Tertiary and Oblate info needed

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Hello all,

Are there any folks checking into the CA Forums on a regular basis who can give me bit of insight into the vocation of tertiary members of orders such as the Dominican, Carmelite or Franciscan Orders, or the Oblate vocation in the Benedictine family?

Specifically, I’d like to know what your commitment involves, what sort of initial discernment or formation is necessary prior to being admitted, how the formation is carried out once you have been accepted as a tertiary or an oblate, when the commitment is considered permanent etc.

I have been pondering ways of deepening my relationship with God in some sort of formal, vocational commitment for quite some time now. I do not believe that I have a vocation to either married life or to the priesthood, and while I have certainly considered religious life, several financial obligations (i.e., debts) currently make it impossible for me to pursue that avenue. Plus, I am not really sure that God is calling me to conventual or monastic life.

The most likely scenario as far as I can tell right now is to carry on as I have for years: as a celibate layman. And yet I do feel something of a need for the support and guidance of a community.

I would just like to know some folks’ experience in order to pray and continue discerning. Anything you have to offer would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks and God bless!
 
Moneo said:
Hello all,

Are there any folks checking into the CA Forums on a regular basis who can give me bit of insight into the vocation of tertiary members of orders such as the Dominican, Carmelite or Franciscan Orders, or the Oblate vocation in the Benedictine family?

Specifically, I’d like to know what your commitment involves, what sort of initial discernment or formation is necessary prior to being admitted, how the formation is carried out once you have been accepted as a tertiary or an oblate, when the commitment is considered permanent etc… . .
Click to expand...
Regarding the Secular Discalced Carmelites (I’ve been a member for almost thirty years), your first step, of course, is to find a local Community to visit to see if you are attracted to what you find there. (I knew I was “home” from my first visit. 🙂 )Your next step if you think you might have a vocation to the Order is to apply to enter into the Aspirancy program which will entail twelve months of preparation to be received into Formation in the Order; during the ceremony of Admission you will receive the Brown Scapular which is the habit of the Secular Discalced Carmelite (a large ceremonial Scapular is usually given; a smaller one worn at all other times times).

Over the following years there will be continuing discernment by you and the officers of the Community; if there is mutual agreement that that this is where the Lord is calling you, then you will make a Temporary Promise after 2 years of regular attendance at the monthly meeting. After another three years you would then be eligible to make the Definitive Promise.

In joining we make the commitment to:
  1. Attend daily Mass when possible.
  2. Attend monthly meeting of the Community
  3. Devote at least ½ hour to mental prayer
  4. Make regular use of the Sacrament of Penance
  5. Join with the Church in praying Morning and Evening Prayer of the Liturgy of the Hours (and Night Prayer, if possible).
  6. Have a daily devotion to Our Lady
  7. Participate in the apostolate of the Community
In joining a Secular (Third) Order one is responding to a vocation. So discernment, as you know, is necessary first to see if God is calling one to follow a Rule of Life and, secondly and most importantly, which religious Order expresses the spiritual life to which one believes him or herself called? For me it was the Secular Order of Discalced Carmelites because of the Order’s vocation to tend toward contemplative prayer in the heart of the Church.

Though one may believe oneself to be called to an Order, one’s vocation also must be discerned by the particular Community of the Order which one is seeking to join. After permission is grant to pursue a vocation within a Secular Order, there remains ongoing discernment both by the candidate and the Community before a Definitive Promise may be made.

continued. . .
 
Some things we asked those discerning membership (and also for members who had not yet made their Definitive Promise) to consider were:
  • Do I cherish the Gospel and desire to imitate Christ?
  • Are there any impediments to my following the Rule of Life of the Secular Order of Discalced Carmelites? (Family obligations; unable to receive the Sacraments)
  • Do I desire to follow the Rule with my whole heart?
  • Do I desire, and am I able, to attend the monthly meeting?
  • Do I desire, and can I commit myself, to a life of prayer in union with Christ and His Church?
  • Do I see my life of prayer as the way of bringing Christ into all aspects of my life?
  • Do I desire to grow in the self-knowledge which is humility?
  • Am I seeking the exotic (extraordinary experiences/manifestations) or the substantial (living by Faith and not by sight)?
  • Am I attracted to the Saints of the Order?
  • Do I desire to grow through the writings of the Saints of the Order in my knowledge of the life of union with God?
  • Will I do the reading and the assignments required?
  • Do I want to teach - or to learn?
  • Does what I hear and learn at the meetings correspond to the desires of my heart?
  • As a result of my entering into the way of Carmel, do I find I am living the Gospel more perfectly?
  • As a result of my entering into the way of Carmel, is Christ becoming more and more the center of my life?
  • Do I recognize that I am truly a part of the family of Carmel?
  • Do I see that I am growing slowly, but surely, in this way of life?
  • Do I believe I can accurately describe the vocation of Carmel, its obligations and its mission in the Church and in the world?
  • Have I allowed the Blessed Virgin Mary, Mother of Carmel, to enter into my life under as my mother and teacher and?
  • Do I desire to serve Christ’s Mystical Body, His Church, taking the Blessed Virgin as my model for this service?
  • Do I recognize within myself the call of the Holy Spirit to tend to meditative/contemplative prayer?
  • Do I recognize that a meditative/contemplative prayer life is not just for my own sake, but for the sake of the whole Body of Christ?
  • Am I zealous for the Lord God of Hosts and for His One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church?
  • Do I know and delight in the Carmelite heritage?
  • Do I see the Order as another pious group to join, or do I recognize that I am responding to a vocation given to me by God?
Am I desirous and willing to make a life-long commitment to the Secular Order of Discalced Carmelites?

