The cathloic church

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agiosotheos said:
No. Jesus was conceived without original sin.
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Reading the posts on this CAF. I’m going to wade into unfamiliar waters and see if I understand the whole issue…Mary is the only one who was immacualtely conceived…by that to mean she was “saved” from the stain of original sin. Jesus was not “saved” from the stain of original sin…since Mary had no original sin, there was no original sin to inheirit…Mary was “saved” from the stain by being cleansed from it at the time of conception…Jesus on the other hand had no reason to be “saved” since he bore no stain what so ever.
 
Publisher said:
Reading the posts on this CAF. I’m going to wade into unfamiliar waters and see if I understand the whole issue…Mary is the only one who was immacualtely conceived…by that to mean she was “saved” from the stain of original sin. Jesus was not “saved” from the stain of original sin…since Mary had no original sin, there was no original sin to inheirit…Mary was “saved” from the stain by being cleansed from it at the time of conception…Jesus on the other hand had no reason to be “saved” since he bore no stain what so ever.
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Well, not being Romanist I don’t believe that Mary was preserved from the ancestral curse from her very conception.

Jesus, on the other hand, while coming by being immaculately conceived in a different way than they believe Mary came by being immaculately conceived, still ended up with the same state of being born with original sin. The terminology appears to be referring to the state of being conceived without any sin, and therefore Jesus would definitely qualify.
 
Publisher said:
.Mary was “saved” from the stain by being cleansed from it at the time of conception…
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Also, your description of the Roman doctrine is not entirely accurate. Mary is believed to have been prevented from ever participating in original sin, and thus it is not appropriate to say that she was cleansed of it, because one cannot be cleansed of something that one never had.
 
agiosotheos said:
Also, your description of the Roman doctrine is not entirely accurate. Mary is believed to have been prevented from ever participating in original sin, and thus it is not appropriate to say that she was cleansed of it, because one cannot be cleansed of something that one never had.
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OK, I think I get it…Mary was “saved” from ever having original sin…Jesus took no original sin since Mary didn’t have it in the first place…But Jesus could never be spoken of using the terms of “saved from origial sin”…he was never exposed to it.

The nuances of certain Catholic doctines are interesting at times.🙂
 
Publisher said:
OK, I think I get it…Mary was “saved” from ever having original sin…Jesus took no original sin since Mary didn’t have it in the first place…But Jesus could never be spoken of using the terms of “saved from origial sin”…he was never exposed to it.

The nuances of certain Catholic doctines are interesting at times.🙂
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I think it makes more sense to say that she was protected from original sin than that she was saved from it. Romanists would disagree because that would mean that Mary didn’t need salvation, and they couldn’t admit to that. But I think it is the logical conclusion. And that is one of the reasons I think the doctrine is ridiculous.
 
agiosotheos said:
I think it makes more sense to say that she was protected from original sin than that she was saved from it. Romanists would disagree because that would mean that Mary didn’t need salvation, and they couldn’t admit to that. But I think it is the logical conclusion. And that is one of the reasons I think the doctrine is ridiculous.
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Call us Catholic, not “Roamanists” that is a pejorative term that makes me think you feelk that you are superior.
 
CWBetts said:
WE ARE THE CATHOLIC CHURCH. What is your issue with this?
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My issue is that you have adopted numerous heresies contrary to the fundamentals of Catholic Christianity and thus cannot be the Catholic Church.
 
agiosotheos said:
My issue is that you have adopted numerous heresies contrary to the fundamentals of Catholic Christianity and thus cannot be the Catholic Church.
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Actually it is the Catholic Church that had defended the Faith against heresies.
 
Back on topic…

IIRC from St. Maxmillian Kolbe, Mary was the only person immaculately conceived. Neither Adam or Eve were conceived; the were created. Jesus wasn’t conceived; he was begotten.

I don’t think the others (Eligah, Jeremiah) are correct. They may have never committed a sin they were but not conceived, or born, without sin.
 
Bruised_Reed said:
IIRC from St. Maxmillian Kolbe, Mary was the only person immaculately conceived. Neither Adam or Eve were conceived; the were created. Jesus wasn’t conceived; he was begotten.
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Is this terminological nuance simply an indication that the humanity of the Logos was not created by the union of a sperm cell and an egg cell?
 
agiosotheos said:
Is this terminological nuance simply an indication that the humanity of the Logos was not created by the union of a sperm cell and an egg cell?
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Umm, maybe… I can’t find my book but I think St. Maximillian wrote that Jesus was conceived but was not a conception. So, if I understand you correctly, then yes.
 
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