the actual body of Christ.

[jmcrae]

And why is Christ giving you His body?

So that we can be transformed into Him.

If it’s “one single sacrifice”, then why are you doing it every week?

Because we need the grace, in order to become perfected in Christ.

 

[someotherguy]

You missed what he said. You keep asking whether we believe “the bread and wine” are Christ’s body and blood. Once consecrated, the items no longer are “bread and wine” at all. So no, we don’t believe that bread and wine “are” Christ’s body and blood.

So then, if they’re not Christ’s body and blood, and they’re not bread and wine, then what, exactly, are they?

 

[Gamera]

… So, even though Christ was resurrected and ascended into Heaven, you put Him back on the cross in your mass? Why?

What scripture do you have to support this?

Do you believe Jesus is all done being our high priest? No, he is a priest forever in the order of Melchizedek, right? So how can he be our perpetual high priest if his sacrifice is finished? Because his priesthood is perpetual. Just like his sacrifice is perpetual. He doesn’t need to die over and over every time someone sins precisely beacuse His one finished sacrifice endures forever.

 

[someotherguy]

No, not ‘redoing.’ Re-presenting.

Why does it need to be represented?

 

[ibkc]

Why does it need to be represented?

jmcrae just answered this. “Because we need the grace, in order to become perfected in Christ,” she said.

 

[someotherguy]

Do you believe Jesus is all done being our high priest? No, he is a priest forever in the order of Melchizedek, right? So how can he be our perpetual high priest if his sacrifice is finished?

The difference is that the Bible says that Jesus’ sacrifice is over. It doesn’t say that His priesthood is over.

Because his priesthood is perpetual. Just like his sacrifice is perpetual.

If his sacrifice is perpetual, then why did He say that His sacrifice was finished?

 

[someotherguy]

jmcrae just answered this. “Because we need the grace, in order to become perfected in Christ,” she said.

But the Bible says that if you’re born again, you’re already perfected.

 

[SacredHeartFan]

Then why does CCC 1365 say that the eucharist is a sacrifice?

That’s what I thought until I read CCC 1365.

Christ is on the cross at your mass?

Christ is God and God is not limited by space or time therefore his sacrifice is not limited by space or time. No one on this Earth can comprehend it. It is through faith that we believe it.

 

[Gamera]

So then, if they’re not Christ’s body and blood, and they’re not bread and wine, then what, exactly, are they?

Before consecration there is only bread and wine.

After consecration, there is only Christ’s body and blood – no bread and wine exist anymore.

There is no overlap, no moment at which “bread and wine are body and blood.” Your confusion about Catholic belief stems from your asking the question in an awkward way. We don’t believe bread and wine “are” Christ’s body and blood. First one is present and the other absent, then one absent and the other present. No middle ground.

 

[SacredHeartFan]

But the Bible says that if you’re born again, you’re already perfected.

Ok then so if I accept Jesus and then do drugs my salvation is still assured just because I was baptized and accepted Jesus??

 

[ibkc]

But the Bible says that if you’re born again, you’re already perfected.

That is a misunderstanding of what the Bible says. Those in Heaven are perfect. The rest of us are all a work in progress.

 

[Gamera]

The difference is that the Bible says that Jesus’ sacrifice is over. It doesn’t say that His priesthood is over.

A priesthood requires a sacrifice.

If his sacrifice is perpetual, then why did He say that His sacrifice was finished?

“It is finished” is what He said. Not “my sacrifice is finished.” Christ’s suffering and death are over. He doesn’t suffer in the Eucharist.

 

[jmcrae]

The difference is that the Bible says that Jesus’ sacrifice is over. It doesn’t say that His priesthood is over.

Priests are men who make sacrifices. If he is not making sacrifices, then he is not a priest.

If his sacrifice is perpetual, then why did He say that His sacrifice was finished?

He said that the Passover, together with the Old Testament, was finished.

Not that the New Testament sacrifice was finished.

 

[someotherguy]

Before consecration there is only bread and wine.

After consecration, there is only Christ’s body and blood – no bread and wine exist anymore.

So then, they’re back to being Christ’s body now?

Your confusion about Catholic belief stems from your asking the question in an awkward way. We don’t believe bread and wine “are” Christ’s body and blood. First one is present and the other absent, then one absent and the other present. No middle ground.

I wish you’d make up your mind.

 

[Gamera]

But the Bible says that if you’re born again, you’re already perfected.

Chapter and verse?

 

[someotherguy]

Priests are men who make sacrifices. If he is not making sacrifices, then he is not a priest.

The sacrifice has already been made.

He said that the Passover, together with the Old Testament, was finished.

Not that the New Testament sacrifice was finished.

Actually, no.

He said that the debt of sin had been paid by His sacrifice.

 

[jmcrae]

So then, they’re back to being Christ’s body now?

They’re not “being” anything - they no longer exist on the earth. They have gone away into Heaven, and have been completely displaced by Jesus Himself.

 

[someotherguy]

Chapter and verse?

Hebrews 10:14.

 

[someotherguy]

They’re not “being” anything - they no longer exist on the earth. They have gone away into Heaven, and have been completely displaced by Jesus Himself.

So then, what do the people eat?

 

[Gamera]

So then, they’re back to being Christ’s body now?

I wish you’d make up your mind.

I haven’t changed anything I’ve said. What part of Catholic belief confuses you? Look, you keep asking, “Do Catholics believe the bread and wine ARE Christ’s body and blood?” The answer is “No” because the bread and wine cease to exist at the moment of consecration. They are replaced by Christ’s body and blood.

I don’t see why this is confusing you.