The "Ask a Baptist" Thread

[Carlan]

Baptism, at my church, is an outward sign of being saved by the blood of Christ. Just as Jesus was baptized, we are too.

I am on CAF to find anwers. My husband is Catholic and although I would probably not consider going to the CC otherwise, now that he is returning to the church after years of not attending I am in need of answers so I can worship with him and know what is going on. I am thrilled he is interested in God again, btw. I have prayed for this for a LONG time. And I am finding things I like about Catholicism.

I have never heard of a book with lists of who is going to hell, lol. There are so many types of Baptists, some good and welcoming and some that use the name Baptist for bad (like those Phelps/Westboro people), so you can’t attribute what one says to all Baptists. I don’t think any of us on Earth are worthy of deciding who is going to hell.

We don’t have the strict communion rules about the bread/wine like the CC does, no. We keep it simple, it says bread in the Bible so we have a type of bread (some have crackers, some bread, etc) and we have grape juice, like many other non Catholic churches. I guess because we don’t want to condone alcohol. But many Baptists I know drink some, it’s not a grounds for ex-communication or anything, just not encouraged.

The thing about Baptists is that there are many different types of them and beliefs will differ from church to church. And you don’t have to profess to believe according to the Baptist church or anything, just in Jesus as Lord and Saviour. For instance, I do not believe that we are neccessarily OSAS. But many Baptists do in general.

Welcome sckcd.,It is wonderful that your husband is returning home to the Church. God bless him greatly. It is all so wonderful that you are so open to it. There is so much misunderstanding about the Catholic Church, it is good that you will be learning the full truth as you share with each other. God bless you in it all,:)Carlan

 

[benidict]

heres my question.( also a former baptist.) how can the baptist viewpoint be true, when their founder john smyth. believed them to be in error, and attempted to bring them into the fold of the mennonites, shortly before he died. also john smyth, did not ascribe to the doctrine of original sin. seeing how your own founder apparently decided he was in error, how can anyone follow his teachings? just curious.

 

[benidict]

Hello again, Dettingen,

What are the effects of Baptism? The Catholic Church teaches.
Baptism takes away original sin, all personal sins and all punishment due to sin. It makes the baptized person a participant in the divine life of the Trinity Through sanctifying grace, the grace of justification which incorporates one into Christ and into his Church.

We are saved by the blood of Jesus Christ, and justification is imparted at Baptism. The Catholic Church Baptizes with water and the Holy Spirit in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.: Carlan
The Trinity.

hi dettingen. how true how true. also it is interesting to note, origen took the position of infant baptism, and stated it was handed down thru the apostles. and what you said is exactly how he said the apostles sent it down thru tradition. nicely done!

 

[sckcd]

heres my question.( also a former baptist.) how can the baptist viewpoint be true, when their founder john smyth. believed them to be in error, and attempted to bring them into the fold of the mennonites, shortly before he died. also john smyth, did not ascribe to the doctrine of original sin. seeing how your own founder apparently decided he was in error, how can anyone follow his teachings? just curious.

At my church we don’t follow the teachings of any certain man. We follow the Bible’s teachings. I must not be a very good Baptist, b/c I have never heard of John Smyth until now I realize from your post he is the one who started the Baptist denomination, but his name is never spoken of where I worship.

 

[benidict]

At my church we don’t follow the teachings of any certain man. We follow the Bible’s teachings. I must not be a very good Baptist, b/c I have never heard of John Smyth until now I realize from your post he is the one who started the Baptist denomination, but his name is never spoken of where I worship.

hi brother. exactly my point. im a former baptist myself,so keep searching. brought a small part of the history up on another thread. its fascinating. most baptist do not know their own history. i was married to a mennonite, so it forced me to look into the history of the baptist church. first go to wikopedia and look up menno simons, then google john smyth. the history of the baptist church cannot really be taught by the baptist. it would cause alot of problems. doensnt mean your not a good baptist. i wasnt taught this either.lol! might just put you over the edge after you get done with your studies. Love in Christ p.s. if your a sister then hi sister. hard to tell by someones screen name

 

[benidict]

At my church we don’t follow the teachings of any certain man. We follow the Bible’s teachings. I must not be a very good Baptist, b/c I have never heard of John Smyth until now I realize from your post he is the one who started the Baptist denomination, but his name is never spoken of where I worship.

ok my bad. just read one of your other post. hi sister! lol!