Here are a few links for you.

ourgardenofcarmel.org/links.html

ocd.pcn.net/index_en.htm

ocdsrose.com

helpfellowship.org/OCDS%20Lessons/Lesson%2015.htm

God bless you in your discernment process to wherever the Lord is calling you!
 
FCEGM,

Thank you for taking the time to respond so thoroughly to my question. That is exactly the sort of information I was looking for! Bless you!

The Carmelites and the Benedictines are the two orders which I feel most drawn to at the moment. Of the two, I am most familiar with the Carmelites as I have been associated with them for many years; one of my closest friends is an O.Carm priest and I taught for at a Carmelite high school for several years in the 90s. The Carmelite emphasis on contemplative prayer and the centrality of the Blessed Virgin in Carmelite spirituality are two things which attract me to the Order.
FCEGM said:
In joining we make the commitment to:
  1. Attend daily Mass when possible.
  2. Attend monthly meeting of the Community
  3. Devote at least ½ hour to mental prayer
  4. Make regular use of the Sacrament of Penance
  5. Join with the Church in praying Morning and Evening Prayer of the Liturgy of the Hours (and Night Prayer, if possible).
  6. Have a daily devotion to Our Lady
  7. Participate in the apostolate of the Community.
Click to expand...
I already try to incorporate most of these practices into my daily life, so my life already fits the orientation of this part of the commitment.

With regard to some of the other points: I do feel drawn by St. Teresa of Ávila’s spirituality and I love her writings. She is one of my favourite saints. Talk about tough, no-nonsense, down-to-earth spirituality!

By the way, have you ever been to Ávila? I live in Spain and it’s about a three and a half hour drive from where I live. Everytime I go I attend Mass or Vespers in one of the convents where she lived. The sisters there are wonderful. If you’ve never been and one day make a pilgrimage there, perhaps we will meet! 😉

Thanks too for the links. I will check them out this evening.

Once more, THANK YOU, God bless and pray for me!

Any Benedictine oblates, or Dominican or Franciscan tertiaries out there? I’d still love to hear from you as well!
 
Moneo said:
FCEGM,

With regard to some of the other points: I do feel drawn by St. Teresa of Ávila’s spirituality and I love her writings. She is one of my favourite saints. Talk about tough, no-nonsense, down-to-earth spirituality!

By the way, have you ever been to Ávila? I live in Spain and it’s about a three and a half hour drive from where I live. Everytime I go I attend Mass or Vespers in one of the convents where she lived. The sisters there are wonderful. If you’ve never been and one day make a pilgrimage there, perhaps we will meet! 😉

Thanks too for the links. I will check them out this evening.

Once more, THANK YOU, God bless and pray for me!
Click to expand...
You’re very welcome, Moneo; it’s always a pleasure to share something of the Carmelite life. You are in my prayers - and please do likewise! 🙂

I haven’t visited Spain or Avila, though I certainly hope to do so someday. My maternal grandparents were from Catalunya so I have had a desire to visit Spain for many years, not just since my discovery of St. Teresa and St. John. The associate pastor of my parish is leading a pilgrimage in May that will include Avila, but my grandson will be making his First Holy Communion during that time. Perhaps some day. . .🙂
 
If you live in Southern CA and wish to know more about a Benedictine community, I’d encourage you to visit St. Andrew’s Abbey at Valyermo, CA, in the high desert (largest nearby city being Palmdale). The St. Andrew’s Web site has a section on the Benedictine Oblate vocation. The site is valyermo.com/ I am an oblate of the monastery (and live in Indiana BTW). They have Oblate groups throughout the Los Angeles, San Fernando, Inland Empire, High Desert and other areas of So CA.

The only Carmelite community I am familiar with is El Carmelo in Redlands, CA

The desert lane leading up to the monastery at St. Andrew’s has a sign which reads “No Hunting, Except for Peace.” Hope your journey adds to what you already have.
 
