Telling a lie you already planned telling

[Amandylinee]

Hi everyone,
I struggle with scrupulosity so please bear with me.
I noticed on an examination of conscience that telling a large, premeditated lie is a mortal sin. I worked at this one place a while back and this guy knew I was single, so he kept trying to give me his phone number. I was not interested. I worked there again recently, and before doing so I knew I had a very good chance of seeing him. I decided I would just tell him I have a boyfriend although I don’t . I then read what the examination of conscience said; I ask my mother and explained it to her and she said telling that lie would not be mortal sin. I thought about it and still wondered if that specifically was mortal sin in my situation despite what the examination of conscience said. I ended up working with him and I mentioned how a relative of mine just got engaged, thinking there might be a possibility of him asking me if I had a boyfriend. Of course, I didn’t want him to ask me this but I guess it was more for the sake of small talk/conversation, I guess? I don’t know. But then he asked me if I was still single and I said no. I premeditated this lie. Was this a mortal sin?

 

[Amandylinee]

Also, when you’re scrupulous, is committing a venial sin you believed to be mortal although you weren’t 100% sure a mortal sin?? Someone please help me. I am so distraught by this.

 

[stephe1987]

Is that really a “big” lie, though? Yes, it’s a sin, you should really just tell him you’re not interested, but a little lie to save someone’s feelings from being hurt doesn’t seem like a mortal sin. It is not a grave matter. A grave matter would be lying saying you didn’t have a boyfriend/husband when you actually did (cheating).

A venial sin is not a mortal sin. Scrupulous people seem to think everything is a mortal sin, when in fact some things are venial sins.

 

[Amandylinee]

Thank you for your reply. In regards to the second part of your response- I read in different places before that if you think something’s a mortal sin that’s actually a venial sin and you commit it then it’s a mortal sin due to intentions. Is this different for scrupulous people as scrupulous people have a harder time discerning whether a sin is of grave matter or not?

 

[Nan_S]

Hi everyone,
I struggle with scrupulosity so please bear with me.
I noticed on an examination of conscience that telling a large, premeditated lie is a mortal sin. I worked at this one place a while back and this guy knew I was single, so he kept trying to give me his phone number. I was not interested… But then he asked me if I was still single and I said no. I premeditated this lie. Was this a mortal sin?

Do you have a copy of the Catechism of the Catholic Church? That will help you resolve most such moral delimmas.

You can find the Catechism at the Vatican’s website here: vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/_INDEX.HTM

You will also find an alphabetical concordance to the CCC here: vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/_FA.HTM

Using those two pages I quickly found what the Catechism has to say about lying:

2483 Lying is the most direct offense against the truth. To lie is to speak or act against the truth in order to lead into error someone who has the right to know the truth. By injuring man’s relation to truth and to his neighbor, a lie offends against the fundamental relation of man and of his word to the Lord.

2484 The gravity of a lie is measured against the nature of the truth it deforms, the circumstances, the intentions of the one who lies, and the harm suffered by its victims. If a lie in itself only constitutes a venial sin, it becomes mortal when it does grave injury to the virtues of justice and charity.

Now, given your scenario, I would have to ask myself whether the person who was asking me personal questions had a right to know. There are certainly a lot of people in this world who just leave a single girl feeling… uncomfortable… and unsafe. There are also questions which have no place being asked at a workplace; it’s called sexual harrassment, and it creates an unproductive working environment. Such questions themselves do grave injury to the virtues of justice and charity; they need not be dignified with an answer.

If my coworker used our physical proximity during working hours as an excuse to hit on me - and believe me, they have tried - probably the best answer is, “I’m sorry, I don’t discuss such matters on the job.” That won’t stop a determined fellow from asking you out after work, but the next answer is, “I’m sorry, I’m busy, and won’t be able to join you.” In most social situations no explanation is due or necessary; simply repeat the refusal as often as it takes for him to lose interest.

Then there are the creepazoids who don’t understand what “no” means even if you define it by striking them with an iron skillet. If I was asked by a creepazoid whether I had a boyfriend, whether I might be home alone tonight, and whether there was a window in my apartment which didn’t latch properly, do you think anyone would fault me for lying to him? If I told him anything it would probably be that my boyfriend was a former linebacker for the nearest pro football team, that I raised rottweilers and pit bulls, and that I lived in a gated community with 24-hour security.

