Amen Sister!
I retract my earlier comments about Jesus’ lack of clarity…I see now how very clear Jesus was in John 6 now that I have a clear understanding of John 6:63 from my participation on this thread.
I second the opinion that this thread has been very useful and a testament to Catholic teaching of the the real presence of Jesus in the Eucharist.
AlegreFe;3547345:
Well Scott, God was not speaking figuratively and I know you know that. He was very clear on this matter so there was no need for further clarification as He did in John 4:31-34 when His disciples thought He was talking about food. Jesus was talking about doing the will of His father. Since His disciples thought He was talking about food and not doing the will of His father he had to clarify. There was no need for clarification in John 6 because those people knew exactly what Jesus was talking about and they were not about to accept that they had to eat His flesh. So Jesus let them walk, John 6
:
66
This is for extra clarification for Scott. But this post is mainly for
zerinus who thinks this is a hyperbole;
The real presence is indeed REAL as Jesus said that He is real food and real drink. Jesus meant that HIS flesh & blood were REAL food & drink, food that you masticate or munch (from the Aramaic). How is that figurative? The disciples of Jesus would never walk away over a “symbol” or a “hyperbole” or something that is only meant to be figurative now would they? Think about it. Why would the disciples walk away from Jesus if they thought He was speaking metaphorically?
I want to make this very clear, the passages from verses 51 through 58 are directly from scripture. Then I will present to you what YOU perceive to believe is true. Verse 60 is not scripture but I would like to put it down to what you believe and how you seem to want it to be.
So here goes. Imagine this;
51 I am the living bread that came down from heaven; whoever eats this bread will live forever; and the bread that I will give is my flesh for the life of the world."
52 The Jews quarreled among themselves, saying, “How can this man give us (his) flesh to eat?”
53 Jesus said to them, “Amen, amen, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you do not have life within you.
54 Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him on the last day.
55 For my flesh is true food, and my blood is true drink.
56 Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me and I in him.
57 Just as the living Father sent me and I have life because of the Father, so also the one who feeds on me will have life because of me.
58 This is the bread that came down from heaven. Unlike your ancestors who ate and still died, whoever eats this bread will live forever.”
(changed verse 60 to suit what you believe, this is
not scripture, just want to make that clear)
60
Then many of his disciples who were listening said, "Oh I get it! You don’t mean it literally, you only mean it figuratively!"
If this is what the disciples really said and if it were true then there would be no need for Jesus to continue about the Holy Spirit. But this was NOT the case. Instead they kept on “quarreling” and “murmuring” about it. Why would anyone “quarrel” or “murmur” over something that is only meant to be a hyperbole? or symbolic? That would be nonsensical.
Let’s just say that they said this the first time around in verse 52. You could say that
“How can this man give us his flesh to eat” was them possibly questioning whether this was meant to be taken literally or not. Then we can clearly see that Jesus clarified over again that they they were to eat His flesh and drink His blood. 7 times! SEVEN times, Jesus said that we are to eat His flesh. There is nothing figurative there. That is clearly NOT a hyperbole.
Let’s put what it really says in Scripture, verse 60;
60 Then many of his disciples who were listening said,
"This saying is hard; who can accept it?"
Why would it be a hard saying if it were only figurative? Since the disciples thought it was a hard saying they knew they had to eat the flesh of the Son of man, but they didn’t want to do that. And because of this Jesus had to tell them about the Holy Spirit. I think this is clearly a revelation of the Spirit. The Spirit will reveal to you that what Jesus says is not symbolic and that Jesus speaks the truth that His flesh is true food. It is true spiritual food to nourish our souls but real food that we have to eat just as Jesus commanded of us.
I want to continue with my hypothetical verses here;
66 As a result of this, many (of) his disciples returned to their former way of life and no longer accompanied him.
(v67 is what you seem to believe and again I want to make clear that this is not scripture)
67
Jesus said to the disciples as they walked away, "Why are you walking away. I didn’t mean it literally. You’re taking it the wrong way. I only meant it figuratively; come back!"
Since we know this is not scripture we know that Jesus let them walk because Jesus knew that they took Him literally. Why? Because He meant it literally. There is nothing figurative about the words of Jesus. There is nothing figurative about the flesh of Jesus. There is nothing figurative about the Holy Spirit.
