"The Baha'i Faith"

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yeh Planten is right, I don’t need long lectures, like as if what your saying is going to change my vews about things. Just answer the questions. Not that hard.
 
vivs3 said:
Ever since this thread has started, the Catholics have been arguing against the Bahais
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That’s ok. My wife attended their services a few times several years ago. I read some of the writtings by the founder of the Bahais and it was very anti-Catholic. I threw away all of the Bahai materials I found laying around in my house. My basic feelings was that the Bahai faith was something like Islam with a coating of Christianity.
 
DavidMark said:
Jen, Please try not to be saucy with me, and i’ll do the same, since it’s just between the two of us for now. This is important to us both, so let’s be extra kind with each other.

I asked you for the single best quote, but thanks for the list anyway.
Try to narrow it down to the most impressive one, to you anyway.
I have tried to show that obedience to the Manifestations is obedience to God; in that sense I see a holy ambiguity. They are and are not God, like the mirror’s image.

For instance, weigh these passages from the Qur’án, because I defend the Prophethood of three Messengers after Jesus, in this case Muhammad, even when Muslims are guilty of persecuting th Bábís and the Bahá’ís:

**Obey Allah, and obey the Apostle. Beware; if you give no heed, know that Our apostle’s duty is only to give plain warning. **(Qur’án 5:92)
He that obeys the Apostle obeys Allah Himself. (Qur’án 4:80)
**He that disobeys the Apostle after Our guidance has been revealed to him and follows a path other than that of the faithful, shall be given what he has chosen. We will cast him into Hell: a dismal end. ** (4:115)

I admit I need to study up on history. I was thinking of the martyrdom of William Tyndale, who tried to get the Bible translated into English, and in 1536, it may have been Henry VIII he had to deal with and not the Roman church…so I am still reading up on that.

Have a good week, and God be with you.
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part in red: why should i? this isn’t about me and what my preferences are. even arthra told me that this thread is about the baha’i faith. however, i will defend the Church when false statements or half truths are made.

i am done answering questions, when you have neglected almost all of mine.

could you please explain the part about no connection between material and spiritual objects? i am having a hard time understanding that when you said you do agree that we have spiritual souls.

and i am glad you are going to take the time to research the other side before you continue making accusations against the CC. davidmark, you have to understand that america is mostly a protestant country and the Catholic hatred that’s thrown around is tremendous. Catholics weren’t even allowed to vote until somewhere around 1786. we also weren’t allowed to own property for a good chunk or our country’s history. even today i still hear that we aren’t even Christians! we are the whore of babylon etc… there is so much bigotry out there.

so if you earnestly seek out the truth, then to your surprise you might find that much of your problems with Catholicism were merely straw man arguments to begin with.

and yes, william tyndale didn’t just try to translate the Bible into a different language he basically butchered it and added corruption to the texts which the Church had every right to condemn. it is the Church’s job to defend Her Holy book and she alone has done this for over 2000 years. when the CC declared he was in error, william was then handed over to the secular gov which was king henry and he was indeed executed. times were brutal back then. in most of your accusations against the inquisition it was the same thing. the CC would determine who was introducing corruption into the faith. after declaring it to be so would usually excommunicate the individual… meaning they are kicked out. depending on the times and secular gov at hand, they might have been turned over to the monarchy which then would have set the sentence.

many times individuals would prefer to be tried by the Church as opposed to the secular courts as they knew they would get a fairer trial.

here is a short article presenting a view you rarely see:

please read

i was not aware i was being saucy, but i will try to be more understanding of where you are coming from given what you have been taught, if you will try to make an honest attempt to view the counter arguments.

we cool?

oh and one last thing, it is the Catholic Church, not the roman church. there are many different rites within the Catholic Church and the roman or latin Rite is the most popular and is where the seat of Peter sits, but regardless, to call the Church, roman is incorrect as that would neglect or disrespect the other rites within the CC like the Maronite, Byzantine and Oriental Rites as well.

