The Angel Gabriel as the "Created Holy Spirit"

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Hello,

I have read that the Angel Gabriel is regarded by Muslims as essenitally the incarnate form of the Holy Spirit. This is not to be confused with the Holy Spirit itself, which is the spirit of God the Father and is omnipresent, etc.

Please could you explain why Gabriel is regarded as being the created Holy Spirit.

Thank you.
 
I’ve always seen a sort of parallel between Michael/Father, Raphael/Son, and Gabriel/Spirit. Each of the three is guardian/judge, healer/doctor, and messenger/power of God. It is only a symbolic and metaphorical conception on my part, and certainly nothing like what you’re saying! 😛 Parallels and similarities are alright to find, but saying one of the archangels (“higher messengers”?) is God Himself makes no sense etymologically. Is the messenger the same as the message-writer? If so, he would have no need of a messenger! 🙂
 
In some way the Holy Trinity is mirrored in the created world.

I have some doubt about such Muslim belief, because the Muslims believe in the One and only one God, and the Trinity is anathema for them.
 
GloriousOrder said:
I’ve always seen a sort of parallel between Michael/Father, Raphael/Son, and Gabriel/Spirit. Each of the three is guardian/judge, healer/doctor, and messenger/power of God. It is only a symbolic and metaphorical conception on my part, and certainly nothing like what you’re saying! 😛 Parallels and similarities are alright to find, but saying one of the archangels (“higher messengers”?) is God Himself makes no sense etymologically. Is the messenger the same as the message-writer? If so, he would have no need of a messenger! 🙂
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Thanks for your very intesting post.

I read this on Wikipedia!

Yes, Muslims don’t believe in the Trinity but for some reason Gabriel is referred to by the name of the “Holy Spirit”. Perhaps I have misunderstood it.

I believe that angels, or at least some angels, are referred to as “sons of god”, so whilst they are not God themselves, they might be in some sense begotten and not created.

Out of interest, what are your thoughts on Azrael and Metatron?

Thanks.
 
Wouldn’t it be better to pose this question in the non-Catholic religions section, as there are Muslims posting there who would be able to answer your question more accurately?
 
GloriousOrder said:
I’ve always seen a sort of parallel between Michael/Father, Raphael/Son, and Gabriel/Spirit. Each of the three is guardian/judge, healer/doctor, and messenger/power of God. It is only a symbolic and metaphorical conception on my part, and certainly nothing like what you’re saying! 😛 Parallels and similarities are alright to find, but saying one of the archangels (“higher messengers”?) is God Himself makes no sense etymologically. Is the messenger the same as the message-writer? If so, he would have no need of a messenger! 🙂
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To point it out a bit polemical:
Is a SMS the same as the SMS writer? 😉 😛 😃
 
Percival said:
Thanks for your very intesting post.

I read this on Wikipedia!

Yes, Muslims don’t believe in the Trinity but for some reason Gabriel is referred to by the name of the “Holy Spirit”. Perhaps I have misunderstood it.

I believe that angels, or at least some angels, are referred to as “sons of god”, so whilst they are not God themselves, they might be in some sense begotten and not created.

Out of interest, what are your thoughts on Azrael and Metatron?

Thanks.
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There are many Angels in Jewish Mythology.
There are even certain cults who teach a lot of mythological (non-Christian) stuff.
I’ve once found a website (maybe I’ll post the link later on) that states which Angel is your Guardian Angel based on your birth-date (sounds very astrological and esoteric to me ;)).
Mine would be the Archangel Metatron.

Azrael, btw., is arabic for Raziel (which would be the same angel in Jewish mythology.)
 
Esdra said:
There are many Angels in Jewish Mythology.
There are even certain cults who teach a lot of mythological (non-Christian) stuff.
I’ve once found a website (maybe I’ll post the link later on) that states which Angel is your Guardian Angel based on your birth-date (sounds very astrological and esoteric to me ;)).
Mine would be the Archangel Metatron.

