The Eighth Deadly Sin?

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**THE EIGHTH DEADLY SIN? **
I know that there are a lot of people who will take offense at this, but I believe the Eighth Deadly Sin is engaging in the pleasures of this lowly world. Anybody who reads the New Testament should notice all the clues that Christ would have considered it a Deadly Sin. Consider all the pain, suffering, and sin in this world. For anyone looking to mortify their attraction to taking pleasure in the pleasures of this lowly world, I suggest reading The Imitation of Christ and watching The Way of the Cross, by St Francis of Assisi. youtube.com/watch?v=oZ9om4YElns

I already know that the Church does not consider engaging in worldly to be a sin, but at the very least, I feel that God does not want me to engage in worldly pleasures and that the above two sources seem to strongly suggest that we all should avoid them as much as possible.

“Love not the world, nor the things which are in the world. If any man loves the world, the charity of the Father is not in him.”
-1 John 2:15

OTHER THINGS I FEEL GOD WANTS FROM ME1. I must not seek consolation in anyone except God.
2. I must mortify my old self so that a new self may be born.
3… I must feel a true contrition for my sins. The sins of my youth are always before me.
4… I must continue in my solitude.
5… I must willfully carry my cross in all suffering and hardships
6. I must remain most humble.
7. I must pray that I may do my Purgatory here in this world.
 
I truly feel that actually experiencing the gifts of the Holy Spirit or experiencing the deeper meaning of a passage of scripture or prayer results in a much higher-ordered pleasure and meaningful experience than the lower-ordered worldly pleasures a person seems to always pursue their entire life! Whether such experiences are gained through Centering Prayer, regular Contemplative Prayer or some other means seems so trivial to me!
 
Pleasure is objectively good. God wants us to experience pleasure. As a matter of fact, even the pleasure we obtain through sin is a good. In the case of sin, the means by which we obtain such pleasure is evil, but the pleasure itself is always good.

Athough worldly pleasure is certainly not the greatest good, it is a good all the same. To say that it is a deadly sin, which would also make it a mortal sin, makes no sense to me. Pleasure is a gift from God! Why would he ever give us a “gift” that would lead us astray from him?

Just my :twocents:

God bless.
 
I take great pleasure in completing jigsaw puzzles. They are certainly “of this world”.
I’m not sinning.
Everyone needs leisure.
 
Then why the wedding at Cana, or even the last supper meal.

I always felt the new testament did Jesus an injustice by only concentrating on the serious things, there should have been some 'simple pleasure ’ stories inluded as well. It would seem the only pleasant things ever done involved eating!
 
Crusaderbear said:
Then why the wedding at Cana, or even the last supper meal.

I always felt the new testament did Jesus an injustice by only concentrating on the serious things, there should have been some 'simple pleasure ’ stories inluded as well. It would seem the only pleasant things ever done involved eating!
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And THAT, my friend is very purposeful. Remember when Jesus cured the girl and then said “get me something to eat”?
All things related to family life and the Eucharist center around communing together at table.
There’s no accident that the meal is central to life, morality, and Christian thought.
 
Crusaderbear said:
Then why the wedding at Cana, or even the last supper meal.

I always felt the new testament did Jesus an injustice by only concentrating on the serious things, there should have been some 'simple pleasure ’ stories inluded as well. It would seem the only pleasant things ever done involved eating!
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👍
 
Genesis tells us:

“31God saw all that He had made, and behold, it was very good.” (Genesis Chapter 1)

All that God has made is good for God Himself tells us this - and The Church tells us that the particular apostolate of the laity is in fact the temporal order:
Apostolicam Actuositatem (Decree on The Apostolate of The Laity) vatican.va/archive/hist_councils/ii_vatican_council/documents/vat-ii_decree_19651118_apostolicam-actuositatem_en.html
"In the Church there is a diversity of ministry but a oneness of mission. Christ conferred on the Apostles and their successors the duty of teaching, sanctifying, and ruling in His name and power. But the laity likewise share in the priestly, prophetic, and royal office of Christ and therefore have their own share in the mission of the whole people of God in the Church and in the world.(2)
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They (Laity) exercise the apostolate in fact by their activity directed to the evangelization and sanctification of men and to the penetrating and perfecting of the temporal order through the spirit of the Gospel. In this way, their temporal activity openly bears witness to Christ and promotes the salvation of men. Since the laity, in accordance with their state of life, live in the midst of the world and its concerns, they are called by God to exercise their apostolate in the world like leaven, with the ardor of the spirit of Christ.
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Pope Benedict told us that all we have to fear is sin and recently Pope Francis said the same. In fact, Pope Benedict made the fact even clearer that all we have to fear our own sin by members of The Church…“The only evil that the Church must fear is that sin of Her members.” speroforum.com/a/NKXNYZASBW2/65166-Pope-Benedict-We-need-fear-only-our-own-sins#.WVhMb9gUlLM

Original sin has defaced what God has made and creation has ‘lost its way and its true direction’ and we can continue to do so affecting God’s beloved creation too through our own sinfulness and sins. Our particular apostolate and mission as lay people is to be leaven in the temporal order and to strive to redirect it through our own efforts with God’s Grace back towards it’s true direction in God and in praise and thankfulness to Him. St Paul makes this very clear: "22 We know that the whole creation has been groaning as in the pains of childbirth right up to the present time. 23** Not only so, but we ourselves, who have the firstfruits of the Spirit, groan inwardly** as we wait eagerly for our adoption to sonship, the redemption of our bodies. 24 For in this hope we were saved. But hope that is seen is no hope at all. Who hopes for what they already have? " (Romans Ch8)

Therefore if I abandon and reject the temporal order, I am in fact abandoning and rejecting my God given vocation and call and my apostolate and mission as a lay person. Be that as it may, sometimes God can and does call and vocate a lay person to follow another direction (ideally with a spiritual director only); however if in doing so, that person regards the temporal order as intrinsically evil and to be despised and rejected, they have rather lost their way.

