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pnewton
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I like that fire pit for outdoor use. The smaller one is better for a quick disappearing act after the candle is lit.
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Phemie
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I like that but it’s a bit on the low side, that’s why we use a round charcoal grill.
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tad
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We used to light the Easter candle from a tiny kerosene lamp. I held the sacramentary while my sponsor was in charge of the flashlight. 
It was all very sweet and intimate. Then as others have already beautifully described we would process through a darkened church illuminating the space one candle at a time.
That’s gone now. Maybe it’s allowed, maybe it’s not. Time will tell.
It was all very sweet and intimate. Then as others have already beautifully described we would process through a darkened church illuminating the space one candle at a time.That’s gone now. Maybe it’s allowed, maybe it’s not. Time will tell.
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tad
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No, for the sake of time my pastor would skip a number of the OT readings. Never Romans though.
I remember watching the Vigil from the Basilica of the Immaculate Conception in D.C. one year. The lector who read Romans never looked down at the page. Talk about proclaiming the Word! It left a real impression on me which why I think I was so disappointed when it was omitted at my own parish.
Once we didn’t light the fire at the beginning, all the little stuff seemed to compound themselves.
I remember watching the Vigil from the Basilica of the Immaculate Conception in D.C. one year. The lector who read Romans never looked down at the page. Talk about proclaiming the Word! It left a real impression on me which why I think I was so disappointed when it was omitted at my own parish.
Once we didn’t light the fire at the beginning, all the little stuff seemed to compound themselves.
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rondirect
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If there is any take away from all or this, we must all agree that every parish and every parish pastor and its people are different and some will try to cut corners and some will not. Many parishioners are happy with the shortcuts, some are not. My new pianist comes from a rural PA church where there was one priest for a few churches. Her large pipe organ church offered but one Mass per weekend for about 150-200 people! The priest had to say Mass and move on to the next one, so shortcuts for “pastoral” reasons were done.
I don’t know about your missal, but mine says that the rites of the new fire up to the procession may be omitted; not all 7 OT readings have to be proclaimed, etc.
We, too, cut a few things out because we always have a huge RCIA group being baptized and confirmed…in my eyes, the most important part of the Vigil Mass. If it were any longer, hardly anyone would attend. Many Catholics today just don’t see the beauty and rich ritual of it all. It’s all about timing…one hour and get me out of here!
I don’t know about your missal, but mine says that the rites of the new fire up to the procession may be omitted; not all 7 OT readings have to be proclaimed, etc.
We, too, cut a few things out because we always have a huge RCIA group being baptized and confirmed…in my eyes, the most important part of the Vigil Mass. If it were any longer, hardly anyone would attend. Many Catholics today just don’t see the beauty and rich ritual of it all. It’s all about timing…one hour and get me out of here!
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Gertabelle
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Rubbish.
Easter Vigil is not attended by those who just want to get their obligation over with and get on with their plans. Those people show up at 5:00 expecting the usual Saturday night mass and find out there isn’t one. They either return Sunday morning, or they don’t return at all.
And at most of the parishes in this area where I’ve attended Easter Vigil, the church is packed, and the mass lasts about 2.5 - 3 hours! One parish even started their Easter Vigil at 3:00 am for years. Again, it was packed – 3:00 o’clock in the morning, a three-hour long mass, and it was standing room only.
Yeah, the baptisms are beautiful and both an encouragement and a challenge to us cradle Catholics, but they take place in the context of the Easter Vigil, not a typical Sunday mass. We shouldn’t truncate the Easter Vigil to such an extent that it might as well be any other mass.
“The beauty and rich ritual of it” can’t be appreciated if we remove the beauty and rich ritual for the sake of time.
Just my two cents’ worth.
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Phemie
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We have a parish of ~1500 and, sadly, our church will be at most 1/3 full for the Vigil. Older parishioners (70s +), unless they have a role to play in the Liturgy, find it too late (for the record they don’t attend the late Mass at Christmas either) and the young people haven’t grown up attending the Vigil so it doesn’t tug at their heartstings like Midnight Mass does at Christmas.