you will find this interesting and at the very least will know something that most people (including many Catholics) are unaware of:

how the Church got Her name

peace
 
Ranp said:
That’s ok. My wife attended their services a few times several years ago. I read some of the writtings by the founder of the Bahais and it was very anti-Catholic. I threw away all of the Bahai materials I found laying around in my house. My basic feelings was that the Bahai faith was something like Islam with a coating of Christianity.
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And so Ranp, do you think that Bahaullah is a false prophet?
 
planten said:
There is some interesting discussion going on between the Catholics and the Bahai’s. I wanted to know about Bahaullah whether he was:
  1. God.?
  2. Prophet of God.?
  3. God as well prophet of God.?
  4. Manifestation of God?
    If Bahaullah was manifestation of God then he could not be God. He could be a prophet of God. Then he must have recieved revelations from God.
Please tell when did Bahaullah receive the very first revelation from God (Allah)? (The year please)?
What words were in that first revelation?
In what language it was revealed to Bahaullah?

Baha’is say that Bahaullah was the second coming of Jesus or Messiah. The problem is that the Jews are waiting for their Messiah. The Christians are waiting for their Messiah. The Muslims are waiting for their Messiah. But Jews and Muslims are not waiting for Jesus son of Mary. I am sure that Jews and Muslims are not expecting the coming of Jesus (son of Mary). Did Bahaullah claim that he was the second coming of Jesus son of Mary?
Please tell all these things. They will help to understand in a better way. There is no need to give long lectures. You know the questions. You know the direct short answers. Give your own answers. Then if required, quotes will be called for. Thanks.
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Hi again planten! 🙂
Your 4th option is the best one. The term we use is Manifestation of God, like a reflection in a Primal mirror …since we are all created in the image of God. But the divine Manifestations are pure.
He did claim to be the return of the authoritative spirit of Christ, not the identity of Jesus of Nazareth. He used many terms for Himself, such as Isaiah’s “Everlasting Father”. But He also identified Himself with the return of the third Imam, Husayn ibn 'Alí.

He said: O Jews! If ye be intent on crucifying once again Jesus, the Spirit of God, put Me to death, for He hath once more, in My person, been made manifest unto you. Deal with Me as ye wish, for I have vowed to lay down My life in the path of God. I will fear no one, though the powers of earth and heaven be leagued against Me. Followers of the Gospel! If ye cherish the desire to slay Muhammad, the Apostle of God, seize Me and put an end to My life, for I am He, and My Self is His Self. Do unto Me as ye like, for the deepest longing of Mine heart is to attain the presence of My Best-Beloved in His Kingdom of Glory. Such is the Divine decree, if ye know it…(Gleanings from the Writings of Baha’u’llah, p. 101)

So, it has been my long conviction that He is the Unifier. The churches and schools of thought in Islam, as they are, are incapable of uniting the world under one code of law, like shariah. The Muslims will not accept the emphasis of the Catholics on the Mother of God. The Jews have not accepted such emphasis in nigh 2000 years, and won’t without divine intervention! But if people will swim in the ocean of Bahá’u’lláh’s Word, with an open mind and benevolent heart, --this very intervention will emerge from behind the clouds and the Baha’i World Centre in Israel will indeed be seen to be the “last refuge of a tottering civilization.” Things have not hit the dark nadir yet, but they will. 😦

Bahá’u’lláh’s remarkable courage throughout His life showed he was not a deranged person.
Now, you ask about His first revelation, or when it began. After He was arrested in August of 1852, He was put in an underground sewer that was being used as a hideous dungeon in Tihran, called the Siyah Chal (“Black Pit”) From such a place the Light dawned, which for us, is neither of the East or the West. (See Sura Nur) He was there 4 months. Of that occaision He said:

**While engulfed in tribulations I heard a most wondrous, a most sweet voice, calling above My head. Turning My face, I beheld a Maiden – the embodiment of the remembrance of the name of My Lord – suspended in the air before Me. So rejoiced was she in her very soul that her countenance shone with the ornament of the good pleasure of God, and her cheeks glowed with the brightness of the All-Merciful. Betwixt earth and heaven she was raising a call which captivated the hearts and minds of men. She was imparting to both My inward and outer being tidings which rejoiced My soul, and the souls of God’s honoured servants.

