serious reason.

But, as I said to begin with, you don’t sound like you’re in a position to be a good husband. To marry, you need to be in a place where you can see another human being’s pain, rather than being completely wrapped up in your own.

Good luck!

 

[7_Sorrows]

I too am terribly sorry about your past, but I do need to speak the truth in love

Understandable, yes at first. But acceptable, NEVER. It is normal to be hurt, but the problem is, you seem to want to stay in that hurt. You don’t strike me as being at a point where you are ready to seek healing. And my heart bleeds for you. It is God’s love that heals us. It is not easy and it will require swallowing a lot of pride and giving up your right to resentment … however God can and does work miracles. It is NEVER acceptable, to have a vasectomy and go against God’s will. Shutting God out is ensuring He will never help you and giving the devil a great opportunity to make things worse

I think you gave very good advice.

I hope the OP can learn to forgive his father and find peace so that he does not have to live a life filled with anger and bitterness.

 

[Anglewannabe]

Yes, you’re right, I have no reason to be resentful at being beaten and threatened to be shot by my dad…

You have reason to not go near your father. But holding the resentment is only creating bitterness in your heart

Is it true that the Church will always have more sympathy for abusers of children than the children who were abused?

No, the church forgives abusers and heals the abused. But it does not sound like you want the healing

I’m also terribly prideful. So prideful that my childhood makes me feel like I am damaged garbage who would be toxic to any potential child.

Pride always comes before a fall and refusing to forgive is often rooted in pride. If you don’t want children, you don’t have to marry

And, having a vasectomy will mean “God will never help me?” I had no idea that God worked that way. .

Unless you go to confession for having a vasectomy, then yes, you will be cut off from God’s graces

Thanks for your concern.

Sad that you don’t see my concern

 

[DarkLight]

There is a time in healing where we need to focus on ourselves. That is natural. When you are with an abuser, you cannot really tend to yourself, because your mind is always on keeping the abuser happy. You need time afterwards to take care of yourself and spend your energy on your healing.

But that is not the time for relationships. It doesn’t sound right now like where you are, is a good place to be in a relationship. And that’s ok - take the time to heal yourself first.

 

[technatrix]

OP, I think I responded to another thread you posted about this awhile back, but I’ve been where you are and I know it’s hard. It’s also hard for people who haven’t been there to really grasp the enormity of the damage.

I don’t have a dog in the contraceptive fight, but here’s the thing: From this and the last thread, it sounds like you’re really fixated on the vasectomy idea. You might want to consider that a vasectomy might be a bandaid for the fear of having kids, but it probably wont solve the underlying issues that make you so afraid. Isn’t it better to deal with the root of the problem than the symptom? It can be really hard, but it can help you put the past to bed a little bit and carry on with a more normal life. It’s very tempting to just close yourself off to everything that seems scary or too much to cope with at first. It’s a behavior that abused kids learn for self-preservation, but that doesn’t have to be your life as an adult, too. You can be open to experiences and change, if you want to be, and there are people along the way that can help you. It’s not something you have to go through alone.

Whichever direction you decide to go, I’d like to strongly encourage you to really think about what you’d want, deep down, if the fear wasn’t there. If you’re not already in therapy, you might want to give that a try, too. Unless you’re planning on getting married soon, the vasectomy can wait. You can always put the decision off, there’s no need to make it right now. I think your insights on growing up with domestic abuse can be valuable to other people as well. If you channel the pain you’re feeling into something productive, like volunteering or writing, even if its just behind the scenes stuff (I volunteer IT work pro bono for some programs for abused and at-risk kids, as I’m fidgety about kids as well) it can help ease your mind sometimes.

Either way, I hope you are able to find peace and come to a resolution that works for both your mental health and your faith.

 

[CharlieDoe]

Unless you go to confession for having a vasectomy, then yes, you will be cut off from God’s graces

So should I get a vasectomy and then go to confession?

 

[CharlieDoe]

There is a time in healing where we need to focus on ourselves. That is natural. When you are with an abuser, you cannot really tend to yourself, because your mind is always on keeping the abuser happy. You need time afterwards to take care of yourself and spend your energy on your healing.

But that is not the time for relationships. It doesn’t sound right now like where you are, is a good place to be in a relationship. And that’s ok - take the time to heal yourself first.

Thanks DarkLight. If this was just a fleeting thing that could be resolved with a bit of therapy, that would be one thing. But I’m 33 now; my parents divorced when I was 12 and my dad died when I was 16. I know that makes it sound like just a brief spell a very long time ago, but it’s pretty much seared in me how I feel about the idea of fatherhood.

 

[Xantippe]

So should I get a vasectomy and then go to confession?

If there’s no serious lady friend on the horizon, why rush to do something you may regret?

Also, please do therapy so that you can learn not to abuse your future girlfriend or wife. (I would suggest reading Why Does He Do That? as a primer in what behaviors to avoid.)

A lot of people also really like the works of John Gottman, the marriage guy.

gottmanblog.com/archives/2015/2/10/3-research-based-tips-for-a-happy-and-healthy-relationship

There’s a lot more to not abusing and hurting people than just not having kids.

