Terrorism Is Alien to Islam

[pro_universal]

Don’t be ridiculous. It just seems that people should put their money where their mouths are. If it is true that Muslims speak out against terrorism, then let them speak out to the terrorists. Let them condemn the terrorists.

Please name one Al Qaeda figure who was captured without the aid of Muslims. It looks to me, given the arrestees, that not only are Muslims speaking out…they’re actually helping to catch terrorists (and risking their lives to do it, since they live in places where the government can’t protect them.)

Instead, Muslims such as yourself come here and admonish Catholics for thinking Islam is a violent religion. Irrational.

For at least the tenth time, I am not Muslim.

Every once in a very great while a fatwa is published in a paper. It is the opinion of one group, published very rarely, condemning terrorism, and is simply not binding on the Islamic community. This is good. It is a start. But it is not nearly enough to undo the damage done. The damage has been done, not just to Christians, but to atheists, Jews or any other person riding on a subway or sitting in the WTC, The damage has been done to Islam. Because now people really, really, really, do not like Islam.

Okay, what do you want exactly? Muslims are the main source of intelligence on terrorists, and almost every single terror leader who has been captured or killed has met his fate because a Muslim told US authorities where he was.

And what do Muslims get in return for this? People like you claiming that they don’t do anything.

So it would make sense for Muslims to not come here and admonish Catholics for thinking Islam upholds terrorism and instead spend their time teaching their brothers and sisters the supposed peace tenets of their religion, now wouldn’t it?
We have thousands dead by terrorist actions. One fatwa published by one group not binding on Islam as a whole is hardly an impressive turnout.

How many Iraqis and Afghanis have died because of terrorism? It’s incredible that you would think the American dead are the only ones in this “war on terror”…Iraqis die in greater numbers every month due to terrorism.

And guess what? They are laying their lives on the line to fight it, and they sacrifice every day because of it. In return, they are getting nothing but insults to their religion from the West. Not exactly encouraging or proof that the west cares about stopping all terrorism, is it?

It’s not just one fatwa by the way…every single major Islamic group has condemned terrorism. And I mean every last one. If you can find a group that doesn’t condemn terrorism besides Al Qaeda, I’d sure like to see it.

 

[Wolseley]

The hype surrounding Islam has gone so far that we have people on Catholic forums fantasizing about meeting “them mooslims!” on a battlefield:

Wow…just, wow.

There are those of us who don’t buy the usual liberal hype, and we certainly don’t buy the “pacifism at all costs” B.S. And I suspect there are more of us than you suspect.

If “them mooslims”, to use your term, want to change the perception they have, then let them start parading in the streets to condemn terrorists, and start screaming and chanting outside their mosques in support of the Pope, instead of calling for his head. Let them start flying US (or British, or Danish, or French)flags and enlisting in the armed forces. Let them start identifying themselves as Americans (or Britons, or Danes, or Frenchmen)who happen to be Muslims, instead of Muslims who live in America (Britian, Denmark, France).

If they don’t want to do this, them they shouldn’t be surprised that there are those of us who regard them like a calf does a new gate. As has been pointed out, actions speak louder than words.

 

[pro_universal]

Muslims are respectful? Really? Here is a typical example of the emails sent to FFI by peaceful “respectful” Muslims!

Wow, I never thought this would happen…but it looks like for the first time ever, a general claim about a religion shared by a billion people was proved beyond a doubt by an anonymous email sent to an anti-Islamic website.

Blew my hair back. I never knew points could be proven this way. I have to hand it to you booklover, you proved that Islam is not respectful beyond a doubt. This is perhaps the most convincing post I have ever read.

Errr…Not.

 

[Ella]

I guess it’s not too surprising that people are shooting at mosques in the US now, and throwing bullet ridden copies of the Quran at their doorsteps.

Scary times, to say the least. All I have to say at this point is: if people really start to take you all seriously in your claims about Islam, they are going to start wanting a “final solution” to the “muslim problem”…and I don’t expect you’ll all suddenly change your tunes to defend Muslims from that “solution.”

Godwin’s Law, Pro?

Anyway, I have a great ‘final solution’ for the Muslim, Christian, Buddhist, Hindu, Voodoo, Wiccan, Zoroastrian, did I forget a few, religous communities of the world. How about religous freedom for everyone?

Didn’t Osama’s hatred of the US start because the Saudis let non-muslim US soldiers on Saudi lands? Who could have anticipated this response to that decision?

 

[pro_universal]

Let them start flying US (or British, or Danish, or French)flags and enlisting in the armed forces. Let them start identifying themselves as Americans (or Britons, or Danes, or Frenchmen)who happen to be Muslims, instead of Muslims who live in America (Britian, Denmark, France).

Are you seriously claiming that Muslims don’t enter the armed forces??? Are you American? You can see for yourself that they do…the US army even has Sheikhs to minister to its Muslim members.

If they don’t want to do this, them they shouldn’t be surprised that there are those of us who regard them like a calf does a new gate. As has been pointed out, actions speak louder than words.

The problem is that your words don’t take account of the actions.