Pointing with her finger unto My head, she addressed all who are in heaven and all who are on earth, saying: By God! This is the Best-Beloved of the worlds, and yet ye comprehend not. This is the Beauty of God amongst you, and the power of His sovereignty within you, could ye but understand. This is the Mystery of God and His Treasure, the Cause of God and His glory unto all who are in the kingdoms of Revelation and of creation, if ye be of them that perceive. This is He Whose Presence is the ardent desire of the denizens of the Realm of eternity, and of them that dwell within the Tabernacle of glory, and yet from His Beauty do ye turn aside.**

But it was not a case of periodic revelations thereafter. Although there were many volumnes which were dictated in bursts of 2-3 days, like the Kitab-i-Iqan (Book of Certitude), He was always intensely active, sending letters, carried by trusted couriers, whose stories are amazing! His wise directions to individuals are also instructive.
If I remember right, the World Centre has 15,000 originals or good copies of tablets by Baha’u’llah, 27,000 by `Abdu’l-Baha, and 24,000 by Shoghi Effendi.
 
DavidMark said:
Jen, Please try not to be saucy with me, and i’ll do the same, since it’s just between the two of us for now. This is important to us both, so let’s be extra kind with each other.

I asked you for the single best quote, but thanks for the list anyway.
Try to narrow it down to the most impressive one, to you anyway.
I have tried to show that obedience to the Manifestations is obedience to God; in that sense I see a holy ambiguity. They are and are not God, like the mirror’s image.

For instance, weigh these passages from the Qur’án, because I defend the Prophethood of three Messengers after Jesus, in this case Muhammad, even when Muslims are guilty of persecuting th Bábís and the Bahá’ís:

**Obey Allah, and obey the Apostle. Beware; if you give no heed, know that Our apostle’s duty is only to give plain warning. **(Qur’án 5:92)
He that obeys the Apostle obeys Allah Himself. (Qur’án 4:80)
**He that disobeys the Apostle after Our guidance has been revealed to him and follows a path other than that of the faithful, shall be given what he has chosen. We will cast him into Hell: a dismal end. ** (4:115)

I admit I need to study up on history. I was thinking of the martyrdom of William Tyndale, who tried to get the Bible translated into English, and in 1536, it may have been Henry VIII he had to deal with and not the Roman church…so I am still reading up on that.

Have a good week, and God be with you.
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Hello,

I should probably do more research on this faith of yours but in the mean time please accept my humble explanations. In the above quote from the Qur’an that you gave, you seem to state that obedience to the apostle is obedience to Allah. I assume that the apostle is that one who follows the messengers of God. One of them being Paul who was an apostle of Jesus. If I am wrong, please excuse me. But the one thing I can answer with spiritual certainty is the divinity of Christ Jesus. Please read the exerpt below:

Christ’s divinity in the Pauline epistles
According to St. Paul, the superiority of the Christian revelation over all other Divine manifestations, and the perfection of the New Covenant with its sacrifice and priesthood, are derived from the fact that Christ is the Son of God (Hebrews 1:1 sq.; 5:5 sq.; 2:5 sq.; Romans 1:3; Galatians 4:4; Ephesians 4:13; Colossians 1:12 sq.; 2:9 sq.; etc.). The Apostle understands by the expression “Son of God” not a merely moral dignity, or a merely external relation to God which began in time, but an eternal and immanent relation of Christ to the Father. He contrasts Christ with, and finds Him superior to, Aaron and his successors, Moses and the Prophets (Hebrews 5:4; 10:11; 7:1-22; 3:1-6; 1:1). He raises Christ above the choirs of angels, and makes Him their Lord and Master (Hebrews 1:3; 14; 2:2-3), and seats Him as heir of all things at the right hand of the Father (Hebrews 1:2-3; Galatians 4:14; Ephesians 1:20-21). If St. Paul is obliged to use the terms “form of God”, “image of God”, when he speaks of Christ’s Divinity, in order to show the personal distinction between the Eternal Father and the Divine Son (Philippians 2:6; Colossians 1:15), Christ is not merely the image and glory of God (1 Corinthians 11:7), but also the first-born before any created beings (Colossians 1:15), in Whom, and by Whom, and for Whom all things were made (Colossians 1:16), in Whom the fulness of the Godhead resides with that actual reality which we attach to the presence of the material bodies perceptible and measurable through the organs of our senses (Colossians 2:9), in a word, “who is over all things, God blessed for ever” (Romans 9:5).

Now if you believe in Christ and one should obey the apostle’s teaching then what do you make of this? I would like to add another point if I may and that is the spiritual discernment that St. Paul taught the true believers. All religions can profess kinship with the bible and/or love and peace and even wisdom but only one has the truth. Here is the scripture:

Galatians 1:8-10But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach a gospel to you besides that which we have preached to you, let him be anathema. 9 As we said before, so now I say again: If any one preach to you a gospel, besides that which you have received, let him be anathema. 10 For do I now persuade men, or God? Or do I seek to please men? If I yet pleased men, I should not be the servant of Christ.

Here is another by John which reveals the antichrist:

1 John 2:22Who is a liar, but he who denieth that Jesus is the Christ? This is Antichrist, who denieth the Father and the Son. 23 Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father. He that confesseth the Son hath the Father also.

I guess my question to you is to you deny Jesus as the Christ(Holy Son of God)?

God Bless

sources:newadvent.org/cathen/14597a.htm
 
Dear Humble Maid (what a nice name!), Thank you for joining this discussion. And I’m copying your comprehensive list to use and study more widely.
The passage from the Qur’an refers to Muhammad as the Apostle to be obeyed during the Islamic Dispensation. Two “Trumpet Blasts” have sounded since then.

If you read the post right before yours, you will see that Revelation came to Baha’u’llah in the form of a Maid of Heaven, or hourí and this is the age of the elevation of the station of women …but alas the 'Muslims" have been slow to implement this.

We believe that Christ is the Image of God, and so is Baha’u’llah, the return of Christ.
This analogy is sufficient. It explains both of Jesus’ sayings ‘No one has seen God at any time’ and ‘if you have seen Me you have seen the Father’.

The same pre-existent station of Christ, the Logos, or Lady Wisdom in Proverbs, through which all things else came to be, is also Christ’s when He returns in His new Name, through the narrow gate. The Báb (Gate) was the Herald of Bahá’u’lláh, just like John was the Fore-runner of Jesus. This is Bahá’í belief. It is not going to change or be watered down.

Our small minds cannot grasp the eternal, but our hearts can attach themselves to it.
As many of the Jews formed fanciful conceptions in their minds, about the Messiah, they were prevented from recognizing Him; and the same thing is happening again.
But there will be some from every tribe and nation who do recognize.

About the spirit of anti-christ, you won’t find it here.
The Hour which We had concealed from the knowledge of the peoples of the earth and of the favoured angels hath come to pass. Say, verily, He hath testified of Me, and I do testify of Him. Indeed, He hath purposed no one other than Me. Unto this beareth witness every fair-minded and understanding soul.(Tablets of Baha’u’llah, p. 11)

**This teaching is of the Spirit, in it is no precept which is not of the Divine Spirit. **
~‘Abdu’l-Bahá, Paris Talks, p. 85
 
I just found out a little about Baha`i Faith today. Mostly from the main website.
I am hoping to buy a book on it so I am able to become more educated about the belief system. It is very facinating to me.
 