And, no, even though I planned those answers a year in advance, reciting them would not be a mortal sin.

 

[Vico]

Thank you for your reply. In regards to the second part of your response- I read in different places before that if you think something’s a mortal sin that’s actually a venial sin and you commit it then it’s a mortal sin due to intentions. Is this different for scrupulous people as scrupulous people have a harder time discerning whether a sin is of grave matter or not?

The key to understanding the mortal sin is charity. When we sin seriously it is a lack of charity to God or to someone, or both. That is why, sometimes something done or omitted that is grave is not a mortal sin and something done or omitted that is not grave itself is a mortal sin. St. Thomas Aquinas wrote: “…he who sins venially neither does what the law forbids, nor omits what the law prescribes to be done; but he acts “beside” the law, through not observing the mode of reason, which the law intends.”
And"Nevertheless, since moral acts derive their character of goodness and malice, not only from their objects, but also from some disposition of the agent, as stated above (18, A4,6), it happens sometimes that a sin which is venial generically by reason of its object, becomes mortal on the part of the agent, either because he fixes his last end therein, or because he directs it to something that is a mortal sin in its own genus; for example, if a man direct an idle word to the commission of adultery. In like manner it may happen, on the part of the agent, that a sin generically mortal because venial, by reason of the act being imperfect, i.e. not deliberated by reason, which is the proper principle of an evil act, as we have said above in reference to sudden movements of unbelief. "
If you intentionally told a trivial lie to obtain another goal which you knew was grave, it would be mortal. Scandal can be like that, one can do something not sinful for you, but to encourage sin in another. (For example, invite a known alcoholic to drink with you, so you won’t be alone.)

There are hundreds of examples.

St. Thomas wrote on most of these issues, but is difficult to understand without study, because he was so analytical:

newadvent.org/summa/2088.htm#article4

 

[Nan_S]

Thank you for your reply. In regards to the second part of your response- I read in different places before that if you think something’s a mortal sin that’s actually a venial sin and you commit it then it’s a mortal sin due to intentions. Is this different for scrupulous people as scrupulous people have a harder time discerning whether a sin is of grave matter or not?

Now this question is quite different from fabricating a story to get rid of a creep who is hitting on you.

Fire requires three elements: heat, fuel, and oxygen. Subtract one of the three and you have no fire. Mortal sin likewise requires three elements. Once again, here’s the Catechism:

1857 For a sin to be mortal, three conditions must together be met: "Mortal sin is sin whose object is grave matter and which is also committed with full knowledge and deliberate consent."

1858 Grave matter is specified by the Ten Commandments, corresponding to the answer of Jesus to the rich young man: “Do not kill, Do not commit adultery, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Do not defraud, Honor your father and your mother.” The gravity of sins is more or less great: murder is graver than theft. One must also take into account who is wronged: violence against parents is in itself graver than violence against a stranger.

1859 Mortal sin requires full knowledge and complete consent. It presupposes knowledge of the sinful character of the act, of its opposition to God’s law. It also implies a consent sufficiently deliberate to be a personal choice. Feigned ignorance and hardness of heart do not diminish, but rather increase, the voluntary character of a sin.

Getting back to scrupulosity: Imagine that you believed chewing gum in Mrs. McMiller’s english class was a mortal sin, but you decided to do it anyway. Well that certainly is a violation of Mrs. McMiller’s classroom rules, but you’d be hard pressed to argue chewing gum was a serious enough offense to be considered “grave matter,” no matter how intolerant she was. BUT there is another problem here. You genuinely believed something - whatever it was - happened to be a mortal sin, and you deliberately did it anyway. The willful performance of any act you genuinely believe to be gravely wrong is in itself a grave decision - a mortal sin against the Holy Spirit - even though the actual deed might be trivial.

How do you resolve the problem? Before you act, find out whether the deed would be considered “grave matter.” Know what you’re getting yourself into before you do something stupid.