The Brain and the Mind

[Faith1960]

Can anyone here help me with this? It’s about the difference between the brain and mind, and how the mind and brain aren’t the same thing?
Doctors believe that OCD is caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain, which is often helped by taking medication. How can the mind be separate from the brain when the brain responds to medication and is the source of the OCD symptoms?

 

[JimR-OCDS]

The brain is the organism with the mind uses to store, filter and calculate information.

There are more mysteries about how the mind and brain work together than what we know.

A book I read a couple years ago, “Who’s In Charge? Free Will and the Science of the Brain”, by Michael S. Gazzaniga. Michael S. Gazzaniga is known as the father of neuroscience and his book was informative, but can get a little deep.

Jim

 

[Faith1960]

The brain is the organism with the mind uses to store, filter and calculate information.

There are more mysteries about how the mind and brain work together than what we know.

I believe that OCD is a result of an chemical imbalance of the brain. Does that contradict the belief that the brain and mind are two different things?

 

[JimR-OCDS]

I believe that OCD is a result of an chemical imbalance of the brain. Does that contradict the belief that the brain and mind are two different things?

I believe they are two different things.

However, it’s way above my pay-grade to provide any conclusive answer to the question.

Jim

 

[Patrick1540]

Can anyone here help me with this? It’s about the difference between the brain and mind, and how the mind and brain aren’t the same thing?
Doctors believe that OCD is caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain, which is often helped by taking medication. How can the mind be separate from the brain when the brain responds to medication and is the source of the OCD symptoms?

Hi Faith, I suffer from OCD and PTSD. The mind, the brain, are to seperate things, as most have said. OCD is the brain, can be turned into a positive thing, if electrons in the brain fire right.It can be used for leadership an organization. The mind or conscience is part of the soul, which is actually divided in two parts. Our consciences and our spirit.Speaking from experience, they are very seperate. Our conscience(soul), is were are Faith, morals,values,and Holy Spirit dwell. Our brain, is just the organism, which controls the body and thought. It is more like a computer. Our Sou,l is the one, that guides us ,through life. You can still have faith, even when our brain, is not firing right.Does this make sense? There is nothing to be embarrassed about, taking medication for this. If you had cancer, it does not effect the soul, only the body, and you would take medication for it. Same way meds for OCD, effects the organism of the brain, to help it correctly fire it’s electrons, totally seperate, from your soul(mind). Hopes this helps explain. If you have any other question, just ask, because I’m going through the same thing.
God Bless and Peace of God’s Spirit

 

[AlanFromWichita]

Doctors believe that OCD is caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain, which is often helped by taking medication. How can the mind be separate from the brain when the brain responds to medication and is the source of the OCD symptoms?

My personal belief is that the OCD behavior is more likely to cause a chemical imbalance than result from one. True that medication can help. I personally think that many “mental illnesses” that don’t result from physical pathology such as Alzheimer’s, stroke, concussion etc. are more like “software problems” in thinking or socialization (nurture rather than nature) that have caused emotions and behavior to go awry. This in turn messes up the chemistry of the blood. Some may disagree, but I have good reasons for my opinion and I’m not sure you wanted to go into that anyway.

Alan

 

[GEddie]

Like I said to my 10-yo nephew: “Your brain is part of your head; your mind is part of your soul.”

(I know that philosophically, a soul has no parts. You could replace part in this context with “faculty” or “process”, etc.)

We need our head and brain to hold and express our mind, just as we need our bodies to hold our life (which is the soul).

But mind and brain are not the same. The brain consists of cells, axons, synapses, blood vessels, etc; the mind, of thoughts and memories and wisdoms; etc.

There are no cells and blood vessels in the mind, and you cannot find thoughts or memories in the brain no matter how you search. They are not the same; just as you can search the human body from skull dome to toe tips and see all manner of life functions, but not life itself.

ICXC NIKA

 

[grannymh]

I believe that OCD is a result of an chemical imbalance of the brain. Does that contradict the belief that the brain and mind are two different things?

The “mind” is the spiritual principle (soul) and the brain is the material principle (anatomy). Both are uniquely united into one single human nature.

Chemical imbalances, birth defects, tumors, brain damage, etc.,prevent the intellective rational soul from acting according to its abilities.

 

[Faith1960]

The “mind” is the spiritual principle (soul) and the brain is the material principle (anatomy). Both are uniquely united into one single human nature.