 

[Filioque]

Well sort of, so my question would be why accept the later editions of the KJV, and not the first edition, which did contain the Deuterocanonical books? Why reject the Original Edition authorized by King James, for a new one, and reject what the “parent Church” of the Baptists (Anglicanism) which still uses the Deutrocanonicals in the Book of Common Prayer, “Office”

And while not part of the Bible itself, why omit the Preface of King James from the original edition. or any of the other editions that were modified, and “corrected” as the Puritans under Cromwell decided needed to be done to make it more acceptable for their new Theologies?

 

[JaMc]

Interesting thread. My wife was raised Baptist, and was somewhat upset to hear at RCIA tonight that Baptist “Eucharist” is invalid, as she believes in the Real Presence, and did not like hearing that the communion she has been receiving all along was simply bread and wine. We are having a little debate - she insists that the Baptists also believe in the Real Presence, while I see on here that they do not.

Are there some Baptist churches that do, in fact, teach the Real Presence? I know there are some (Landmark Baptists), who go through some mental gymnastics to come up with some sort of theory of Apostolic Succession - i.e., that there were many churches at the time of the Apostles, and the Baptists are the successors of one of them. If they do believe in the Real Presence, would this, or the “Priesthood of All Believers”, be what they think gives their pastors the authority to effect a valid consecration?

Or is my wife out to lunch re: Baptists and the Real Presence, and really coming where she belongs in joining the Catholic Church.

 

[Filioque]

Interesting thread. My wife was raised Baptist, and was somewhat upset to hear at RCIA tonight that Baptist “Eucharist” is invalid, as she believes in the Real Presence, and did not like hearing that the communion she has been receiving all along was simply bread and wine. We are having a little debate - she insists that the Baptists also believe in the Real Presence, while I see on here that they do not.

Are there some Baptist churches that do, in fact, teach the Real Presence? I know there are some (Landmark Baptists), who go through some mental gymnastics to come up with some sort of theory of Apostolic Succession - i.e., that there were many churches at the time of the Apostles, and the Baptists are the successors of one of them. If they do believe in the Real Presence, would this, or the “Priesthood of All Believers”, be what they think gives their pastors the authority to effect a valid consecration?

Or is my wife out to lunch re: Baptists and the Real Presence, and really coming where she belongs in joining the Catholic Church.

I remember seeing Paul Crouch of TBN affirm the real presence, and describe it leaving out only the term Transubstantiation. While this is new among the Evangelical Camp, they do not (all) hold that Apostolic Succession is needed to consecrate. Who knows in a year or two they may. “Pastor Paul” as he now calls himself was also laughing one day about the things the chuch he belongs to used to teach that the do not any more. So it seems that for him at least, doctrines do change, and the Holy Spirit instructs you to change what he had formerly thought you should teach…

 

[Tietjen]

That original justification isn’t a get-out-of-hell-free card. Divorce is sinful, adultery is sin, and so on. Dying with an unrepented, unforgiven sin on one’s conscience is a damnable offence.

Are you then saying that the Baptist position is that if a sin hasn’t been confessed to God, the person will go to Hell? Allow me to set up a scenerio… “Joe Jones” (a Baptist) lies to his boss and calls out sick, but during the course of the day he is killed in a car accident without having prayed to God and asking for forgiveness. Would the Baptist Church say that he went to Hell?

All sins are of equal gravity, because all sin separates us from God.

Our Lord said to Pilate (John 19:11): “He that hath delivered me to thee, hath the greater sin…” and yet it is evident that Pilate was guilty of some sin. Therefore one sin is greater than another.

“If any man see his brother sin a sin [which is] not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it. All unrighteousness is sin: and there is a sin not unto death.” - 1 John 5:16-17
(Sin “unto death” being mortal sin and the “sin not unto death” being venial sin)

“And the Lord said, Because the cry of Sodom and Gomorrah is great, and because their sin is very grievous…” - Genesis 18:20
(The word “very” indicates different degrees of sin)

“Then Abimelech called Abraham, and said unto him, What hast thou done unto us? and what have I offended thee, that thou hast brought on me and on my kingdom a great sin? thou hast done deeds unto me that ought not to be done.” - Genesis 20:9
(A “great” sin? as opposed to what? … a lesser sin?)

“And he that smiteth his father, or his mother, shall be surely put to death. And he that stealeth a man, and selleth him, or if he be found in his hand, he shall surely be put to death. And he that curseth his father, or his mother, shall surely be put to death. And if men strive together, and one smite another with a stone, or with his fist, and he die not, but keepeth his bed: If he rise again, and walk abroad upon his staff, then shall he that smote him be quit: only he shall pay for the loss of his time, and shall cause him to be thoroughly healed.” - Exodus 21:15-19
(Different punishments for different sins indicate that there is indeed different degrees of sin and that not all sin is equal in the sight of God.)