**This is the Word which the Son concealed, when to those around Him He said: ‘
Ye cannot bear it now.’ And when the appointed time was fulfilled and the Hour had struck, the Word shone forth above the horizon of the Will of God.
Beware, O followers of the Son, that ye cast it not behind your backs. Take ye fast hold of it. Better is this for you than all that ye possess. Verily He is nigh unto them that do good. The Hour which We had concealed from the knowledge of the peoples of the earth and of the favored angels hath come to pass. **(Bahá’u’lláh, Tablet to the Christians)

**One’s conduct must be like the conduct of Paul, and one’s faith similar to that of Peter. This musk-scented breeze shall perfume the nostrils of the people of the world, and this spirit shall resuscitate the dead. **(Selections from the Writings of Abdu’l-Baha, p. 223)
 
Some Questions for Baha’is
  1. Where in the Writings of Baha’u’llah does he claim to be a “Prophet”?
  2. Why did Shoghi Effendi and the House forbid the publishing of books by The Baab (other than “selections”)?
  3. Why did Shoghi Effendi and the House deny Baha’i scholars photocopies of books and epistles by The Baab…without explanation?
  4. Why did 'Abdu’l-Baha say in Some Answered Questions that the Baha’i Revelation would have “twenty four guardians” when the Baha’i Revelation had only one?
  5. Why was Shoghi Effendi working on a “House of the Guardian” (Dar-i-Valiat) at the time of his death, when he–being infallible as he claimed–KNEW before his death that he was to be the very last Guardian? Who was the “House of the Guardian” for?
  6. Why didn’t Shoghi Effendi “appoint” a successor, having no children, and all the other Aghsan (blood descendants of Baha’u’llah) were declared “Covenant-Breakers”?
  7. Why didn’t 'Abdu’l-Baha mention “Guardians” outside of his “Will and Testament” (first released by SE in 1925) or in “Some Answered Questions” (published by SE in 1930)?
  8. Why did 'Abdu’l-Baha say that Baha’is could be Baha’i-Muslims or Baha’i-Christians or Baha’i-Freemasons, and Shoghi Effendi said the exact opposite?
  9. Why did many Baha’i pilgrims who visited 'Abdu’l-Baha later say that he taught reincarnation, but 'Abdu’l-Baha taught against reincarnation in “Some Answered Questions” (a book never seen by anyone until published under the order of Shoghi Effendi in 1930)?
  10. What did The Baab mean when he wrote that he was the “return” of the Imaam Mahdi, and that Mulla Husein (his first disciple) was the “return” of the Prophet Muhammad? How was Mulla Husein the “return” of the Prophet Muhammad?
  11. Why did the Baabis claim that The Baab could perform supernatural miracles when Shoghi Effendi “explained away” all physical miracles as “mere parables” and “metaphors” and NOT literal supernatural events?
  12. Why did it take Shoghi Effendi seven years (and a British Court order) to release photocopies of the “Will and Testament” of Abdu’l-Baha?
  13. Why did a renowned British handwriting expert–one very familiar with Persian-- come to the conclusion that the “Will and Testament” was a forgery?
 
Badi,

Here are some responses to your questions… I am only a Baha’i.

Badi wrote:

Some Questions for Baha’is
  1. Where in the Writings of Baha’u’llah does he claim to be a “Prophet”?
‘O inmates of earth and heaven! Behold ye My beauty, and My radiance, and My revelation, and My effulgence. By God, the True One! I am Trustworthiness and the revelation thereof, and the beauty thereof. I will recompense whosoever will cleave unto Me, and recognize My rank and station, and hold fast unto My hem. I am the most great ornament of the people of Baha, and the vesture of glory unto all who are in the kingdom of creation. I am the supreme instrument for the prosperity of the world, and the horizon of assurance unto all beings.’ Thus have We sent down for thee that which will draw men nigh unto the Lord of creation."
  • (Baha’u’llah, Epistle to the Son of the Wolf, p. 136)*
  1. Why did Shoghi Effendi and the House forbid the publishing of books by The Baab (other than “selections”)?
There is no prohibition… Please cite your source if you think there is… The issue is one rather of translation so that there can be authenticity. Anyone can publish what they want to but if it is from a Baha’i publishing trust then it must be authenticated.
  1. Why did Shoghi Effendi and the House deny Baha’i scholars photocopies of books and epistles by The Baab…without explanation?
I do not know… Any one can ask though… Shoghi Effendi as you may know passed away in 1957.
  1. Why did 'Abdu’l-Baha say in Some Answered Questions that the Baha’i Revelation would have “twenty four guardians” when the Baha’i Revelation had only one?
It doesn’t really say that… It refers to a prophecy in Revelation, i.e., Apocalypse:

