The Catholic Church is God?

[Angainor]

This is taken from [thread=42250]another thread[/thread]:

Angainor:

Hey, from my point of view, it is not me that is staying away from the Catholic Church. It is the Catholic Church that will not accept me.

Donna P:

Then all I can say is that you haven’t accepted yourself as a Child of God. But He accepts you always.

I stated that the Catholic Church would not accept me. You responded that God accepts me always.

I always suspected that some Catholics viewed the Catholic Church itself as god, but I never expected that answer.

Is Donna P unusual in her regard of the Catholic Church?

 

[Windmill]

God loves us just as we are, but he loves us too much to let us stay that way. We do nothing to merit Christ entering our lives. But once he’s there, there are some practical consequences. We enter into the struggle against our sinfulness and pride. We turn from the World, the Flesh, and the Devil which all try to take us away from the path to holiness. If we sin and refuse to repent, God’s life in us is snuffed out - by our own free will. God still loves us, but that love is not dwelling in us. It is outside, beckoning us to turn back to it.

The fact that the Church has minimum guidelines for formal participation in the sacraments is just safeguarding the graces God died to give us. To refuse to comply with these means you don’t want to participate in their rituals by their rules. If the Catholic Church is the church Christ left us, and the church he tells us to obey, then you are on shaky grounds, my friend.

 

[martino]

Angainor:

This is taken from [thread=42250]another thread[/thread]:

I stated that the Catholic Church would not accept me. You responded that God accepts me always.

I always suspected that some Catholics viewed the Catholic Church itself as god, but I never expected that answer.

Is Donna P unusual in her regard of the Catholic Church?

She specifically said that “you havent accepted yourself as a child of God”, whether that is true or not, she did not say that the Catholic Church is God. Her point was that the Catholic Church was founded by God for His children. You obviously disagree with that claim but dont go putting words into her mouth or ours.

 

[Genesis315]

Angainor:

This is taken from [thread=42250]another thread[/thread]:

I stated that the Catholic Church would not accept me. You responded that God accepts me always.

I always suspected that some Catholics viewed the Catholic Church itself as god, but I never expected that answer.

Is Donna P unusual in her regard of the Catholic Church?

First, why won’t the Church accept you?

Second, no one thinks the Church is God. I think you misunderstood what was being said. Were you trying to take a cheapshot perhaps? I think you knew the answer to your own questions.

 

[Angainor]

Genesis315:

I think you misunderstood what was being said. Were you trying to take a cheapshot perhaps?

I was clearly talking about the Catholic Church. Donna P so easily shifted the subject of the discussion from The Church to God. Too easily in my opinion. Maybe it is just awkward language, but for me it is more likely that she doesn’t clearly distinguish between the two in her mind.

I hope I am wrong.

 

[Angainor]

Genesis315:

First, why won’t the Church accept you?

Why? You would have to ask her.

How do I know? I don’t accept Catholicism as either a source or the authority of Truth. I think that disqualifies me.

 

[Genesis315]

I was clearly talking about the Catholic Church. Donna P so easily shifted the subject of the discussion from The Church to God. Too easily in my opinion. Maybe it is just awkward language, but for me it is more likely that she doesn’t clearly distinguish between the two in her mind.
I hope I am wrong.

By the way, why doesn’t the Church accept you? I’m just curious. If it’s personal, you don’t have to say.

 

[Genesis315]

Angainor:

How do I know? I don’t accept Catholicism as either a source or the authority of Truth. I think that disqualifies me.

Hey, from my point of view, it is not me that is staying away from the Catholic Church. It is the Catholic Church that will not accept me.

*Well, you just said it wasn’t you that didn’t accept the Church. Now you say it is you that doesn’t accept the Church. What gives?

 

[Robert_in_SD]

Angainor:

This is taken from [thread=42250]another thread[/thread]:

I stated that the Catholic Church would not accept me. You responded that God accepts me always.

I always suspected that some Catholics viewed the Catholic Church itself as god, but I never expected that answer.

Is Donna P unusual in her regard of the Catholic Church?

Hello Angainor;

Do you really require an answer to this quetion or are you posting it to provoke angry responses? Of course Catholics do NOT view the Catholic Church as God. We view the Catholic Church as the Church founded by Christ on the Apostle Peter. It seems to me that you are harboring some sour grapes over something. I’m sorry if somewhere along the line you were hurt by someone in the Catholic Church.

It does not appear to me that Donna P. regards the Catholic Church as God either, although it does appear to me that she is concerned for you, and wants you to know you are loved by God.