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tad
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After serving the Mass of the Lord’s Supper last night I think I know where my distress is coming from regarding the Vigil. Like the Vigil we didn’t hear the readings but instead performed a reworking of the Gospels. My family and I watched the Mass of the Lord’s Supper on EWTN afterwards. I really prefer just hearing the Word proclaimed.
I understand what our visiting priest is doing. He’s trying to bring the services of Holy Week home to the faithful. When he was an active pastor of his own parish, this is the way he did things there. I don’t really care for it, but I’m glad I’m hanging in there for one more year. It was good to see everyone last night and I know they were happy to see me.
I did have a few minutes to do a little research on alternative liturgies for the Vigil. The first and only site I had time to find was an ‘ecumenical’ website run by an Anglican priest. According to him, you can do the Ministry of the Word before the Service of Light, but I’ve yet to find a Catholic source which says the same. If I get some time, maybe I’ll pick up a missal.
Thanks again for everyone who has put up with me. I feel a lot better now. After mass last night I’ve mellowed out quite a bit. I’ll still skip the Vigil this year, but at least I have a better perspective as to where this priest is coming from.
Have a blessed rest of Holy Week everyone.
I understand what our visiting priest is doing. He’s trying to bring the services of Holy Week home to the faithful. When he was an active pastor of his own parish, this is the way he did things there. I don’t really care for it, but I’m glad I’m hanging in there for one more year. It was good to see everyone last night and I know they were happy to see me.
I did have a few minutes to do a little research on alternative liturgies for the Vigil. The first and only site I had time to find was an ‘ecumenical’ website run by an Anglican priest. According to him, you can do the Ministry of the Word before the Service of Light, but I’ve yet to find a Catholic source which says the same. If I get some time, maybe I’ll pick up a missal.
Thanks again for everyone who has put up with me. I feel a lot better now. After mass last night I’ve mellowed out quite a bit. I’ll still skip the Vigil this year, but at least I have a better perspective as to where this priest is coming from.
Have a blessed rest of Holy Week everyone.
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rondirect
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Gertabelle, to call someone’s opinion “rubbish,” is why people I know to either not bother to contribute to or ask questions on sites like this for fear of being called out. Your outspoken comment saddens me. And, actually, it is not an opinion, it’s a fact where I live. Mention Vigil, and you hear, “nope, see you Sunday!”
Look at what Phemie wrote as well.
Of all the Easter Masses we offer, the Vigil is the least attended because of the length; maybe 500 people. The other 7 Easter Masses are so over packed with over 1000 each, that we offer an overflow Mass in the Parish Center 2 times to accommodate even more people.
The fact that you love it and actually so do I, is not what many others feel anymore. But, I should not speak for all parts of the country and neither can you. I am aware that some areas have Catholic churches on every street corner, but not here. I can go on with this, but I think you get my point. Happy Easter!
Look at what Phemie wrote as well.
Of all the Easter Masses we offer, the Vigil is the least attended because of the length; maybe 500 people. The other 7 Easter Masses are so over packed with over 1000 each, that we offer an overflow Mass in the Parish Center 2 times to accommodate even more people.
The fact that you love it and actually so do I, is not what many others feel anymore. But, I should not speak for all parts of the country and neither can you. I am aware that some areas have Catholic churches on every street corner, but not here. I can go on with this, but I think you get my point. Happy Easter!
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jtavington
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Yeah. I love the beauty and pageantry of the Vigil but I am not looking forward to being up that late.
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Phemie
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Well, I attended the Vigil in my parish. We started at 9, finished by 11. We had 4 readings from the OT, the 1st, 3rd, 5th, and 7th. No Baptism or reception into full communion.
