"The Bible will keep you from sin, or sin will keep you from the Bible"

[LegoGE1947]

Well, have you ever read an owner’s manuel and had to ask someone for help in understanding exactly what it is saying? Sorry, the Bible is not an owners manual, however. Where you find the answers to all of life’s questions is in the Church. The Church preceded the Bible and decided, based upon the truth it already possessed from the Apostles, which texts were inspired and which were not. Over 400 texts were considered in canonizing the Bible. Their inclusion in the canon was dependent upon how they measured up against the truth already held. The Church was not reliant upon the Bible for the truth it possesses, but rather on the teachings of the Apostles, part of which was committed to writing and called the New Testament. It was never meant to include all that we need because the Church never anticipated anyone relying solely upon it for their faith. That is the invention of man.

You are aware, are you not, that when Paul wrote this he could have only been referring to the Old Testatment since the New Testament had not yet been written nor canonized. So if it says anything it says too much; that the New Testament is not necessary.

But look at what it does actually say. Yes, all scripture is God-breathed. But how do we know what is Scripture and what is not? How were the sacred texts that make up the New Testament chosen and the other writings declined. Who decided, “this and no more”?

And yes, we would agree that Scripture is “useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness”. This does not say that Scripture is all we need, but rather that is is useful. You had better ask yourself why Christ started a Church and didn’t just hand out books to everyone and say good luck. It is the Church that is the foundation and pillar of truth and the authentic interpreter of the sacred texts that it chose to make up the New Testament.

Seems to be what alot of Protestant “evangelizers” do though–hand out bibles and say “good luck” I was counselled by a protestant pastor to simply read 1 John over and over for a week and come back and see him. When the week was over I didn’t know any more than I did before. When I told him so he was like “are you stupid?” He said he had given that same assignment to others and “they got it” :banghead:

 

[Missprisc]

Notice that the Bible is USEFUL but not all-sufficient for teaching, etc. One has to have someone to interpret it just like the Ethiopian in Acts. He could read Isaiah for himself but he couldn’t understand it until Phillip came and explained it to him that what he was reading referred to Jesus.

Yes, but when one becomes born-again, the Holy Spirit lives in you and teaches you. I agree that we need someone to possibly teach us the more difficult passages in Scripture, but God made the way of salvation easily understood by everyone. I am finishing up my 20th reading of the entire Bible and each time I read it, certain passages, at times will all at once be clear to me that possibly wasn’t the last time I read it. Note Jesus’ words to the disciples at the last supper when they wondered where and why he had to go:

John 14:16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Counselor to be with you forever—John 14:17 the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you. John 14:26 But the Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you.

I’m not trying to be argumentative, I am just reiterating what scripture teaches. For instance, In my quiet time with the Lord each morning I pray before I read and ask him to help me to know what scripture says and what it means by what it says-and He does! It’s amazing to me how much He loves us. God Bless you, friend.

 

[Missprisc]

Yes, but when one becomes born-again, the Holy Spirit lives in you and teaches you. I agree that we need someone to possibly teach us the more difficult passages in Scripture, but God made the way of salvation easily understood by everyone. I am finishing up my 20th reading of the entire Bible and each time I read it, certain passages, at times will all at once be clear to me that possibly wasn’t the last time I read it. Note Jesus’ words to the disciples at the last supper when they wondered where and why he had to go:

John 14:16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Counselor to be with you forever—John 14:17 the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you. John 14:26 But the Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you.

I’m not trying to be argumentative, I am just reiterating what scripture teaches. For instance, In my quiet time with the Lord each morning I pray before I read and ask him to help me to know what scripture says and what it means by what it says-and He does! It’s amazing to me how much He loves us. God Bless you, friend.

One other thing I forgot to mention was that Paul also tells us in Acts to be like the Bereans who searched the scriptures to make sure he was telling the truth. Here’s the passage:

Acts 17:11 Now the Bereans were of more noble character than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true.

 

[LegoGE1947]

Yes, but when one becomes born-again, the Holy Spirit lives in you and teaches you. I agree that we need someone to possibly teach us the more difficult passages in Scripture, but God made the way of salvation easily understood by everyone. I am finishing up my 20th reading of the entire Bible and each time I read it, certain passages, at times will all at once be clear to me that possibly wasn’t the last time I read it. Note Jesus’ words to the disciples at the last supper when they wondered where and why he had to go:

John 14:16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Counselor to be with you forever—John 14:17 the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you. John 14:26 But the Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you.

I’m not trying to be argumentative, I am just reiterating what scripture teaches. For instance, In my quiet time with the Lord each morning I pray before I read and ask him to help me to know what scripture says and what it means by what it says-and He does! It’s amazing to me how much He loves us. God Bless you, friend.

The whole “born-again” gig has given us 30,000 different denominations all of which profess to believe what the bible teaches but no two of them agree. The Holy Spirit is not the author of confusion but we have plenty of confusion in the religious world. Explain that!