Peace and Charity,

 

[Grace_and_Glory]

As Catholics, we do not view the Catholic Church as God; however, we do believe that God acts through His Church. For example, in the sacrament of Reconciliation, we believe that God forgives us. If I were to say, “I don’t want to go to Confession because I don’t think the Church would forgive me”, it would be perfectly natural for someone to say, “God always forgives you if you are repentant” because it is God who acts through the sacrament. The person would not be trying to tell me that the Church is God, but if God acts through the Church, the Church would do what Christ does and has given His Church the power to do. I can see where someone who didn’t understand that Catholics believe God acts through the sacraments performed by the Church might see the other person in my hypothetical conversation as equating God with the Church, but that is not the intent or the meaning of what was said. I think the same is true in your case. I hope that helped.

 

[Angainor]

Genesis315:

Well, you just said it wasn’t you that didn’t accept the Church. Now you say it is you that doesn’t accept the Church. What gives?

Very observant… I guess you are right. We don’t accept eachother.

 

[Angainor]

Robert in SD:

Of course Catholics do NOT view the Catholic Church as God.

Alright, but I still think there is room for some concern. I have heard Catholics say that they love the Church. Like the thread exploring the question “Is Eucharistic Adoration Idolotry?”, I think love for the Church herself represents another minor diversion from what is really important. To me, it seems Catholicism is full of this type of minor diversions from what is really important.

 

[Genesis315]

Angainor:

Alright, but I still think there is room for some concern. I have heard Catholics say that they love the Church. Like the thread exploring the question “Is Eucharistic Adoration Idolotry?”, I think love for the Church herself represents another minor diversion from what is really important. To me, it seems Catholicism is full of this type of minor diversions from what is really important.

You have got to be joking. People say they love their mom. People say they love their school. People love their friends. People love their country. Loving the Church is not idolatry. Take your ant-Catholic garbage elsewhere and get a life.

 

[CARose]

angainor,

I may regret this, but on your question, it the Church “God”, you may be thinking of our referring to the Church as the Mystical Body of Christ. This is true, we, as members of the Church, and this includes all Baptised Christians, whether they realize it or not, are members of the Body of Christ, and we serve God by animating Christ on earth today through our actions.

I’ve got to run to eat, I’ll post more on the subject when I get back.

God Bless,

CARose

 

[Gilbert_Keith]

The Church is often spoken of as the Body of Christ.

In that sense the Church is in God and God is in the Church.

“I am the vine, you are the branches.” John 15

 

[Angainor]

Robert in SD:

Hello Angainor;

Do you really require an answer to this quetion or are you posting it to provoke angry responses? Of course Catholics do NOT view the Catholic Church as God.

Greetings Robert in SD,

I’m not sure what to think. [post=489713]Gilbert Keith[/post] certianly makes it sound that he thinks “In that sense the Church is in God and God is in the Church.”

 

[Tim_in_MI]

Gilbert Keith:

The Church is often spoken of as the Body of Christ.

In that sense the Church is in God and God is in the Church.

“I am the vine, you are the branches.” John 15

Also, when Saul (Paul) was going after Christians in the book of Acts, Jesus said, “Saul, Saul, why do you persecute me?”. He didn’t say “…my Church?”. In a certain sense, Christ and the Church are one.

 

[Grace_and_Glory]

If the Church is in God and God is in the Church, that does not make the Church God. I believe that the Holy Spirit lives in me (see 1 Corinthians 19). In a sense, I am in Christ (see 1 Corinthians 3:23). That does not mean I think I am God.
It is also helpful to see the relationship between Christ and the Church as a marriage, as in Ephesians Ch. 5. The Church and Christ are united as a Bridegroom and Bride are united. The Church is the body of Christ (see Ephesians 5:29-30). However, Catholics do not worship the Church; the Church worships Christ.

 

[scylla]

The Church will accept anyone, it is people who by their own pride, unacceptance, misunderstanding or ignorance who reject it. To be part of the Church is to submit to the idea that Jesus created a Church and if you want to folllow Him you should follow His plan.

Please don’t put words in people’s mouths, we are here to learn from each other and get a better understanding of the truth. What is the truth?
What is the pillar and bulwark of the truth?
1 Timothy 3:15 The Bible says it’s the Church.
Aren’t we right in following it then?

 

[Traditional_Ang]

Angainor:

Why? You would have to ask her.

How do I know? I don’t accept Catholicism as either a source or the authority of Truth. I think that disqualifies me.

Aganor,

Do you accept the Sacred Scrpture?

Do you accept the Apostles Creed and the Nicene Creed?

Do you believe that Jesus Christ is God made man, died for us and our sins, risen from the dead to give us new life?

If you do, you’re already part of the way there, because everything I listed relied on Ecumenical Councils and the Tradition of the Church.

If you can believe in the Resurrection, everything else is fairly easy.

Blessings and Peace, Michael