But in this glorious manifestation there are twenty-four, double the number of all the others, for the greatness of this manifestation requires it. These holy souls are in the presence of God seated on their own thrones, meaning that they reign eternally.
[1 Rev. 11:16-17.]
  • (Abdu’l-Baha, Some Answered Questions, p. 57)*
The Guardianship began as a result ioof the Will and Testament of Abdul-Baha after 1921.
  1. Why was Shoghi Effendi working on a “House of the Guardian” (Dar-i-Valiat) at the time of his death, when he–being infallible as he claimed–KNEW before his death that he was to be the very last Guardian? Who was the “House of the Guardian” for?
The Guardian was infallible as to his interpretations of the Writings… He was not a soothe sayer…
  1. Why didn’t Shoghi Effendi “appoint” a successor, having no children, and all the other Aghsan (blood descendants of Baha’u’llah) were declared “Covenant-Breakers”?
He died without leaving a Will and all the Hands acknowledged this… Some members of his family opposed him during his lifetime… that’s why they were outside the Covenant.
  1. Why didn’t 'Abdu’l-Baha mention “Guardians” outside of his “Will and Testament” (first released by SE in 1925) or in “Some Answered Questions” (published by SE in 1930)?
I don’t know but he did mention the Universal House of Justice.
  1. Why did 'Abdu’l-Baha say that Baha’is could be Baha’i-Muslims or Baha’i-Christians or Baha’i-Freemasons, and Shoghi Effendi said the exact opposite?
Abdul-Baha was speaking before the administrative order was established. It was under the Guardianship that the administraive order really came into being.
  1. Why did many Baha’i pilgrims who visited 'Abdu’l-Baha later say that he taught reincarnation, but 'Abdu’l-Baha taught against reincarnation in “Some Answered Questions” (a book never seen by anyone until published under the order of Shoghi Effendi in 1930)?
Actually Some Answered Questions was first published in Great Britain in 1908… Some of the pilgrims were taught by Ibrahim Khayrullah who believed in reincarnation.
  1. What did The Baab mean when he wrote that he was the “return” of the Imaam Mahdi, and that Mulla Husein (his first disciple) was the “return” of the Prophet Muhammad? How was Mulla Husein the “return” of the Prophet Muhammad?
First cite your source… The Return has meanings that imply in the spirit of just as Christ talked about Elijah and John the Baptist.
  1. Why did the Baabis claim that The Baab could perform supernatural miracles when Shoghi Effendi “explained away” all physical miracles as “mere parables” and “metaphors” and NOT literal supernatural events?
Shoghi Effendi does not deny miracles can occur…

What science calls a virgin birth we do not associate with that of Jesus Christ, which we believe to have been a miracle and a sign of His Prophethood. In this matter we are in entire agreement with the most orthodox church views.
  • (Shoghi Effendi, High Endeavours - Messages to Alaska, p. 70)*
It should be remembered, however, that apart from the miracle associated with the Báb’s execution, He, unlike the Founder of the Christian religion, is not only to be regarded as the independent Author of a divinely revealed Dispensation, but must also be recognized as the Herald of a new Era and the Inaugurator of a great universal prophetic cycle.
  • (Shoghi Effendi, God Passes By, p. 57)*
  1. Why did it take Shoghi Effendi seven years (and a British Court order) to release photocopies of the “Will and Testament” of Abdu’l-Baha?
Don’t know… Again what’s your source?
  1. Why did a renowned British handwriting expert–one very familiar with Persian-- come to the conclusion that the “Will and Testament” was a forgery?
I have no idea… Do you recall what the verdict was of the Court? The overwhelming numbers of Baha’is in the Holy Land accepted it was authentic.