 

[ltwin]

Saw this on fundamentalist church sign.
True or no?

It’s a catchy slogan on a church sign. It’s sort of true in that the word of God is an agent of repentance. “Faith comes from hearing the message, and the message is heard through the word of Christ” (Romans 10:17).

When we read the Bible, we are confronted with the law of God and our inability to adhere to it. Through this, the Holy Spirit convicts us of our sins. In the Bible we also encounter hope in the person of Jesus Christ and his atonement, which provides the way of forgiveness, sanctification, and salvation.

Those who are living in sin and in opposition to the grace of God will not likely read God’s word because they will avoid anything that leads to conviction.

 

[Regina_Love]

Would that Catholics had the same zeal for the written word of God that Evangelicals seem to have. I would love to see Catholics venerate the written word of God in their personal lives the same way we do at Mass, giving it pride of place in their day to day routine in the same way we carry it at the front of the procession, kissing it after reading it, and enthroning it in a prominent place in their home.

If Catholics had the same love for scripture that some Evangelicals seem to have, we would be unstoppable.

***For the word of God is living and active, sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing to the division of soul and spirit, of joints and marrow, and discerning the thoughts and intentions of the heart. ***(Hebrews 4:12)

Reading scripture is a powerful weapon, especially for those who unite it with the sacraments.

When the Evangelical Churches collapse some day, all their members who run to the Catholic Church are going to bring great gifts with them. One of those gifts they will lay at the foot of the Chair of Peter is a great love for scripture.

-Tim-

Well said brother. And the Catholic Church misses their gifts and talents! Converts are the most fun to talk to. I enjoy discussing the faith, scripture, and sharing testimonies. Come Home to the Catholic Church. We need you to be complete

 

[Regina_Love]

Yes, but when one becomes born-again, the Holy Spirit lives in you and teaches you. I agree that we need someone to possibly teach us the more difficult passages in Scripture, but God made the way of salvation easily understood by everyone. I am finishing up my 20th reading of the entire Bible and each time I read it, certain passages, at times will all at once be clear to me that possibly wasn’t the last time I read it. Note Jesus’ words to the disciples at the last supper when they wondered where and why he had to go:

John 14:16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Counselor to be with you forever—John 14:17 the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you. John 14:26 But the Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you.

I’m not trying to be argumentative, I am just reiterating what scripture teaches. For instance, In my quiet time with the Lord each morning I pray before I read and ask him to help me to know what scripture says and what it means by what it says-and He does! It’s amazing to me how much He loves us. God Bless you, friend.

I enjoy hearing your love for God, and Scripture. When the Holy Spirit is active in your life it is very exciting! How wonderful that you have read the Bible so many times. I’m sure it helps you to see scripture as a whole. Some knowing only a few verses misunderstand their meaning or intent. I am a reader of the Word at Mass. Did you know almost every word of the Mass is found in scripture? It’s very life giving!

What is your understanding of passages about the Body, and Blood of Christ? When I read John 6:53 “Jesus said to them, Amen, amen, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you do not have life within you.” What do you believe God is teaching us here?

 

[JustaServant]

I was looking up this quote to verify that it came from Dwight L. Moody and found this forum. I put this quote in every Bible that I give as a gift. The thought behind the quote is that if one READS it - God’s living word - you will be transformed into the likeness of Christ and sin - less (not sinless-we are imperfect unlike Christ who WAS sinless). When one is a Christian (or Christ follower) one wants to be like Him. Where else to find the answer to all life’s questions and how to live life, but from the Owner’s Manual - The Bible. Contrast this with the one who lives in sin - he will not want to read it and be convicted.
!

Missprisc,
What did Christians do before there was a Bible? How did they accomplish what you say when most Christians in the Early Church did not know how to read?

 

[LegoGE1947]

Missprisc,
What did Christians do before there was a Bible? How did they accomplish what you say when most Christians in the Early Church did not know how to read?

And even those who could read, a copy of the scriptures, as with any other book, would be extremely rare and expensive since there was no technology to mass produce them until the 15th century when printing was invented.

 

[CopticChristian]

Saw this on fundamentalist church sign.
True or no?

Just,

This reminds me of many things.

Shawshank Redemption, the movie. The Warden gave every inmate a Bible. He had Bible verses on his safe where he committed larceny and then shot himself. Bible didn’t help him much. Here the Bible did not keep the warden from sin.

This reminds me of Greg Laurie, Protestant Pastor, saying that the only people that don’t respond to an altar call are those that don’t want to confront their sin. I say, that I would never respond to an altar call because I don’t want to be Protestant. Here it is not sin that keeps your from the Bible.

So, then a question to ask is what is sin?

So, is it sin to deny that there is truth? Is it a sin to lie?

So, if you go to the Fundamentalist church, learn to deny that Christ built a Church and then tell people that Catholics are not Christians and will go to hell…has the Bible succeeded in keeping a person from sin if they found it and read it?

or is it possible that if they found it and never went to a Bible study this would never happen?