Chemical imbalances, birth defects, tumors, brain damage, etc.,prevent the intellective rational soul from acting according to its abilities.

I take Lexapro and Clomipramine to steady the supposed chemical imbalance in my brain. Does that conrtadict the idea of the mind being different from the brain?

 

[GEddie]

I take Lexapro and Clomipramine to steady the supposed chemical imbalance in my brain. Does that conrtadict the idea of the mind being different from the brain?

No; just as taking heart or breathing medicines to sustain life does not contradict the soul and body being distinct.

Even though the soul is the life in your body, the body holds and expresses your life. Illness harms body’s ability to hold life, and medicine can alleviate that harm.

Likewise, your soul generates your mind; which however needs a functioning head to reside in. A misfunctioning head can disable the mind’s operations. Medicines can likewise alleviate those limitations.

ICXC NIKA

 

[AlanFromWichita]

I take Lexapro and Clomipramine to steady the supposed chemical imbalance in my brain. Does that conrtadict the idea of the mind being different from the brain?

Normally these things should be described symptomatically. Your doctor should explain what symptoms you are having, and how this medicine is going to improve that symptom. Those medicines – and of course verify with your doctor before believing me – are not naturally occurring in our systems. It’s not like taking iron to cure a low iron level. They are manufactured medicines that are designed to bring about changes in your symptoms. Like tranquilizers, or antipsychotics, or stimulants.

Please forgive if you know all this but I’m concerned that “supposed chemical imbalance” made we question if your doctor hasn’t described the effects of the medicine, to you. He or she should tell you these things. Otherwise, if you don’t know the changes in symptoms to be looking for how do you know it’s working? Also the doctor should tell you what to do if it doesn’t work, or if you get unusual symptoms-- discontinue, increase dose, call in for advice?

Alan

 

[Faith1960]

Normally these things should be described symptomatically. Your doctor should explain what symptoms you are having, and how this medicine is going to improve that symptom. Those medicines – and of course verify with your doctor before believing me – are not naturally occurring in our systems. It’s not like taking iron to cure a low iron level. They are manufactured medicines that are designed to bring about changes in your symptoms. Like tranquilizers, or antipsychotics, or stimulants.

Please forgive if you know all this but I’m concerned that “supposed chemical imbalance” made we question if your doctor hasn’t described the effects of the medicine, to you. He or she should tell you these things. Otherwise, if you don’t know the changes in symptoms to be looking for how do you know it’s working? Also the doctor should tell you what to do if it doesn’t work, or if you get unusual symptoms-- discontinue, increase dose, call in for advice?

Alan

I said “supposed chemical balance” because that’s the current thought as to the cause of OCD but the medications aren’t really helping. I did start to find some relief from taking Lexapro and Abilify but the Abilify can raise blood sugar and I have diabetes. I got scared about that and discontinued it.

Do you believe this is a chemical imbalance?

 

[Faith1960]

No; just as taking heart or breathing medicines to sustain life does not contradict the soul and body being distinct.

Even though the soul is the life in your body, the body holds and expresses your life. Illness harms body’s ability to hold life, and medicine can alleviate that harm.

Likewise, your soul generates your mind; which however needs a functioning head to reside in. A misfunctioning head can disable the mind’s operations. Medicines can likewise alleviate those limitations.

ICXC NIKA

Do you believe that OCD is a chemical imbalance in the brain?

 

[GEddie]

Do you believe that OCD is a chemical imbalance in the brain?

I am not a doctor so can’t say.

If medicines can correct it, there would seem to be a physical aspect to it. But that may not be all there is to it.

Some things about our bodies and life are purely physical; but the “higher” one’s functioning becomes, the more soul is involved.

ICXC NIKA

 

[Patrick1540]

Do you believe that OCD is a chemical imbalance in the brain?

The only way you can be sure is a Catscan of the brain.The brain is very complex. Like I said, before it is a computer and a electrical conductor. OCD, can be caused by electrons going the wrong route or misfiring.This can be fixed by meds or even electical pulses. Some times it can be, a simple diet change.To much or to little salt, has an effect on our brain.Best way to know for sure, whether chemical, or biological, is a CT scan.Talk to your doctor.I know for a fact,if you drink to many sport drinks in a day,that can mess with your brain chemistry.
God Bless

 

[Faith1960]

The “mind” is the spiritual principle (soul) and the brain is the material principle (anatomy). Both are uniquely united into one single human nature.

