The Dress Of The Sisters

[puzzleannie]

At . How do the different Orders decide how they are to dress? I am just curious…

Thank you. :heart:Blyss

most orders have a meeting yearly or some regular time period where they all come together and discuss and vote on such issues. I am sure pros and cons of the suggested alternatives are investigated and presented, the rule of the order is consulted, and necessary permissions are sought. Pope Pius XII actually urged nuns to consider modernizing their habits to reduce time spent in caring for complex styles and fabrics–laundering, starching etc–and to make them more conducive to the type of work they were doing–nursing, teaching or whatever.

 

[BarbaraTherese]

Some religious orders do give the sisters the option to choose whether to wear the modified habit or casual clothing and hence there is a mixture in a congregation of both.

 

[mercygate]

most orders have a meeting yearly or some regular time period where they all come together and discuss and vote on such issues. I am sure pros and cons of the suggested alternatives are investigated and presented, the rule of the order is consulted, and necessary permissions are sought. Pope Pius XII actually urged nuns to consider modernizing their habits to reduce time spent in caring for complex styles and fabrics–laundering, starching etc–and to make them more conducive to the type of work they were doing–nursing, teaching or whatever.

ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/519KX0WN27L.SL160_PIsitb-dp-arrow,TopRight,21,-23_SH30_OU01_AA115.jpgThis is an interesting read.

The Habit: A History of the Clothing of Catholic Nuns by Elizabeth Kuhns

 

[Gardenman]

I truly miss the traditional habit worn by so many of the orders. Some of the head-dresses were a bit extreme, but the mofications made immediately following Vatican II seemed much more conducive to ministies and comfort and practicality.

Then it just got to be ridiculous. Some wore veils with no real regularity, others eliminated them completely. Sisters were wearing dowdy looking outfits with no veils, then pants, then t-shirts, etc. Those pins and emblems most of them wear have no impact and don’t really even look “religious”.

You’re either a nun 24/7 or not at all. What are these women trying to prove? Are they afraid to be recognizable for their vocation???

Gee…isn’t it amazing that the traditional habit-wearing orders are getting new recruits while the rest have dwindling numbers every year or are disbanding ???

Their way of life, not living in community, and every aspect of their life does nothing to attract new vocations. Single religious catholic women’s lives are essentially no different than some of these liberal orders.

Our convents are empty, and it’s no wonder.

 

[1234]

It’s typical that a lay* man* would be so doctrinaire about habits. He is not a consecrated religious woman and never will be.

It’s the laypeople who are the most sentimental about the habits. Those who wore them for 20-40 years were much less so. Even the so-called ‘modernized’ ones with long sleeves, 3/4 to full length hem and a headdress and veil of some kind are all of polyester and I imagine are very hot.

Vat II exhorted the religious orders to go back to their roots, to the documents of their foundresses. It turns out that many if not all of the orders dressed in the style of the poor women, especially widows. In the days that the orders were founded, many class distinctions were made on the basis of dress, unlike now. You could tell who was wealthy and who wasn’t by looking at them. Consecrated women working with the poor wanted to look like them, not like the wealthy. But gradually habits became unchanging and formulaic, and eventually did not resemble either the original dress of the poor of the past or the present either. Nowhere was this more apparent than in the horrible rig worn by the BVM’s of Dubuque Iowa, which started off as a sort of ruff under a bonnet, the costume of the time, and which morphed into a hideous huge box over a horseshoe around the face.

It is true that habits, especially pretty ones designed by a French designer such as the Nashville Dominicans, attract a lot of young girls. But many orders don’t want these young immature girls; they want the religious equivalent of a “few good men”–mature, intelligent, experienced, well-educated women who will make good religious and run the complex sort of ministries that their orders run nowadays.

You are comparing apples and oranges. In a large place like the Catholic church, there should be room for both.

 

[1234]

(I have a vocation, but it will be later on in life. I intend to die a Bride of Christ).

Blessings,
Cloisters

Gemma, the last I heard, you were MARRIED.

You’re your* husband’s *bride.

Don’t count on outliving him!

 

[Gardenman]

1234…there are just as many lay women as there are men who feel the habit is important.

I also find it interesting that students in Catholic schools are required to wear uniforms, yet the sisters teaching them can dress any way they want. Sort of a double standard isn’t it?

 

[LilyM]

1234…there are just as many lay women as there are men who feel the habit is important.