I carried one of the candles during the recessional and counted the attendance: In 20 years we’ve gone from having to put out extra seats for the Vigil to a congregation of ~30 tonight. When you consider that we had 5 readers, 1 thurifer, 2 altar servers, and 4 choir members, you can see that, sadly, not too many people who didn’t have to be there bothered to attend.
I carried one of the candles during the recessional and counted the attendance: In 20 years we’ve gone from having to put out extra seats for the Vigil to a congregation of ~30 tonight. When you consider that we had 5 readers, 1 thurifer, 2 altar servers, and 4 choir members, you can see that, sadly, not too many people who didn’t have to be there bothered to attend.
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paperwight
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There’s another factor. Many people live alone as they get older. They really don’t like coming out at night and then going back to an empty house. It can be quite frightening.
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Pup7
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The priest sang a lot of the prayers (I liked that), the deacon sang the opening, we had ten people baptized and five of us confirmed, chapel was packed, all done in 2.5 hours.
We’re not a huge cathedral, though, so I’m sure that made a difference. I was still surprised at how quickly it went. I tried very hard to stay in the moment, knowing how you regret not smelling the flowers, and still - it just slipped by.
We’re not a huge cathedral, though, so I’m sure that made a difference. I was still surprised at how quickly it went. I tried very hard to stay in the moment, knowing how you regret not smelling the flowers, and still - it just slipped by.
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Isca
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tad, Mass feels different all over the world, because it’s a world-wide church and the world is diverse. The Easter Vigil will also be different, even within the same country.
I’ve been to Mass in various European countries and it doesn’t feel like it does back in my home parish in England. I regularly attend Mass in Italy when we’re out there - again, it feel quite strange, people behave differently, the priest speaks to the people in a more authoritarian tone. A lot of it’s cultural and as an outsider, you feel a bit disconnected, in my experience. It doesn’t mean there’s some terrible liturgical abuse going on, though.
I’ve been to Mass in various European countries and it doesn’t feel like it does back in my home parish in England. I regularly attend Mass in Italy when we’re out there - again, it feel quite strange, people behave differently, the priest speaks to the people in a more authoritarian tone. A lot of it’s cultural and as an outsider, you feel a bit disconnected, in my experience. It doesn’t mean there’s some terrible liturgical abuse going on, though.
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Gertabelle
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I find that really, really sad. But I have been in a parish like this in the past, so I understand.
It seems that the parishes that have had the highest attendance in this area are the ones in which families “spread the word” about the Easter Vigil. There seems to be a culture that is created in parishes when enough people tell their friends, who tell their friends, who tell their friends, and so on.
Our parish with a very large church was packed to the gills last night. There were about 30 of us just in the choir!
We only had one baptism last night, so the people who were there were there for the Easter Vigil, not for the people entering the Church.
This parish, like one or two others in the area, has created that culture of families who have attended the Vigil for years and years and wouldn’t dream of missing it. And they’re spreading the word.
It can be discouraging when so few people attend this most solemn of all masses, but remember, there were only a few women at the tomb on the morning of the first Easter.
God’s richest Easter blessings to everyone here!
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Reuben_J
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We can consider that there are praishes that are thriving and alive with faith, and there are parishes that are old (literally consist of majority of old people) and perhaps very passive.
Easter is the greatest event in Christendom and every Catholic should flock to Easter vigil and Easter Sunday. It should not be just because of the obligation but the excitement to celebrate the resurrection of our Lord, the central mssage of our belief.
The cathedral where I serve and attend mass is always packed and overflowed during the Easter Triduum. It is like a boast to tell here, but nevertheless that’s what happen.
During Easter vigil mass, there were so many people that we had to open the adjacent parishioner hall which could take another one thousand five hundred people. On top of that the foyers of both the cathedral and the parish hall were full of chairs as parishioners clamored to get their seats.
The logistic was a nightmare but we have enough ushers, altar boys and EMHC to serve the big crowd. There were more than eighty candidates for Baptism and a few more being recieved into the Church.