 

[ferdie]

They certainly are a respectful people, but you won’t see that because all of your information appears to be coming from websites dedicated to defaming Islam.

I don’t get or read my information from any website. Mine is from expereince and just basically watching the news. There are some moderate muslims speaking aginst violence, but I’m still looking for the 90% plus peaceful muslims to come out.

 

[pro_universal]

Godwin’s Law, Pro?

Anyway, I have a great ‘final solution’ for the Muslim, Christian, Buddhist, Hindu, Voodoo, Wiccan, Zoroastrian, did I forget a few, religous communities of the world. How about religous freedom for everyone?

Didn’t Osama’s hatred of the US start because the Saudis let non-muslim US soldiers on Saudi lands? Who could have anticipated this response to that decision?

Well, let’s see…sending troops to support an unpopular regime that uses torture against political dissidents?

Yeah, who could have guessed that the militants would be so mad about that!

 

[pro_universal]

I don’t get or read my information from any website. Mine is from expereince and just basically watching the news. There are some moderate muslims speaking aginst violence, but I’m still looking for the 90% plus peaceful muslims to come out.

 

[tequilamac]

Please name one Al Qaeda figure who was captured without the aid of Muslims. It looks to me, given the arrestees, that not only are Muslims speaking out…they’re actually helping to catch terrorists (and risking their lives to do it, since they live in places where the government can’t protect them.)

For at least the tenth time, I am not Muslim.

Okay, what do you want exactly? Muslims are the main source of intelligence on terrorists, and almost every single terror leader who has been captured or killed has met his fate because a Muslim told US authorities where he was.

And what do Muslims get in return for this? People like you claiming that they don’t do anything.

How many Iraqis and Afghanis have died because of terrorism? It’s incredible that you would think the American dead are the only ones in this “war on terror”…Iraqis die in greater numbers every month due to terrorism.

And guess what? They are laying their lives on the line to fight it, and they sacrifice every day because of it. In return, they are getting nothing but insults to their religion from the West. Not exactly encouraging or proof that the west cares about stopping all terrorism, is it?

It’s not just one fatwa by the way…every single major Islamic group has condemned terrorism. And I mean every last one. If you can find a group that doesn’t condemn terrorism besides Al Qaeda, I’d sure like to see it.

I’m sorry for calling you a Muslim. I forgot you were currently claiming to be apostate.

Irrational argument again. This is a Catholic forum headquartered in El Cajon, California. Therefore when someone comes here to convince us that in spite of issuing death threats, fatwas and violence against the Pope, Islam is a peace loving religion with one fatwa issued against terrorism, I am not discussing violence elsewhere.
Which leads to another question. Which fatwa are we supposed to believe? The fatwas against violence or the fatwas for violence? Which Islam are we supposed to believe? The ones killing every non muslim or the ones issuing polite fatwas in the paper?
Why am I asking you? You are not Catholic or Muslim. Irrational.

 

[ferdie]

quote=pro_universal;1521017]Please name one Al Qaeda figure who was captured without the aid of Muslims. It looks to me, given the arrestees, that not only are Muslims speaking out…they’re actually helping to catch terrorists (and risking their lives to do it, since they live in places where the government can’t protect them.)

For at least the tenth time, I am not Muslim.

Okay, what do you want exactly? Muslims are the main source of intelligence on terrorists, and almost every single terror leader who has been captured or killed has met his fate because a Muslim told US authorities where he was.

And what do Muslims get in return for this? People like you claiming that they don’t do anything.

How many Iraqis and Afghanis have died because of terrorism? It’s incredible that you would think the American dead are the only ones in this “war on terror”…Iraqis die in greater numbers every month due to terrorism.

And guess what? They are laying their lives on the line to fight it, and they sacrifice every day because of it. In return, they are getting nothing but insults to their religion from the West. Not exactly encouraging or proof that the west cares about stopping all terrorism, is it?

It’s not just one fatwa by the way…every single major Islamic group has condemned terrorism. And I mean every last one. If you can find a group that doesn’t condemn terrorism besides Al Qaeda, I’d sure like to see it.

Where will this extremist hide other than muslim environment? As we have told you before, there are muslims who are moderate and do not share the ideas of these extremist. TRhey are the ones who are helping out. But then again maybe they helping out because of financial reasonsn not becasue they are moderate.

 

[pro_universal]

Therefore when someone comes here to convince us that in spite of issuing death threats, fatwas and violence against the Pope, Islam is a peace loving religion with one fatwa issued against terrorism, I am not discussing violence elsewhere.

Okay, so let me get this straight: When you see a fatwa condemning terrorism, it’s “not binding on Islam and sent out by some group no one’s ever heard of.”

But when you read a “fatwa” against the Pope, that speaks for all of Islam?

Do you see the double standard? All bad speaks for all of Islam; all good doesn’t speak for any of Islam. Right.

Which leads to another question. Which fatwa are we supposed to believe? The fatwas against violence or the fatwas for violence? Which Islam are we supposed to believe? The ones killing every non muslim or the ones issuing polite fatwas in the paper?
Why am I asking you? You are not Catholic or Muslim. Irrational.