I also find it interesting that students in Catholic schools are required to wear uniforms, yet the sisters teaching them can dress any way they want. Sort of a double standard isn’t it?

Why? Lay teachers at those same Catholic schools can wear whatever they want. Mine sure did. Nuns are adults, not minors. Surely they can be pemitted to decide for themselves as communities whether they want to wear a habit or not

 

[BarbaraTherese]

We are all spiritually espoused to Christ through Baptism…
scborromeo.org/ccc/para/796.htm

796 The unity of Christ and the Church, head and members of one Body, also implies the distinction of the two within a personal relationship. This aspect is often expressed by the image of bridegroom and bride. The theme of Christ as Bridegroom of the Church was prepared for by the prophets and announced by John the Baptist. The Lord referred to himself as the “bridegroom.”

The Apostle speaks of the whole Church and of each of the faithful, members of his Body, as a bride “betrothed” to Christ the Lord so as to become but one spirit with him

. The Church is the spotless bride of the spotless Lamb. “Christ loved the Church and gave himself up for her, that he might sanctify her.” He has joined her with himself in an everlasting covenant and never stops caring for her as for his own body: This is the whole Christ, head and body, one formed from many . . . whether the head or members speak, it is Christ who speaks. He speaks in his role as the head (ex persona capitis) and in his role as body (ex persona corporis). What does this mean? “The two will become one flesh. This is a great mystery, and I am applying it to Christ and the Church.” And the Lord himself says in the Gospel: “So they are no longer two, but one flesh.” They are, in fact, two different persons, yet they are one in the conjugal union, . . . as head, he calls himself the bridegroom, as body, he calls himself “bride.”

~

 

[1234]

1234…there are just as many lay women as there are men who feel the habit is important.

I also find it interesting that students in Catholic schools are required to wear uniforms, yet the sisters teaching them can dress any way they want. Sort of a double standard isn’t it?

I personally never supported school uniforms. They may have a place in schools in crime-ridden slums, as a statement for external order. My children did not go to schools which required uniforms.

 

[1234]

Why? Lay teachers at those same Catholic schools can wear whatever they want. Mine sure did. Nuns are adults, not minors. Surely they can be pemitted to decide for themselves as communities whether they want to wear a habit or not

Absolutely.

Once again, lay people don’t determine what sisters will wear.

sisters’ communities, at the behest of the Vat II Council, revived their foundresses’ (often saints themselves) founding documents to discover what their original intentions were. They did *not *include dressing their members as separate from the community they served. That came later and ended up as an equivalent of the dinosaurs’ armor at an earlier time. Young girls, who grew up with air-conditioning and never saw sisters in their get-ups, have no idea what it was like wearing and maintaining one of those rigs. The most current documents, quoted earlier from JPII, require only a simple becoming dress with an identifiable sign–pin, cross, which most modern communities wear. True, many do look like bag ladies, as they don’t know how to dress cheaply and becomingly, as they were never taught. This too will pass. Many modern orders wear suits or blazers with skirts and the requisite pin.

 

[Sr_Sally]

Excellent post 1234. The orders I am familar with that have loosened their habit rules have done so to make things easier for the sisters in the work they do today. Also, it is much less expensive for the order for each woman to have a few outfits that she can get from target or a thrift store, then a couple of specially made habits that need special care or laundering. In fact, I have picked up items I’ve seen at thirft stores, etc for one active Fransiscan order whose members simply stick to the plainest brown clothing they can find.

I wear dresses freqently, not all the time, and most things can be done adequetly in a longish, full skirt, but certainly not all things. We also have much stricter hygenie rules today and much work like nursing would be very difficult to do properly in a traditional habit.

A contempletive order is in a different position, and so groups like Mother Anglica’s can certainly wear the older habits complete with wimple and veil, but you aren’t likey to see a contempletive nun at your local parish or school.

The habit worn by Mother Teresa’s order (the sari), is actually very simple and is based on what an ordinary woman wore in India at the time (and many still do). The sisters only have 2 habits and when you meet them as they work, their habits are often a bit grimy and frequently worn-out. Not as romantic as some people think. I do not sneer at them AT ALL for their choice, but I also don’t think that other order who engage in similar work are at all wong for choosing to wear ordinary street clothes.

 

[1234]

For those of you who have never seen McCarthy’s “Guide to Religious Orders of Women in the United States”, which used to cost hundreds of dollars on eBay, but was also available on CD, there is:

www.blessings-catalog.com, which sells dolls dressed up the habits of yore. Bessings tried to go out of business but is still going, I guess. Their dolls are expensive. Here are hundreds of dolls dressed in the old habits. The photos that the habits are based on are taken from McCarthy.