We are stewards of God’s creation (“fill the earth and subdue it” Genesis Chapter 1) and The Church today is rightly most concerned about the environment and environmental matters because God has instructed us to do so. The Church also realises and embraces that the environment is only one aspect of the temporal order.
 
pianistclare said:
Same construct.
Food figures greatly in Scripture.
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👍 Well said

Hospitality (this Sundays Readings) was very important indeed to the people of The Old Testament and a great virtue - and so that continues up to today as being very important in our own Gospel way of life and in the footsteps of Jesus. I love the way Jesus after His Resurrection cooks fish for His apostles. They come into shore from fishing and I imagine in the early morning - and there is Jesus with a campfire cooking some breakfast. for them all It is such a lovely very ordinary homey type of scene in John Chapter 21:
When the disciples got out of the boat, they saw some bread and a charcoal fire with fish on it. 10 Jesus told his disciples, “Bring some of the fish you just caught.” 11 Simon Peter got back into the boat and dragged the net to shore. In it were one hundred fifty-three large fish, but still the net did not rip.
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12 Jesus said, “Come and eat!” But none of the disciples dared ask who he was. They knew he was the Lord. 13 Jesus took the bread in his hands and gave some of it to his disciples. He did the same with the fish. 14 This was the third time that Jesus appeared to his disciples after he was raised from death.
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I am in Australia and at Vigil Mass last night, we had what was really a little exercise in hospitable contemplative action - and as a part of Father’s homily. Father asked us to introduce ourselves to someone nearby and ask them what they wanted to pray about at Mass. After that little disturbance in The Church, Father asked as to sit quietly for a few minutes and pray for their intentions. Almost at the drop of the hat, a little Church in almost uproar, suddenly became absolutely silent, still and quiet.

It reminds me of monastic recreation in a monastery. Recreation can be a time of much laughter, joy and almost total uproar. Recreation ends and prayerful monastic silence, stillness and quiet descends and embraces all.
 
I really would like to add that St Peter is a real favourite of mine. In my reflective imagination he is always so eager to please Jesus - and seems to rush off at times in order to be the first to do so. But most every time Peter opens his mouth, he has his foot in it with some truly notable exceptions. He seems in my imagination to be rather like I was as a child at times … i.e. my hand would shoot up into the air if Sister asked a question of the class and there would be me with a “Me, Me, Me please!” type of attitude so eager to be the very first to answer and please Sister…but rather often my answer had my foot in my mouth.
Sister never called me Satan - but an Archbishop to be (Examiner of Schools at the time) did call me a heretic - talk about planting my foot well and truly in my mouth! :frighten:

OFF TOPIC!
 
Eight deadly sins? Evagrius of Pontus already thought of this back in the fourth century. His list of eight deadly sins became distilled into the seven deadly sins we know today. Here are his:
  1. Gluttony
  2. Fornication
  3. Love of money
  4. Sadness
  5. Anger
  6. Listlessness
  7. Vainglory
  8. Pride
He seems to have listed his from least to most serious, whereas we now put pride at the top.

I think Robert is perhaps born in the wrong century. It sounds like he would have found many kindred spirits back in the days of the Desert Fathers. They also ran from the world because of what they saw as too much hedonism. But even then, their feats of asceticism could easily go overboard, which could then backfire and lead to the sin of pride: pride in having so thoroughly renounced all physical pleasure!

This is where I think St. Benedict and his Holy Rule are so helpful, in that he emphasizes balance and moderation. Even the great St. Anthony of the Desert knew that his monks could not renounce legitimate pleasure all of the time, or they would break like the bow that is stretched over and over.
 
I would consider it the first sin, because with pleasure often comes pain and evil that are more intense, false optimism whether religious or not often brings more suffering.
 
Once one experiences spiritual joy - the joys or pleasures of the world are highlighted as lacking. It is that restlessness that St Augustine spoke about “our hearts are restless, Lord, until they rest in Thee”

However this world and all creation, the temporal sphere, is created by God and is therefore a good. The goods in this temporal world are a very pale reflection indeed of the joys of the spiritual world. Remember too that God has created us as body and soul as a unity, a partnership called to function as a partnership in unity. In this world there is no body without a soul, nor soul without a body. I

If I despise and reject this world - disdain it, I am missing the mark (a meaning of sin is “to miss the mark”). In the act of creation in Genesis and before The Fall and the original sin, God Himself saw that all He had made was good. Original sin distorted all of God’s creation, including us, in some way. Our task today is to strive to return the whole of creation back to it’s true purpose in praise and thankfulness to God by embracingThe Gospel and in footsteps of Jesus.

Some are called to ‘abandon’ this world to invest fully in the spiritual as it were. But our deepest contemplative religious and hermits pray ardently for the world from the heart appreciating it as God’s beloved creation…if they don’t, then they too have “missed the mark”. Contemplatives and hermits too are body and soul and it is absolutely impossible to not have some personal investment in the temporal order.
 
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