The celebration of the light, the readings, the Baptism (with blessing of holy water) and the Liturgy of the Eucharist took sligthly more than three hours, which we ended after ten thirty pm.
It is a big event and people just came, year after year, despite the length of the vigil, which they knew before hand.
Thanks God that His Church is alive here and pray that it will continue to be so.
Easter is the greatest event in Christendom and every Catholic should flock to Easter vigil and Easter Sunday. It should not be just because of the obligation but the excitement to celebrate the resurrection of our Lord, the central mssage of our belief.
The cathedral where I serve and attend mass is always packed and overflowed during the Easter Triduum. It is like a boast to tell here, but nevertheless that’s what happen.
During Easter vigil mass, there were so many people that we had to open the adjacent parishioner hall which could take another one thousand five hundred people. On top of that the foyers of both the cathedral and the parish hall were full of chairs as parishioners clamored to get their seats.
The logistic was a nightmare but we have enough ushers, altar boys and EMHC to serve the big crowd. There were more than eighty candidates for Baptism and a few more being recieved into the Church.
The celebration of the light, the readings, the Baptism (with blessing of holy water) and the Liturgy of the Eucharist took sligthly more than three hours, which we ended after ten thirty pm.
It is a big event and people just came, year after year, despite the length of the vigil, which they knew before hand.
Thanks God that His Church is alive here and pray that it will continue to be so.
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rondirect
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Gertabelle, Happy Easter to you as well.
Kind of confused here with your response to Phemie, who seems to be on the same page with my responses on this topic. When I mentioned that the length of the Vigil was too long for many to attend, and even added that people missing out are witnessing the beauty and ritual of our Catholic Church, your immediate response was to call my comment, “rubbish,” and that churches in your area are always packed no matter what time they are.
Your answer to Phemie is quite different in that you attended church where attendance must had been poor, and you “understand,” so not rubbish. Please explain. I want to know what I said was offensive to you vs. what Phemie has basically witnessed as well.
Gertabelle, it is wonderful that the churches in your area see the richness of the Vigil and I think I made that clear that I agreed. However, spread the word about the vigil here and you get the opposite result. We had at least 30 or so in our choir as well; however, ever year the numbers, like Phemie, are getting lower in the assembly. We had 8 baptisms and about 15 being confirmed. That alone took a half hour or so.
At first, I said that only about 500 attend; this year maybe 300 in a church that seats 1000. Most where there for those receiving the Sacraments. Some even left after these two rites where finished! As a matter of fact, I was told my someone who overheard people leaving the church, that they will never attend a Vigil again and that it was not a joyous Easter Celebration. What more can I say?
Kind of confused here with your response to Phemie, who seems to be on the same page with my responses on this topic. When I mentioned that the length of the Vigil was too long for many to attend, and even added that people missing out are witnessing the beauty and ritual of our Catholic Church, your immediate response was to call my comment, “rubbish,” and that churches in your area are always packed no matter what time they are.
Your answer to Phemie is quite different in that you attended church where attendance must had been poor, and you “understand,” so not rubbish. Please explain. I want to know what I said was offensive to you vs. what Phemie has basically witnessed as well.
Gertabelle, it is wonderful that the churches in your area see the richness of the Vigil and I think I made that clear that I agreed. However, spread the word about the vigil here and you get the opposite result. We had at least 30 or so in our choir as well; however, ever year the numbers, like Phemie, are getting lower in the assembly. We had 8 baptisms and about 15 being confirmed. That alone took a half hour or so.
At first, I said that only about 500 attend; this year maybe 300 in a church that seats 1000. Most where there for those receiving the Sacraments. Some even left after these two rites where finished! As a matter of fact, I was told my someone who overheard people leaving the church, that they will never attend a Vigil again and that it was not a joyous Easter Celebration. What more can I say?