And I believe that God continues to forgive, no matter how many times I sin, so long as my repentance is real.

What is the Baptist Church’s definition of repentance? Is it simply going to God and saying that you’re sorry. Do you have to “do” something to make reparation (IE - Repay the money stolen from the person that you robbed)? Is it simply “feeling” guilty for having sinned? And if it does require some action on your part (whether that be prayer, reparation, or whatever) and you die prior to “doing” the repentance, are you bound for Hell? What if the person was “saved” and accepted Jesus into his heart 5 years prior to this particular sin and his death? Did he lose his salvation?

Please help me understand this apparent contradiction between Scripture and the Baptist faith.

 

[Dettingen]

regarding sin and repentance:

“Go and sin no more” said Jesus to the woman taken in adultery. I think Jesus is looking for true remorse. He didn’t tell her to say a certain number of prayers or hours of community service.

For myself, I think if I’m truly sorry, I’ll try to find a way to make up for what I did.
Supposing I stole something. If I’m truly repentant, I’ll give it back. Or I’ll reimburse the one from whom I stole. If neither of these are possible, I can choose to reimburse the family of man in general, maybe by volunteering or giving money to a good cause.

 

[Filioque]

regarding sin and repentance:

“Go and sin no more” said Jesus to the woman taken in adultery. I think Jesus is looking for true remorse. He didn’t tell her to say a certain number of prayers or hours of community service.

For myself, I think if I’m truly sorry, I’ll try to find a way to make up for what I did.
Supposing I stole something. If I’m truly repentant, I’ll give it back. Or I’ll reimburse the one from whom I stole. If neither of these are possible, I can choose to reimburse the family of man in general, maybe by volunteering or giving money to a good cause.

Well then you have the makings of a good Catholic. As Catholics don’t believe the sacrament of penance forgives sins without 1. Contrition (Sorrow for one’s sin). 2. Penetence, (Being truly repentant for having offended God’s Law) 3. A firm amendment to not sin again. 4. If someone else was wronged that we make restitution as far as possible. Otherwise the absolution pronunced by the priest in the name of and by the Authority of Christ, is not a magic charm, and does little good.

Prayers or Good works address the debt we have occured when we offend God for the sins already forgiven by God. Not to obtain the forgiveness. Any Good works are not acceptable when we remain obstinant in sin.

On the same subject, Jesus in the Bible, gives the Apostles the authority to forgive or retain sins. Odd thing for Him to do and not intend for the Successors of the Apostles to also also forgive sins, that is unless only those who lived while the Apostles were alive would sin, and nobody after them would.

As for Catholics who cannot utilize the Sacrament of Penance due to the inavailbility of a priest. That Catholic can offer an act of Perfect Contrition. That is confess directly to God that they are truly sorry for their sins, because they have offended God, (rather than simply because of a fear of Hell). Now why can’t and don’t Catholics just do that any old time, with or without a priest? Well because it is just not Biblical, at least to the extent that while God’s grace covers a multitude of sins, He did establish the normal manner for us to have our sins forgiven. I am grateful that if a priest is not availible that God’s grace will suffice, but having the assurance that God has given us a visible means of His forgiveness.

 

[OneTrueCathApos]

Why do Baptists believe that the pope is the Whore of Babylon? That he is the anti-Christ?

 

[Dettingen]

Not all Baptists regard the pope as the antichrist or the ‘whore of babylon.’ I certainly don’t.

Those who do probably are ignorant and/or bigoted. They probably also don’t think Catholics are Christians and that they pray to statues, etc. There’s an awful lot of ignorance in the world.

On behalf of my co-religionists, I apologize for these horrible insults.

 

[OneTrueCathApos]

Not all Baptists regard the pope as the antichrist or the ‘whore of babylon.’ I certainly don’t.

Those who do probably are ignorant and/or bigoted. They probably also don’t think Catholics are Christians and that they pray to statues, etc. There’s an awful lot of ignorance in the world.

On behalf of my co-religionists, I apologize for these horrible insults.

Thank you for the kind clarification…

 

[ALLGIRLS]

Interesting thread. My wife was raised Baptist, and was somewhat upset to hear at RCIA tonight that Baptist “Eucharist” is invalid, as she believes in the Real Presence, and did not like hearing that the communion she has been receiving all along was simply bread and wine. We are having a little debate - she insists that the Baptists also believe in the Real Presence, while I see on here that they do not.

