J
jimmy
Guest
Well, St. Thomas More wrote his Eutopia in around 1500 AD so that predates the secular enlightenment. Nil Sorsky also taught it in the 15th or 16th century.
- Status
P
pro_universal
Guest
Interesting. If this interpretation of the verse is correct, how come no member of the Church noticed for two thousand years?
When did the Church ever condemn instituting the death penalty for heresy?
Looks to me like either you have got this verse wrong, or the Church was in error for all that time (if it’s even given up the teachings on banning heresy).
P
pro_universal
Guest
Find me a current Catholic source that says banning heresy is wrong. And that free speech must be enshrined by Christians in their governments.
E
exoflare
Guest
NO!!!But when you talk with and work with and share life with the muslims around you, don’t you find that the extremists are to them as those self-proclaimed christians in the north of Ireland have been to me (in Scotland) all these years?
This is what I have been trying to tell people lately, and I had to learn it the hard way. Most Muslims will at least make the effort to put on some “peaceful” mask when they are the minority in a country. But try talking/listening to them about these issues enough and you start to realize that their true empathy lies with fellow Muslims no matter what the case… even when the Muslim in question is some kind of an extremist.
J
jimmy
Guest
It is the Catholic Church that came up with the idea of seperation of church and state. Gregory the great is one who supported this idea. As I said above, so was St. Thomas More. Read his Eutopia. Banning heresy? It depends what you mean. Banning abortion is fine, but to say 'No one is allowed to practice x religion anymore" is wrong.
It is the Catholic Church that came up with the idea of free speech.
P
pro_universal
Guest
Oh Lord…we have someone condemning Islam based on mind reading of “muslims’ true empathy.”
Truly we are lost. What’s next? Predicting wars based on numerology, choosing random dates from Islamic calendars?
W
Wolseley
Guest
Seems that the French government is willing to condemn those making the threats, but they aren’t willing to lift a finger to do anything to prevent the threats from being carried out, or about the violation of their own laws. Instead, all they’re doing is helping the poor guy hide from them.
P
pro_universal
Guest
What???
D
Darrel
Guest
Am I supposed to defend the Church here? Your acting like "oooooohhhhh, see,… I caught the Church in an ERROR!!!.
Well congrats to you my dear friend! The Church has made a billion errors. I would imagine it’s because Jesus was the only perfect man who ever lived. JP2 made an appology for the crusades. Humanity is about progress not perfection.
-D
J
jimmy
Guest
What?
P
pro_universal
Guest
It’s not just one error of many. The prohibition on heresy is long and well estalished.
Where did the Church repudiate its stance on restricting Christian speech? I’d like to see it.
E
exoflare
Guest
I put pro_jihad on my block list a long time ago, but I see he’s back trying to derail the conversation again. Isn’t it funny how he cannot defend these things, so all he can do is go into bashing Christianity? This is the typical Muslim response, though, but I guess maybe he figures he blew his cover a long time ago.
Seriously guys, try to keep him on topic and just ignore all those little tangents he tries to bring in about Christianity. It’s because he has no defense for the acts of his own cult so he doesn’t want to talk about it.
Seriously guys, try to keep him on topic and just ignore all those little tangents he tries to bring in about Christianity. It’s because he has no defense for the acts of his own cult so he doesn’t want to talk about it.
J
jimmy
Guest
The death penalty has not been used for heresy except between the 14th and 16th centuries. Other than those three centuries it has not been a real issue. On the otherhand, it is a precept of the muslim religion that those who reject it will be killed. Muslims have practiced it for all of their existence. So, it looks to me that you have distorted history.
J
jimmy
Guest
I have given you sources for free speech and you refuse to acknowledge them. This shows your dishonesty.
D
Darrel
Guest
I don’t know. And it’s not realy an issue I care to study up on. Sorry but you will have to do your own research for the answer. One question though, does your forum name mean pro Catholic?
-D
P
pro_universal
Guest
It does. I made it when I was Catholic.
As far as I can tell, the Church has never embraced free speech on this point.
D
Darrel
Guest
I don’t see this deception in the guys name as OK. I would be offensive if I came in here named pro_Islam and started bashing all Muslims.
-D
D
Darrel
Guest
It seems like you are not actually debating anything at all here. It seems more like you are just disrupting this thread with a ton irrelivant rantings. No matter what you say here in this forum or any other, you can do it without going into hiding like this teacher did.
You should get a name change, it would be offensive if I named myself pro_islam and then bashed islam. I would imagine that if I converted over to Islam the first thing I would do is change my Catholic name here out of respect for the Prophet. I find your name offensive, much like the Danish cartoon was offensive to you.
-D
J
jimmy
Guest
Yes, heresy is prohibited and the Church does not repudiate that it is prohibited but the Church has been firm on its teaching of free will. Freedom of religion is a Christian thing. This is one of the main themes of St Thomas’s Eutopia, freedom of religion.
D
Darrel
Guest
Great point,
I think it boils down to the idea that God allows us free will and freedom to choose him or not. Our systems in government made by men should reflect this same freedom being given to each other that God gives us. Islam removes the freedom that God gives in his name. Which detracts from Islams validity.
-D
- Status