Check out:

blessings-catalog.com/specialorders/sp035.html

Grey Nuns of Montreal. I visited their huge motherhouse in Montreal several years ago and received a wonderful guide to the entire place by a former mother general. She said that nurse nuns had to change out of their get-up to go into the OR–there was no way that their habit could be clean enough to assist at surgery!

 

[bpbasilphx]

The garb of holy poverty is surprisingly expensive.

 

[Maryam33]

The garb of holy poverty is surprisingly expensive.

Most nuns either sew their habits themselves or there is a Sister within the convent who’s duty is to sew the habit. So it isn’t as pricey as you may think, especially considering that each Sister has two habits that are supposed to last quite a few years.

 

[ellammcg]

Not being a nun, sister, or even Catholic there is no way I would tell them what to wear but I do find an identifiable habit to be a wonderful witness to others. I first met Sisters in Plattsburgh, NY at the school they ran there. They were very impressive women-especially the principal and they all wore a full habit. The next Sister I met was in Boston. I was unaware of who she was until someone told me and I was very surprised because she was rather unpleasant and was also pro-abortion. I do wish women (and men) religious would wear some sort of habit whenever possible. I think they are a positive symbol of the church and they can be readily identified even by non-religious folks who may have questions about the Lord but were afraid to ask less-identifiable members of the faith.

 

[mercygate]

Not being a nun, sister, or even Catholic there is no way I would tell them what to wear but I do find an identifiable habit to be a wonderful witness to others. I first met Sisters in Plattsburgh, NY at the school they ran there. They were very impressive women-especially the principal and they all wore a full habit. The next Sister I met was in Boston. I was unaware of who she was until someone told me and I was very surprised because she was rather unpleasant and was also pro-abortion. I do wish women (and men) religious would wear some sort of habit whenever possible. I think they are a positive symbol of the church and they can be readily identified even by non-religious folks who may have questions about the Lord but were afraid to ask less-identifiable members of the faith.

LOL. You bring up an interesting point. Maybe it’s a good idea for those Sisters who are not faithful to the Magisterium to avoid the habit. They’ll do less damage if they cannot easily be identified.

That said, I find that those communities that still DO wear identifiable habits tend to be more orthodox than those that do not. This is not an infallible sign by any means but it DOES serve as a marker.

 

[bpbasilphx]

Most nuns either sew their habits themselves or there is a Sister within the convent who’s duty is to sew the habit. So it isn’t as pricey as you may think, especially considering that each Sister has two habits that are supposed to last quite a few years.

**When you cannot sew, as I cannot, a cassock, ryassa, mandyas, paramandyas, cinture, and klobuk get pricey.

Being a monk, I ought to know about how pricey it is.

And I’ve NEVER been in a community where anybody knew how to make the items.

conventofsaintelizabeth.org/apparel/monastic.html**

 

[Maryam33]

When you cannot sew, as I cannot, a cassock, ryassa, mandyas, paramandyas, cinture, and klobuk get pricey.

Being a monk, I ought to know about how pricey it is.

And I’ve NEVER been in a community where anybody knew how to make the items.

conventofsaintelizabeth.org/apparel/monastic.html

I apologize if I sounded pretty general. I was referring to most communities made up of religious women. For example, I know that the Dominican Sisters of Mary, the Nashville Dominicans, the Poor Clares of Perpetual Adoration in Hanceville, the Benedictines of Mary, Queen of Apostles, all sew their own habits or a few Sisters at the convent have the duty of sewing the religious habit. I’m sure that many Communities of religious Sisterse and Nuns that aren’t on my list also sew their own habits as well.

I’m not sure where a monk gets the habit from so that is why I didn’t mention it. I apologize again for the confusion

 

[Gardenman]

My mother used to sew habits for the sister’s of our parish, along with two older sister’s who had retired from teaching.
They were patched, shortened, lengthened, etc. as needed to defray the cost of new ones…recycling at it’s best !

It took many hours to sew a habit and the veils especially were very time consuming due to a lot of starched linen etc.

Many of the older sisters continued with the old habit after Vatican II, but eventually succomed to pressure from their peers to wear street clothes.

The change was difficult for many older sisters and some still wear a facsimile of a habit, with a short veil…but at least they LOOK like sisters !