Azrael, btw., is arabic for Raziel (which would be the same angel in Jewish mythology.)
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Hi again,

here it is: online-schutzengel.de/Engel.htm

The site is in German. But all you need to know is: Geborene zwischen dem 21.03. und dem 25.03.: Schutzengel EHYIAH = Born between March 21 and March 25: Guardian Angel EHYIAH.

So, I’ve been born between 26.03. and 30.03 thus my Guardian Angel family is the one of Metatron (Seraphim) and my personal guardian Angel is Jeliel. 😉

I’ve checked again: This website is completely esoteric. Nevertheless, you have on this homepage ALL Archangels and Angels known in Jewish mythology. (I think at least so. I never really studied about Angels…)
 
Percival said:
Hello,

I have read that the Angel Gabriel is regarded by Muslims as essenitally the incarnate form of the Holy Spirit. This is not to be confused with the Holy Spirit itself, which is the spirit of God the Father and is omnipresent, etc.

Please could you explain why Gabriel is regarded as being the created Holy Spirit.

Thank you.
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Well that is Muslim theology,not Jewish/Christian. We as Catholic Christians believe and teach God made all angels and humanity. Angels can send forth God’s gospel and message,but only God the Son incarnated,not angels.
 
Gabriel appears first in the book of Daniel. So is not hard to Imagine Mohammad out in the desert of Mecca, talking OT with the Jews and Christians and hearing about Gabriel in Luke, Daniel etc. I imagine he would have thought “Hey this Angel Gabriel is the Holy Spirit”???

I believe we are giving all this much to much thought. Its like trying to invent a product to make a million, and thinking so hard you miss the pet-rock.
 
Muslims actually think that Christians got it wrong.

The Arabic that gets translated as “holy spirit” روح القدس in the Qur’an refers to the Angel Gabriel, because in places like Surat an-Nahl, Say, [O Muhammad], “The Pure Spirit has brought it down from your Lord in truth to make firm those who believe and as guidance and good tidings to the Muslims.” we find the title being used where the Angel Gabriel is being referred to. This ayah, i mean to say, refers to the Angel Gabriel, but yet calls him روح القدس, just as in many passages related to Jesus, where it says the “holy spirit” strengthened Jesus, etc.

In Surah Maryam, it is the Angel Gabriel who appears to Mary in the form of a man to tell her about how she will conceive a child. In one ayah, the Angel is called by Allah روحنا “Our Spirit” which some translations render as “Our Angel” meaning it belongs to Allah, but it still refers to Gabriel.
 
“Fortitudo Dei”, one of the three archangels mentioned in the Bible.

St Michael is evoked in the Exorcism’s to this day.

Daniel is OT so it would be in Hebrew, and the Jews and Christians got it wrong and Islam got it right over 1000-years after Daniel?
 
Sister Amy - are you saying allah’s spirit is a creation?

Allah breathed his angel into them?

15.29 “When I have fashioned him (in due proportion) and breathed into him of My spirit, fall ye down in obeisance unto him.”

21.91 And (remember) her who guarded her chastity: We breathed into her of Our spirit, and We made her and her son a sign for all peoples.

Angels and the Spirit seem to be 2 different things here:

78.38 The Day that the Spirit and the angels will stand forth in ranks, none shall speak except any who is permitted by (Allah) Most Gracious, and He will say what is right.

What if all this time Muslims have been interpreting the Quran wrong?
 
schaick brings up a great point which has my mind off and running already. In Islam {Arabic} what does Adam mean?

Because in Hebrew it means “MAN” . So when God breathed life into Adam he created not Adam but Man, So in essense we are all MAN. And that living Soul of God exists in ALL Man just like Adam.
 
GaryTaylor said:
schaick brings up a great point which has my mind off and running already. In Islam {Arabic} what does Adam mean?