Are there some Baptist churches that do, in fact, teach the Real Presence? I know there are some (Landmark Baptists), who go through some mental gymnastics to come up with some sort of theory of Apostolic Succession - i.e., that there were many churches at the time of the Apostles, and the Baptists are the successors of one of them. If they do believe in the Real Presence, would this, or the “Priesthood of All Believers”, be what they think gives their pastors the authority to effect a valid consecration?

Or is my wife out to lunch re: Baptists and the Real Presence, and really coming where she belongs in joining the Catholic Church.

Hi JaMc!

My dh, before he became Catholic, was always arguing w/ me about what Southern Baptists (is your dw Southern Baptist? They’re the only ones I really have any specific knowledge about, due to dh’s family) believe. He thought they believed that Baptism does indeed wash away sin (not just symbolically), and that salvation can be lost even after “asking Jesus into your heart” (his words) through unrepentent sin or apostacy. We would always eventually go to the SBC website for clarification, and I was always right . He was actually kind of mad, b/c he felt that the churches he attended weren’t teaching actual Baptist doctrine. After our last foray to www.sbc.com he actually said “Wow. I guess I’m not Baptist”. (it wasn’t too long after that he started RCIA). On the bright side, his churches also never bashed Catholics, or even mentioned us, really, so he had no false prejudices to overcome. So anyway, long story short (I know, too late! ), it’s possible your dw was taught the Real Presence; maybe her pastor believes it and teaches it, maybe not explicitly, but conveys it somehow, at that particular church.

In Christ,

Ellen

 

[kristanl]

But in general, Baptists do not believe in the Real Presence. Also, you might ask her why she only had it ______ times a year? (Sometimes very few times)… that might help her understand… She could always email the church she grew up in, or give them a call maybe???

 

[Filioque]

Interesting that the OP does not mention which Baptist Church they belonged to. As there are dozens, from the Free Baptist, Southern Baptist, Landmark Baptist, Primitive Baptist, and on and on. Each holds their own distinct doctrine, and some even condemn the others for not holding to their perculiar interpretation.

But that’s not really why I’m posting this post. A year or so ago there was a PBS Special about the decision at the Southern Baptist Convention that women could not be Pastors. A second decision came down about Homosexuals and Church Membership. Since one’s Church can be a dues paying member of the Southern Baptist Convention, and have the right to call the local Church Southern Baptist, and still not follow the majority vote at the Convention, this program focused on a handful of Southern Baptist Churches that did not follow the pack. These Churches ordained their own women Pastors, and had openly practicing homosexual members. There was talk about expelling them from the Southern Baptist Convention, but a point of order was brought up that the subjects they were debating did not exclude them from being So. Bapt. and that the Convention could not expell any congregation that chose not to follow the issues that were voted in by the Convention. All they had to do was Profess Jesus as their Savior, and the Bible as the Inerrent Word, plus a few other generally Baptist principles. So I don’t find it unusual that there would be disagreement among individual Baptists, and Baptist congregations, based on what the minister or Pastor decides the Holy Spirit leads him to believe.

 

[Anna_Scott]

Hi JaMc!

My dh, before he became Catholic, was always arguing w/ me about what Southern Baptists (is your dw Southern Baptist? They’re the only ones I really have any specific knowledge about, due to dh’s family) believe. He thought they believed that Baptism does indeed wash away sin (not just symbolically), and that salvation can be lost even after “asking Jesus into your heart” (his words) through unrepentent sin or apostacy. We would always eventually go to the SBC website for clarification, and I was always right . He was actually kind of mad, b/c he felt that the churches he attended weren’t teaching actual Baptist doctrine. After our last foray to www.sbc.com he actually said “Wow. I guess I’m not Baptist”. (it wasn’t too long after that he started RCIA). On the bright side, his churches also never bashed Catholics, or even mentioned us, really, so he had no false prejudices to overcome. So anyway, long story short (I know, too late! ), it’s possible your dw was taught the Real Presence; maybe her pastor believes it and teaches it, maybe not explicitly, but conveys it somehow, at that particular church.

In Christ,

Ellen

Ellen:

I can relate to the " “Wow. I guess I’m not Baptist” moment.

I began studying the history of Judaism, Christianity, and the transmission of Scripture about 4 years ago (I keep saying 4 years-may be longer.) I soon reached the conclusion that, though brought up in the Baptist Church, I am not Baptist.

Ironically, after reading the Bible cover-to-cover; I found that Scripture contradicts many of the Baptist doctrines.

Anna

 

[Dettingen]

So I don’t find it unusual that there would be disagreement among individual Baptists, and Baptist congregations, based on what the minister or Pastor decides the Holy Spirit leads him to believe.

Or individual members.