Hope that helps…
  • Art
 
Mateo said:
I pray this email finds you all in good health.

I was wondering if anyone has had any encounters with a non-catholic religion called the “Baha’i Faith”? I am currently a student at a university and have encountered and dialogued with many different types of religions. This one in particular has given me a little more of a headache and is tougher to break down due to my lack of biblical and doctrinal knowledge within the Catholic Chruch. They claim to have 6.5 million members and say they have been growing fast. I was just wondering if anyone else has had encounters with this “Baha’i Faith” and if so how has it gone?

Paz de Christo,

Mateo
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Just like Mohammed claimed that he is the last prophet from God, Bahai claims another guy- I don’t recollect his name, but sound like a Muslim name - is the lastest to come on earth from God.
He claimed to be the incarnation of God the Father, like Jesus was the “SON”, and therefore is superior to Jesus.
 
One addenda I had to my post above to Badi:
  1. Why didn’t 'Abdu’l-Baha mention “Guardians” outside of his “Will and Testament” (first released by SE in 1925) or in “Some Answered Questions” (published by SE in 1930)?
I don’t know but he did mention the Universal House of Justice. Actually the Will was read allowed in January of 1922 and the Baha’is accepted it as authentic including the sister of Abdul-Baha Bahiyeh Khanum. Some Answred Questions was published earlier in 1908.
 
frantony said:
Just like Mohammed claimed that he is the last prophet from God, Bahai claims another guy- I don’t recollect his name, but sound like a Muslim name - is the lastest to come on earth from God.
He claimed to be the incarnation of God the Father, like Jesus was the “SON”, and therefore is superior to Jesus.
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frantony…

Thanks for posting …

Actually Bahais don’t claim Baha’u’llah was the “last prophet” from God.

Baha’u’llah means the “Glory of God”.

Baha’u’llah never claimed to be an incarnation of God… in fact we Bahis don’t believe in the concept of “incarnation” as many Christians and Hindus do…

Jesus we believe was a Manifestation of God as was Baha’u’llah. The “Son of God” we believe was a title of the Lord Jessu indicating His spiirtual relationship with God just as Abraham was the Friend of God…
 
DavidMark said:
This is the Word which the Son concealed, when to those around Him He said: ‘
Ye cannot bear it now.’ And when the appointed time was fulfilled and the Hour had struck, the Word shone forth above the horizon of the Will of God.
Beware, O followers of the Son, that ye cast it not behind your backs. Take ye fast hold of it. Better is this for you than all that ye possess. Verily He is nigh unto them that do good. The Hour which We had concealed from the knowledge of the peoples of the earth and of the favored angels hath come to pass. (Bahá’u’lláh, Tablet to the Christians)

**One’s conduct must be like the conduct of Paul, and one’s faith similar to that of Peter. This musk-scented breeze shall perfume the nostrils of the people of the world, and this spirit shall resuscitate the dead. **(Selections from the Writings of Abdu’l-Baha, p. 223)
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DavidMark, Jesus said it before He sent the Apostles and his other disciples the Holy Spirit! The Gospels and the rest of the New Testament were written only a while after that! You can’t appreciate enough how much the event of that Pentecost changed things!
 
Jen said: could you please explain the part about no connection between material and spiritual objects?