Thank you, Michael, for the information and the link to St. Andrew’s excellent and informative website. I do not live in California; I live in Spain. There is a Benedictine monastery nearby which I frequently visit; I have made a retreat there in the past and I believe that I am soon going to begin spiritual direction with one of the monks there.

God bless you for your help! Please keep me in your prayers.
 
you have a good link above for Benedictine Oblates.
my vocation is married woman, wife mother and grandmother.
my apostolate is religious education, and is also my fulltime career.
my spirituality is Benedictine and I have been an Oblate for 4 years. I was invited by several other Oblates from our parish who were involved in ministries that attracted me. We are associated with the Benedictine monastery in Starr Cty TX. Formation was one year of monthly meetings, learning about the Oblate way of following the Rule of St Benedict in daily life.
Profession is commitment to
Benedictine charisms of obedience, stability, fidelity and hospitality.
reading and following the Rule, as applied to lay life in any of a number of excellent guides, such as A Life-Giving Way by Esther DeWaal.
liturgy of the hours (we use Shorter Christian Prayer)
lectio divina with daily lectionary readings
assisting the Sisters in their work–evangelization and pro-life witness
monthly meetings in deaneries and general meetings, plus one retreat a year, which consist of reading assigned spritual book (Gospel of Life last year, Fr. Pavone’s book this year), LOTH, business meeting and shared meal.
annual retreat.
 
Good Morning Moneo,

Here are a few sources that I found to be helpful when I was deciding whether to become an oblate.

St John’s Abbey (saintjohnsabbey.org/oblates/index.html)). I particularly recommend the link “What is an oblate” among the links along the right hand side of the page (there is also a nice reading list at the bottom of this page).

Monastery Of The Ascension has its oblate manual online at idahomonks.org/manual.htm. There are a bunch of links at the bottom of the page with useful essays on various topics.

There is also a book on the topic by Br Benet Tvedten called “How to Be a Monastic And Not Leave Your Day Job: An Invitation to Oblate Life”, which takes the info presented in the links above and fleshes it out and personalizes it more.

I think they will give a better answer to the particulars of your questions, but please let me know if you need more info.

I should add that I was in a similar situation of trying to decide between the OCDS and OblSB routes. The OCDS was quite a bit more convenient for me, in that there was a large and active community in my home parish, whereas I was more attracted to (or perhaps it’s better to say familiar with) the Benedictines, but their monastery was over an hour away and didn’t have an oblate program. So I started going to the OCDS meetings to test drive them, but it just didn’t feel right (and this was a really good group of people - which is another factor to consider when joining). I also never felt a connection with the great Carmelite writers. So after a long trial and considerable discussion and prayer, I decided that this was not for me. A while later (and I don’t know what prompted me to do it when I did) I wrote to the Benedictine monastery and asked if they had any plans or thoughts about starting an oblate program, and was surprised when they wrote back and said that they had just decided to do so. I took that as a good sign, and after going there I was hooked.

BTW, John Paul the Great was an OCDS, and Benedict XVI is an oblate to a Benedictine monastery in Germany, so either way, you’re in great company!
 
Moneo said:
Hello all,

Are there any folks checking into the CA Forums on a regular basis who can give me bit of insight into the vocation of tertiary members of orders such as the Dominican, Carmelite or Franciscan Orders, or the Oblate vocation in the Benedictine family?

Specifically, I’d like to know what your commitment involves, what sort of initial discernment or formation is necessary prior to being admitted, how the formation is carried out once you have been accepted as a tertiary or an oblate, when the commitment is considered permanent etc.

I have been pondering ways of deepening my relationship with God in some sort of formal, vocational commitment for quite some time now. I do not believe that I have a vocation to either married life or to the priesthood, and while I have certainly considered religious life, several financial obligations (i.e., debts) currently make it impossible for me to pursue that avenue. Plus, I am not really sure that God is calling me to conventual or monastic life.

The most likely scenario as far as I can tell right now is to carry on as I have for years: as a celibate layman. And yet I do feel something of a need for the support and guidance of a community.

I would just like to know some folks’ experience in order to pray and continue discerning. Anything you have to offer would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks and God bless!
Click to expand...
Thank you for the information, I am so pleased.
I was given by Our Dear Lord, St Therese the little flower to follow some 30 years ago in becoming devoted to “the little way” and I had a very strong encounter again when she came to New Zealand last year which took me into a need for a deeper realisation. I did belong to a group who came together monthly but for me I thought were not as deep as I wanted.
I tried to join a grroup in France but that never came about since there is a difference of language and i had not at that time learned properly contemplation. Although I was given the “little way” I also was using the gifts of the Holy Spirit deeply in miracals, but Our LOrd told me to stop using them while he taught me how to relate to a more contemplative way of living. Now I have been drawn into the contemplative relationship I relaise the beauty of both and how they worked with St Tereser and St John of the Cross.
Thank you for your information
God bless
littleone
 
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