The Eucharist is NOT the body of Christ

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VociMike said:
Wrong. Think about it a little more. Christ is really and truly present in the Sacrifice of the Mass, and he is not re-sacrificed. Put the pieces together.
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You said the magic word: Sacrifice. That says it all right there.
 
ajk19 said:
That scripture alone proves that the food and drink Christ spoke of was not meant to mean his body and blood, but rather HIS WORD. It is HIS WORD that gives us life and sustains us, not a little bread wafer and wine.
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And what does the Bible say the Word of God is?
John 1
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In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
He was in the beginning with God.
All things came to be through him, and without him nothing came to be. What came to be
through him was life, and this life was the light of the human race; …

And the Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us, and we saw his glory, the glory as of the Father’s only Son, full of grace and truth.
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The Word is Jesus Christ himself.
Quote ajk19:
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And speaking about that, if Christ’s sacrifice was sufficent for all the first time, then why do you feel the need to re-sacrifice him every time you hold Mass? Did Jesus not say on the cross that it was finished?
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Before you go saying what you think we believe you really should spend some time finding out what it is that we really do believe and what we really do. We do NOT re-sacrifice Christ in every Mass. We participate in his once and for all sacrifice. The Catechism is a good place to learn what it is that we actually do believe.
Not in the context that you speak of no. His flesh profited us once, when he died on the cross for all, that’s it. No more needed to be done after that.
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Correction, no more needed to be done on Jesus’ part. It’s now up to us on whether we agree to follow him or not.
No thanks, I’ve sailed that ship already. I’m perfectly satisfied with the choice I have made, and I plan to stick to it.
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So in other words what you saying is “don’t confuse me with the facts.”😃 If you are going to participate in a discussion you should be willing to learn and be corrected when you are mistaken.
 
ajk19 said:
We all know about the last supper, and it may be true that the Bible says…

“I am the living bread that came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever. This bread is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.” John 6: 51

“For My flesh is true food, and My blood is true drink” John 6:55

However, this is not meant literally, and here is why:

“It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.” John 6: 63

That scripture alone proves that the food and drink Christ spoke of was not meant to mean his body and blood, but rather HIS WORD. It is HIS WORD that gives us life and sustains us, not a little bread wafer and wine.
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Tell that nonsensical interpretation to 1st century Christians and see how far you get! :rolleyes:
 
mommyof4 said:
Hey, all I’m suggesting is that before you come in here and start attacking us and telling us how “wrong” our beliefs are, you need to educate yourself, first. I’m not saying you need to convert, I’m just suggesting that you take some time to EDUCATE YOURSELF before posting.
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Again I think I know what the Church teaches (or claims to teach), having been a Catholic 6 years just about before leaving it.
 
ajk19 said:
And speaking about that, if Christ’s sacrifice was sufficent …
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You just switched the topic once you were asked a direct question about Christ’s body (flesh) offered in sacrifice.

I think you need to reflect on your initial criticism and realize that it does not hold up. You’re offering personal (sola scriptura) interpretations of teachings that have been preserved in the Catholic Church since the apostolic age. I hope you will see that you’re willing to entirely dismiss your own theory in a brief exchange, and that you are not the best interpretor of these passages on the Eucharist.

I don’t mean that as a personal comment, but just as the reality of the human condition. We can’t just take a Bible passage and give it a personal interpretation that conflicts with what Christ taught through His apostles (as found in the early church communities).
 
ajk19 said:
Put it this way, eating a wafer and drinking some wine is not going to save us, and will do us no good in the end, thereby not profiting us anything God’s Word is sufficient nourishment, “food” if you will, and can and does profit us.
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“Truly, truly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of man and drink his blood, you have no life in you;
he who eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day.”

You’re denying the very words of Christ.
 