Just take the majority. Virtually every last Muslim organization has condemned terrorism. If you don’t believe me, just try to find one that hasn’t besides Al Qaeda itself.

Where are all these “violent fatwas” at? I’d like to see them.

 

[jburgherr]

Wait…here’s a guy posting that terrorism is alien to Islam, and you want him to embrace terrorists as his brothers and sisters?

Why would he do that if he thinks terrorism is anti-Islamic?

And isn’t saying that these people do not follow God’s commands a pretty big admonishment?

Strange…so many go around claiming that no Muslims speak out against terrorism, yet, whenever a Muslim posts on this board that terrorism is against Islam, those same people are quick to say “Then how come no one is speaking out!”

They always do, it’s just that you’re not listening

It is not for us to be the ones listening!!!

The people who are not listening are the ones in that go to thier Mosque, listen to inflamatory rhetoric spouted by thier Imamms…and then strap bombs to their chest and go blow themselves taking innocent Women and Children with them. Or highjack planes and run them into buildings…or behead people who don’t believe as they do… on and on.

These Islamic men and women do this intentionally. They do this at the bequest of thier religion. They do this because they think they will be rewarded by a vengeful God who gives them heavenly virgins as thier reward.

Theses actions in the name of Islam must stop. Then we believe your words.

Not until then!!

 

[pro_universal]

ferdie:
Where will this extremist hide other than muslim environment? As we have told you before, there are muslims who are moderate and do not share the ideas of these extremist. TRhey are the ones who are helping out. But then again maybe they helping out because of financial reasonsn not becasue they are moderate.

Okay, where do drug dealers and gang members hide?

Does that mean that all countries with drug dealers and gang members support gangs and drugs?

And that the only reason gangs and drugs ever get busted by police is for a “financial reason”?

 

[tequilamac]

Okay, so let me get this straight: When you see a fatwa condemning terrorism, it’s “not binding on Islam and sent out by some group no one’s ever heard of.”

But when you read a “fatwa” against the Pope, that speaks for all of Islam?

Do you see the double standard? All bad speaks for all of Islam; all good doesn’t speak for any of Islam. Right.

Just take the majority. Virtually every last Muslim organization has condemned terrorism. If you don’t believe me, just try to find one that hasn’t besides Al Qaeda itself.

Where are all these “violent fatwas” at? I’d like to see them.

Google then. What is stopping you? But now we are supposed to take your word for things, now pro universal? What is your authority? On what grounds of knowledge do you speak? You have rejected Islam and Catholicism. You are bvetween religions. If you do not know what to think, how can we follow you?

 

[Ella]

Well, let’s see…sending troops to support an unpopular regime that uses torture against political dissidents?

Yeah, who could have guessed that the militants would be so mad about that!

That is not what Osama said was his reason for being mad at the US. Osama said it was because non-muslims were allowed on Saudi (holy) soil.

 

[pro_universal]

Google then. What is stopping you? But now we are supposed to take your word for things, now pro universal? What is your authority? On what grounds of knowledge do you speak? You have rejected Islam and Catholicism. You are bvetween religions. If you do not know what to think, how can we follow you?

I have done the research. I am telling you right now that if you go looking, you will spend a long time trying to find an Islamic group that doesn’t condemn terror.

Almost every single one does.

I rejected Catholicism, I am studying more about Islam. The fact that I don’t accept it doesn’t mean you can’t go and find some information to support your claim, nor does it mean that I can’t claim something about the religion’s adherents.

These statements are public…almost every last muslim organization on the planet condemns terrorism. My beliefs and your beliefs do not in any way alter that fact.

If you want to keep claiming that it doesn’t, just go ahead and find a Muslim organization that doesn’t.

EDIT: Here’s a long list of condemnations to get you started: unc.edu/~kurzman/terror.htm

 

[pro_universal]

That is not what Osama said was his reason for being mad at the US. Osama said it was because non-muslims were allowed on Saudi (holy) soil.

Really? Let’s see Osama’s speech where he says this.

 

[Wolseley]

Are you seriously claiming that Muslims don’t enter the armed forces???

Not the ones who stand out in front of Catholic churches parading signs with lovely sentiments like “Behead those who insult Islam”.

Are you American?

Are you?

The problem is that your words don’t take account of the actions.

No, the problem (again) is that their actions (parading signs calling for beheadment, rioting, burning down buildings, blowing up cars, demanding special treatment) speak louder than their words (which are, for the most part, total silence).

 

[cestusdei]

Oh the poor misunderstood Muslims. They riot and kill Christians without let and hindrance, but when they move to the USA they can’t do it anymore. But if someone even looks at their mosque wrong then suddenly they are again the VICTIMS. It is amazing how Muslims insist they are the victim while they chop off Christian heads.

 

[ferdie]

But it is the moderate muslims who says that less thasn 1% of the muslim population are extremists. What about the muslims we see on televison in a lot of Arab countries marching and insulting the christian religion? Why can’t we seethe so called 90% plus peaceful muslims? Don’t forget Indonesia has over 100 Million muslims.