Because in Hebrew it means “MAN” . So when God breathed life into Adam he created not Adam but Man, So in essense we are all MAN. And that living Soul of God exists in ALL Man just like Adam.
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It’s not an Arab name. (Grammatically, non-Arab names follow different rules than Arab names.)
 
schaick said:
Sister Amy - are you saying allah’s spirit is a creation?

Allah breathed his angel into them?

15.29 “When I have fashioned him (in due proportion) and breathed into him of My spirit, fall ye down in obeisance unto him.”

21.91 And (remember) her who guarded her chastity: We breathed into her of Our spirit, and We made her and her son a sign for all peoples.

Angels and the Spirit seem to be 2 different things here:

78.38 The Day that the Spirit and the angels will stand forth in ranks, none shall speak except any who is permitted by (Allah) Most Gracious, and He will say what is right.

What if all this time Muslims have been interpreting the Quran wrong?
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Something to learn about Arabic is that words can have many meanings. Soul, spirit, breath even have the same word. The word for wind comes from the same root.

Quran.Com is a great resource for looking at different translations. Some translations make the implied meaning explicit through the use of ] and (). As for the first ayah, yes, the “spirit” is something created. As for the second, it refers to Gabriel, meaning by means of in the word من rather than “of.” And as for the third, it also refers to the Angel Gabriel.

The first: روحي – My Ruh
The second: روحنا – Our Ruh
The third: الروح – The Ruh

The Muslims aren’t the ones interpreting the Qur’an incorrectly. Rather, it’s folks who come along centuries late and don’t know Arabic that do so.
 
How do we know for Mohammad, Gabriel and Allah are not in fact the same person. With Gabriel and Allah the red-herrings to give Mohammads word divine sanction?

In short Mohammads own altered ego projected onto the followers of himself?

Could you prove otherwise?😉
 
Matter of fact let me take this a step further.

Oxford Dictionary- a religion is a belief in the divine; cult is a belief in the emulation of a human being.

Followers of Islam in fact follow Mohammad, emulate the deeds, thoughts and ideas of Mohammad. This in itself defines cultism.

Jesus Christ is God. He is Divine. So astounding were His claims the apostles didn’t even believe He could die, be buried and raised from the dead…till He did.

Walked on Water.

Healed the Sick.

Raised a rotten corpse from the dead.

Changed the weather during a storm.

Wedding of Cana and the wine

Transfiguration.

And on and on. Without a single word of violence, let alone Honor Killing?

By your owns words there in no miracle in the Quran but the Quran itself being a Miracle?

In arabic the names of Allah translate to the Proud One, or in

Sura 3:54 Arabic: Wa Makaru wa makara Allah wa Allah Amkaru al Makireen.

Likewise the phrase of Allah “being the best deceiver”. kheir ol makarein, is also used of Allah in Suras 8:30 and 10:21. Sura 10:21 says Allah is the fastest in planning/deceit

Other references to the plotting/deceit/scheming of Allah are Sura 7:99; 27:50; 13:42; 14:46; 43:79; 86:15f.; 7:100; 4:142

Now I admit the english version is softer but since “Arabic” seems to be the point of contention as of late, how does this relate to God as Allah?

This word “schemer” (maakir) is a very strong word which Wehr and Abdel-Nour define as “sly, cunning, wily”. The Arabic-Arabic unjid defines it with khuda`a which means exactly the same thing (by Bill Campbell in his book The Qur’an and the Bible in the Light of History and Science p.217-218).

Interpretation of Sura 3:54

The person who is a makir [same form as the word kafir] speaking of the attribute of a person is one who would outwit someone else to cause them harm. It speaks of one who would reveal the opposite of what he plans to do. The reality is that he is scheming evil for that person. So yes there is the sense of planning and scheming but mostly it means to trick, outwit and deceive for the purpose of overpowering and conquering the other. A makir is one who devises a secret scheme against someone else. Synonyms would be cheating, defrauding, double-crossing, deceiving, tricking, in all cases makara has the sense of defeating the one you have tricked
 
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