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tad
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As predicted I skipped the Easter Vigil. My mother and I stopped by the parish to drop off some flowers Saturday morning. My former partner from St. Vincent de Paul was there as well as a bunch of people I hadn’t seen for a while. We walked over to the education hall and looked at photos on the StVdeP bulletin of members past and present, living and deceased. It was good to remember everyone.
My sponsor was surprised that I wasn’t attending. He wanted to know when he should fill the holy water fonts. I felt awkward about telling him I wouldn’t be there. I used to be an installation at this mass.
I found a script from the Vigil in the vesting sacristy after Easter mass yesterday. It was a repeat from the last four years, so I’m glad I skipped it. After the Holy Thursday and Good Friday services, I’ve realized it’s just not my thing.
I was in a bit of a funk at sunset Saturday, so I went for a walk at a nearby park. On my return I ran into a group of people having their own ceremony of light. They had laid out a labyrinth of Christmas lights in the grass and were walking prayerfully through it while others played some drums. I hung out there for a while praying for the Church and the people of my parish who were doing a similar but very different ceremony not that far away.
It’s really a shame that I can’t get my heart into it. It’s not really like me. I love the liturgy and the Easter Vigil is my favorite night. I should be at my home parish on that night, but in the past it’s been more distressing than edifying.
We’ll see what the future brings. My pastor celebrated his 31st and last Easter with us yesterday. Because Easter is late next year we’re going to break tradition and travel to Montana to be with my mom. What I do for Holy Week is going to be a non-issue for a couple of years.
Thanks again for your help and especially for your prayers everyone, and have a blessed Easter season.
My sponsor was surprised that I wasn’t attending. He wanted to know when he should fill the holy water fonts. I felt awkward about telling him I wouldn’t be there. I used to be an installation at this mass.
I found a script from the Vigil in the vesting sacristy after Easter mass yesterday. It was a repeat from the last four years, so I’m glad I skipped it. After the Holy Thursday and Good Friday services, I’ve realized it’s just not my thing.
I was in a bit of a funk at sunset Saturday, so I went for a walk at a nearby park. On my return I ran into a group of people having their own ceremony of light. They had laid out a labyrinth of Christmas lights in the grass and were walking prayerfully through it while others played some drums. I hung out there for a while praying for the Church and the people of my parish who were doing a similar but very different ceremony not that far away.
It’s really a shame that I can’t get my heart into it. It’s not really like me. I love the liturgy and the Easter Vigil is my favorite night. I should be at my home parish on that night, but in the past it’s been more distressing than edifying.
We’ll see what the future brings. My pastor celebrated his 31st and last Easter with us yesterday. Because Easter is late next year we’re going to break tradition and travel to Montana to be with my mom. What I do for Holy Week is going to be a non-issue for a couple of years.
Thanks again for your help and especially for your prayers everyone, and have a blessed Easter season.
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tad
Guest
Thanks for your reply. My wife and I look forward to visiting different churches during our travels. I’ve always been impressed with how similar the liturgies were. Even though I don’t speak much French, I could hang with the liturgies when we were in France. The same way with the Spanish or mariachi masses we have around here.
I think I have two different problems here. One is a matter of style. I just don’t care for the type of liturgies th visiting priest is presenting. I understand where he’s coming from, but I’m simply not into it even thought I’ve done my best to try. The other problem I have is that I had it so good for my first 10 years as Catholic serving with my pastor. Those were special times. I’m going to remember them fondly.
I think I have two different problems here. One is a matter of style. I just don’t care for the type of liturgies th visiting priest is presenting. I understand where he’s coming from, but I’m simply not into it even thought I’ve done my best to try. The other problem I have is that I had it so good for my first 10 years as Catholic serving with my pastor. Those were special times. I’m going to remember them fondly.
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Spyridon
Guest
I’ve been following this thread all along and I’m still confused as to exactly what it is that is occuring at your parish.
Are the prescribed readings being totally changed?
Are the prescribed readings being totally changed?
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