I don’t have anything like your experiences, but my mom used to break kitchen implements (at least one wooden spoon and one spatula) on my sister and me when we were mouthy tweens and early teens. A horse quirt also eventually got repurposed for home discipline use. Here’s what a quirt looks like, if you’ve never seen one:

chicksaddlery.com/page/CDS/PROD/1099/2401

I’m happy to report that my kids are 12, 10 and 2, and I have NEVER broken any item on them, I’ve never used a horse whip on them, and I have no plans to.

We don’t need to relive the past. If we think about what went wrong in the past, think about it, and work on it, we can do better.

 

[CharlieDoe]

http://www.sjleather.com/osCommerce/images/plain_flogger.jpg

Here’s a pic of what my dad had. Basically just like this, but the handle was real wood and the leather strips were wider, longer and maroon-colored.

Great instrument for putting the fear of God in a 7-year old, don’t you think?

Another rule of thumb I remember my dad having was if you weren’t screaming and in tears, he wasn’t beating you hard enough.

And if you were, he’d mock you for being “a p-----y.” See, a real father knows that scourging need not only be physical, but emotional and psychogical as well.

And then my dad would be upset why I’d prefer to spend time with my mom, since that made me a ‘mama’s boy.’ I guess it goes hand-in-hand with being a p-----y.

 

[CharlieDoe]

Also, please do therapy so that you can learn not to abuse your future girlfriend or wife. (I would suggest reading Why Does He Do That? as a primer in what behaviors to avoid.)

I know you mean this out of kindness and concern, but there really are few things crueler than suggesting that I’d hurt a partner of mine. I’ve been in dating relationships, some lasting a few months up to 4 1/2 years, and I’ve never so much as spoke angrily to any of them.

The ex-fiancee did throw a rolled-up ball of socks at me once, but that was like the week we broke up.

 

[Bruised_Reed]

Thanks DarkLight. If this was just a fleeting thing that could be resolved with a bit of therapy, that would be one thing. But I’m 33 now; my parents divorced when I was 12 and my dad died when I was 16. I know that makes it sound like just a brief spell a very long time ago, but it’s pretty much seared in me how I feel about the idea of fatherhood.

I’m sorry that you experienced such severe abuse. It’s something I hear about everyday and I never stop being stunned by what parents do to their children or adults do to their partners or parents.

Please consider therapy and maybe going on a Grief to Grace retreat. It was founded by the the same couple that founded Rachel’s Vineyard.

This program is meant to serve all adults and teens who have suffered from the scourge of abuse or neglect, whether it be physical, emotional, or sexual abuse. This includes, but is not limited to individuals who have been abused by family members, relatives and others. Grief to Grace addresses the resulting psychological, emotional and spiritual trauma.

I suggest this so you may heal and you can experience hope and not be robbed of it by triggered pain and anger.

ETA: And I hope that what you shared on the survey will be heard and addressed.

 

[CharlieDoe]

I’m sorry that you experienced such severe abuse. It’s something I hear about everyday and I never stop being stunned by what parents do to their children or adults do to their partners or parents.

Please consider therapy and maybe going on a Grief to Grace retreat. It was founded by the the same couple that founded Rachel’s Vineyard.

I suggest this so you may heal and you can experience hope and not be robbed of it by triggered pain and anger.

ETA: And I hope that what you shared on the survey will be heard and addressed.

Thanks Bruised

 

[Bruised_Reed]

Thanks Bruised

You are welcome. You’ll be in my thoughts and prayers.

 

[Xantippe]

I know you mean this out of kindness and concern, but there really are few things crueler than suggesting that I’d hurt a partner of mine. I’ve been in dating relationships, some lasting a few months up to 4 1/2 years, and I’ve never so much as spoke angrily to any of them.

The ex-fiancee did throw a rolled-up ball of socks at me once, but that was like the week we broke up.

There are lots of ways to hurt people that don’t involve hitting or yelling. I would actually advise reading Why Does He Do That to just about anybody (aside from actual abusers, of course–apparently some of them treat it as a how-to manual). The book is specifically about the male abuser, but I read it myself years ago and realized that some of my own behaviors were very bad.

Here’s a long check-list here, very few of the items on which are hitting or yelling:

abuse-against-women.com/abuse_checklist.html

I’ve personally come to think that a lot of otherwise OK relationships have elements from those abuse checklists, and that it’s a good idea to occasionally have a look and see what behaviors to prune back.

Also, even if you yourself are 100% non-abusive, you are still in some (probably A LOT) of danger of entering an abusive relationship, perhaps without even realizing how bad it is (because, hey, no hitting or yelling!).

Also, it’s quite possible that if you’ve literally never spoken angrily to a significant other and you’re 30-something, that you may need to learn how to deal with conflict productively. It may well be the case that your style of conflict is every bit as harmful to the relationship as yelling or being openly angry. “We never argue!” is a huge red flag for a relationship.

“I am a husband in a troubled marriage and though I’m still working out the details of where we all went wrong, I do believe the #1 thing that contributed to the problems was the inability of either of us to “fight”. We’d swallow it up, move on, and the resentment would just build…”

enotalone.com/forum/showthread.php?t=342709