The connection between God and the creatures is that of the creator to the creation; it is like the connection between the sun and the dark bodies of contingent beings, and is the connection between the maker and the things that he has made. The sun in its own essence is independent of the bodies which it lights; for its light is in itself, and is free and independent of the terrestrial globe; so the earth is under the influence of the sun and receives its light, whereas the sun and its rays are entirely independent of the earth.
But if there were no sun, the earth and all earthly beings could not exist.(Abdu’l-Baha, Baha’i World Faith, p. 314)

**The human spirit consists of the rational, or logical, reasoning faculty, which apprehends general ideas and things intelligible and perceptible. Now these “spirits” are not reckoned as Spirit in the terminology of the Scriptures and the usage of the people of the Truth, inasmuch as the laws governing them are as the laws which govern all phenomenal being in respect to generation, corruption, production, change and reversion, as is clearly indicated in the Gospel where it says: “Let the dead bury their dead;”
“That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is Spirit”; inasmuch as he who would bury these dead was alive with the vegetative, animal and rational human soul, yet did Christ – to whom be glory! – declare such dead and devoid of life, in that this person was devoid of the spirit of faith, which is of the Kingdom of God. **(Abdu’l-Baha, Baha’i World Faith, p. 370)

It is evident therefore according to His Holiness that the human spirit which is not fortified by the presence of the Holy Spirit is dead and in need of resurrection by that divine power; otherwise though materially advanced to high degrees man cannot attain full and complete progress.(Abdu’l-Baha, Baha’i World Faith, p. 241)

Today the force for Unity is the Holy Spirit of Bahá’u’lláh. He manifested this spirit of Unity. Bahá’u’lláh brings East and West together.(‘Abdu’l-Bahá in London, p. 54)
In this age of spiritual awakening, the world has entered upon the path of progress into the arena of development, where the power of the spirit surpasses that of the body. Soon the spirit will have dominion over the world of humanity.(Abdu’l-Baha in London, p. 81)

Therefore do not be anxious saying, “What shall we eat?” or “What shall we wear?”…But seek first His Kingdom and His righteousness, and all these things shall be yours as well. (Matthew 6:31-33)
The Kingdom is Mine. I, Myself, am, of Mine own right, its Ruler.(Bahá’u’lláh, GWB, p.33)
**Whosoever attributeth the verses of God to sorcery hath not believed in any of His Messengers, hath lived and laboured in vain, and is accounted of those who speak that of which they have no knowledge. **(Bahá’u’lláh, Suriy-i-Haykal, SLH, p. 29)
 
O thou yearner after the Truth!
The Supper of the Lord which His Highness the Spirit (Christ) ate with the apostles was a heavenly supper and not one of material bread and water, for material objects have no connection with spiritual objects.
As at that time material food was also present, therefore the leaders of the religion of Christ thought that it was material food which was changed into spiritual food.
The proof that it was not material food is this: The apostles upon many occasions partook of material food with His Highness Christ, yet the supper of that night became designated as the “Lord’s Supper.” From this designation it is plain and evident that they ate heavenly food at that supper. That heavenly food consisted of the love of God, the knowledge of God, the mysteries of God and the bestowal of God.(Tablets of Abdu’l-Baha v3, p. 514)

Unity, Justice, Love and Peace, Spirituality and Prayerfulness …these are the things i yearn after, and hunger for. Such is my confidence in the Lord Bahá’u’lláh to provide a matchlessly bountiful Table for Humanity that i am not concerned with those who do not want to come in to this wedding Feast…and i sure don’t want to contend with them. Even if all the other Bahá’ís should shirk what they professed, God willing i will remain unmovable as the Rock, although i will pray for everyone to show steadfastness, even in the face of bloody martyrdom, let alone the twittering of sparrows, the droning of gnats, etc.
Matthew 7:6 Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.
You who are nobly created as human souls are informed of a Claimant to divine revelation.
To reject Him outright is no proof; all the Manifestations have faced rejection.
Would that i had a chance to debate the highest religious leaders in the world on live TV.
All that would be necessary is to clearly establish the Claim and the new Announcement.

Let it now be seen what thy search and endeavours will achieve.(Baha’u’llah, The Kitab-i-Iqan, p. 123)
 
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