Chemical imbalances, birth defects, tumors, brain damage, etc.,prevent the intellective rational soul from acting according to its abilities.

Do you believe that chemical imbalances of the brain cause distorted thinking and feelings such as depression? And, if so, wouldn’t that and/or taking medication for these problems contradict the existence of the mind being a separate entity?

 

[jmcrae]

Do you believe that chemical imbalances of the brain cause distorted thinking and feelings such as depression? And, if so, wouldn’t that and/or taking medication for these problems contradict the existence of the mind being a separate entity?

The brain is the mind’s interface to physical experience. So, your physical experience will vary, depending on the condition of your brain.

If your brain is not functioning correctly, you will have a distorted experience of the physical world, such as hallucinations or wild emotions. These things will seem “real” to the mind, because the brain is the interface through which the mind is experiencing physical reality. When the problem with the brain has been fixed, then the mind will experience physical reality in an undistorted way, and things will become much clearer.

 

[cornbread_r2]

The “mind” is the spiritual principle (soul) and the brain is the material principle (anatomy). Both are uniquely united into one single human nature.

Chemical imbalances, birth defects, tumors, brain damage, etc.,prevent the intellective rational soul from acting according to its abilities.

Oddly though, according to Catholic doctrine, the actual death of the brain has no effect whatsoever on the rational soul.

 

[AlanFromWichita]

I said “supposed chemical balance” because that’s the current thought as to the cause of OCD but the medications aren’t really helping. I did start to find some relief from taking Lexapro and Abilify but the Abilify can raise blood sugar and I have diabetes. I got scared about that and discontinued it.

Do you believe this is a chemical imbalance?

First, I have no doubt that bad blood chemistry (IMO the same blood goes through the brain as everywhere else) such as excess or lack of a hormone, or even iron level, can cause shifts in the way one thinks and acts. That said, in my experience I have come to believe that environment is more likely to cause the disease, along with possible chemical shift. I can’t tell you the chemical effect of those medicines.

No way do I presume to say what your situation is as far as blood chemistry, but the reason I like to think about it as that my thinking has gone out of synchronization with others – almost a social issue or emotional/spiritual issue (not popular in some thought circles but even so, often there is a software workaround to a hardware problem) – then that gives me hope that I can restructure my thinking in such a way that I don’t have that problem any more. That’s what I did, essentially fixed my thinking through various means, and with much love from friends and family and good doctor and SD, and much healing touch from the Holy Spirit aka Divine Therapist, now I’m healed. And for me, being fixed by the Lord is way better than never having been broken in the first place. :dancing:

In other words, I don’t “blame” my psychosis on some elusive chemistry issue that I’m helpless to do anything about. Contemplative prayer was the first new type of prayer my SD gave me, that turned out to be a major component in my getting better.

Alan

 

[Peter_Plato]

Can anyone here help me with this? It’s about the difference between the brain and mind, and how the mind and brain aren’t the same thing?
Doctors believe that OCD is caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain, which is often helped by taking medication. How can the mind be separate from the brain when the brain responds to medication and is the source of the OCD symptoms?

Trent Horn provided a very good analysis of this question on a recent Catholic Answers radio show. Start at about the 45 minute mark on this link:

catholic.com/radio/shows/open-forum-for-atheists-7537

In his answer, he uses the analogy of a car and driver to show that the brain and mind can have correlations in terms of neurochemical processes and mental states. When the mind wills to stand or walk, the body carries out the function just as when a driver turns the wheel of a car or presses the accelerator, the car responds appropriately. Conversely, when a windshield is shattered or a tire goes flat, those physical states of the car make it difficult for the driver to control the car, just as alcohol impairment, drugs or disease make it difficult for the mind to receive accurate (name removed by moderator)ut from the body. So there could be a two-way correlation kind of relationship between the brain and mind without necessarily entailing a dependency. The driver could leave the car when a destination is reached as could the mind leave the body at the end of life.

David Chalmers is a philosopher who has defined the “hard problem” of consciousness. His view is that all scientific research into neurochemistry is showing that brain functions do correlate to mind processes. If a certain neuron is triggered a corresponding mental state occurs. On the other hand, when a mental judgement or willful state is determined that state triggers a change in neuron functioning and a physical response occurs.

However, no research even hints at why consciousness goes with the functional processes. Why subjective awareness accompanies the processes is still a mystery.

This is a short video of his explaining the “hard problem.”

youtube.com/watch?v=kdbs-HUAxC8&sns=em