Sabda said:
And what does the Bible say the Word of God is?
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What do you mean?
We do NOT re-sacrifice Christ in every Mass. We participate in his once and for all sacrifice.
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See again you are proving my point. If Christ’s sacrifice was indeed once and for all, then why is a “sacrifice” of the mass needed? It’s not.
Correction, no more needed to be done on Jesus’ part. It’s now up to us on whether we agree to follow him or not.
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This I actually agree with.
So in other words what you saying is “don’t confuse me with the facts.”😃 If you are going to participate in a discussion you should be willing to learn and be corrected when you are mistaken.
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That would be true if there were any facts for find out (of which I don’t think there are).
 
ajk19 said:
Put it this way, eating a wafer and drinking some wine is not going to save us, and will do us no good in the end, thereby not profiting us anything God’s Word is sufficient nourishment, “food” if you will, and can and does profit us.
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So you’re saying that Christ’s flesh - His Sacrifice on the Cross, profitted nothing. All we need is the “Word” (by which of course you mean the Bible).

This is a manifest heresy.
 
VociMike said:
“Truly, truly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of man and drink his blood, you have no life in you;
he who eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day.”

You’re denying the very words of Christ.
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No I am not, again God’s Word (the Bible) is life, the living water if you will, this is made clear in scripture.
 
ajk19 said:
Again I think I know what the Church teaches (or claims to teach), having been a Catholic 6 years just about before leaving it.
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Howdy ajk,

Your level and type of schooling, your age, and your desire to learn could all have an impact on how much you actually know, and/or how accurate your knowledge is. Wouldn’t you agree?

VC
 
ajk19 said:
We all know about the last supper, and it may be true that the Bible says…

“I am the living bread that came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever. This bread is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.” John 6: 51

“For My flesh is true food, and My blood is true drink” John 6:55

However, this is not meant literally, and here is why:

“It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.” John 6: 63

That scripture alone proves that the food and drink Christ spoke of was not meant to mean his body and blood, but rather HIS WORD. It is HIS WORD that gives us life and sustains us, not a little bread wafer and wine.
Click to expand...
Since when does ‘spirit and truth’ mean that it is not literal? So with that logic the Holy Spirit since He is spirit is not true, He is just an analogy mentioned in scripture. There isn’t actually a Holy Spirit. Your logic is false.
 
ajk19 said:
Again I think I know what the Church teaches (or claims to teach), having been a Catholic 6 years just about before leaving it.
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Obviously, you did not study our catechism very well, or else you’d know that what you are claiming is utter nonsense.
 
That scripture alone proves that the food and drink Christ spoke of was not meant to mean his body and blood, but rather HIS WORD. It is HIS WORD that gives us life and sustains us, not a little bread wafer and wine.
Click to expand...
“I am the living bread that came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever. This bread is my WORD, which I will give for the life of the world.” John 6: 51

“For My WORD is true food, and My WORD is true drink” John 6:55

“It is the spirit that quickeneth; the WORD profiteth nothing: the WORDS that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.” John 6: 63 :confused:

I’m sorry, but that makes no sense to me.

Peace,

Ryan 🙂
 
mommyof4 said:
Obviously, you did not study our catechism very well, or else you’d know that what you are claiming is utter nonsense.
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I don’t think so, as I have said I feel like I am in the right here, and nothing that anyone says is going to change my mind.
 
John 6:56
For my flesh is meat indeed: and my blood is drink indeed.
what part of Jesus did you mis-understand?
what more could Jesus have *possibly *said to convince you? Nothing. And the striking part is, when you walk away from Him, He respects your free will.

John 6:67
After this many of his disciples went back; and walked no more with him

Christ gave them no explanation. He did not say, “wait, you mis-understood me, I was only speaking figuratively”. They knew, along with everyone else, exactly what He was saying?

If this were figurative, why is it written?

61 Many therefore of his disciples, hearing it, said: This saying is hard, and who can hear it.

Whats so hard about figuratively seeing Jesus as the Bread of Life? Whats so different about Jesus being the Vine, or the Light, or the Good Shepard? Why didn’t anyone else leave him there? THINK!
 
ajk19 said:
See again you are proving my point. If Christ’s sacrifice was indeed once and for all, then why is a “sacrifice” of the mass needed? It’s not.
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The Sacrifice of the Mass IS the Sacrifice of the Cross. It is the same Body and Blood which Christ offered for us on the Cross.

Nothing is repeated, only presented.
 
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