The Eucharist....

[Stephentlig]

Good evening forum members across the board, I was at mass this morning, and just before mass began, a local Lady by permission of the parish priest, proceeded to take The Blessed Sacrament from the Tabernacle and place it in the adoration chapel. during the mass then our Lord was not present in the tabernacle the priest went ahead and bowed in front of it anyway during the mass.

Is this allowed? it seems quite clear to me that it is not allowed.

and if so, other than pray for him, what should I do?

I’ve been speaking to the local bishop before about this priest when he spoke heresy from the pulpit ( modernism ) and tryed to explain away the miracle that Jesus didnt really cast out actual devils, that back then when someone had a devil in them that they just had a bad temper and nothing else.

I never got word back from the bishop as I phoned him twice and sent him an e-mail, but still no word back. with the local bishop not responding what should one do in such a difficult situation?

your advice and help is much needed
Pax Christi
Ave Maria
Stephen <3

 

[Joannm]

Good evening forum members across the board, I was at mass this morning, and just before mass began, a local Lady by permission of the parish priest, proceeded to take The Blessed Sacrament from the Tabernacle and place it in the adoration chapel. during the mass then our Lord was not present in the tabernacle the priest went ahead and bowed in front of it anyway during the mass.

Is this allowed? it seems quite clear to me that it is not allowed.

and if so, other than pray for him, what should I do?

I’ve been speaking to the local bishop before about this priest when he spoke heresy from the pulpit ( modernism ) and tryed to explain away the miracle that Jesus didnt really cast out actual devils, that back then when someone had a devil in them that they just had a bad temper and nothing else.

I never got word back from the bishop as I phoned him twice and sent him an e-mail, but still no word back. with the local bishop not responding what should one do in such a difficult situation?

your advice and help is much needed
Pax Christi
Ave Maria
Stephen <3

i don’t see what the difficult situation is. Perhaps there were hosts in the tabernacle. For adoration they usually just take out the luna which is a separate bigger host, and they leave the smaller ones in for bringing to the sick. Besides, it is not necessary to have hosts in the taberacle to celebrate Mass. Perhaps he genuflected out of habit as do most people when they enter the church on Good Friday when there are no hosts in the tabernacle.

As far as preaching heresy, I think you are overreacting. In ancient times they knew nothing about mental illness and even epilepsy or other diseases were thought to indicate posession by the devil. The key point is that Jesus healed the person and forgave their sins. Perhpas the Bishop is not responding because he has more important things to do than get involved in small matters. Why not take it up with the priest. That is probably what the bishop would tell you anyway as that is what happens in our diocese when someone complains.

 

[tee_eff_em]

If the adoration chapel is a separate space, this should be okay. But if it is the same “room” as the body of the church, it is inappropriate to have the Blessed Sacrament exposed during the Mass.

i don’t see what the difficult situation is. Perhaps there were hosts in the tabernacle. For adoration they usually just take out the luna which is a separate bigger host, and they leave the smaller ones in for bringing to the sick. Besides, it is not necessary to have hosts in the taberacle to celebrate Mass. Perhaps he genuflected out of habit…

Did the priest genuflect or bow? If the tabernacle was empty, I do not think a bow would be out of line.

…as do most people when they enter the church on Good Friday when there are no hosts in the tabernacle

Again, on Good Friday, a bow is not out of the question, and on that day a genuflection is made to the cross.

tee

 

[Stephentlig]

i don’t see what the difficult situation is. Perhaps there were hosts in the tabernacle. For adoration they usually just take out the luna which is a separate bigger host, and they leave the smaller ones in for bringing to the sick. Besides, it is not necessary to have hosts in the taberacle to celebrate Mass. Perhaps he genuflected out of habit as do most people when they enter the church on Good Friday when there are no hosts in the tabernacle.

As far as preaching heresy, I think you are overreacting. In ancient times they knew nothing about mental illness and even epilepsy or other diseases were thought to indicate posession by the devil. The key point is that Jesus healed the person and forgave their sins. Perhpas the Bishop is not responding because he has more important things to do than get involved in small matters. Why not take it up with the priest. That is probably what the bishop would tell you anyway as that is what happens in our diocese when someone complains.

There is no overreaction, all those diseases that Jesus healed were a result of the devil, even today epilepsy is the same it all comes from the enemy. as I’ve heard a young boys story about it when he was In Medugorje, he was healed and felt something shot out of his head and he never had epilipsy again.

so therefore what the priest taught was heresy ( modernism ) which trys to explain the miracle away. and it should not be tolerated I feel within the Church and is a very serious matter.
he is perhaps another priest who as father corapi would say ‘‘has lost the faith’’, and has turned to this rubbish. that kind of teaching goes against all of what the early church fathers taught and all the Popes down through the centuries, and if you look in your Cathechism to paragraphs 1506, 1237, 2850, 2853-2854, 517, 550, 1673. so according to these passages which is the doctrine of our faith, it is absoulute heresy.

Thank you for all the other advice though
God bless
Stephen <3

 

[Joannm]

There is no overreaction, all those diseases that Jesus healed were a result of the devil, even today epilepsy is the same it all comes from the enemy. as I’ve heard a young boys story about it when he was In Medugorje, he was healed and felt something shot out of his head and he never had epilipsy again.

so therefore what the priest taught was heresy ( modernism ) which trys to explain the miracle away. and it should not be tolerated I feel within the Church and is a very serious matter.
he is perhaps another priest who as father corapi would say ‘‘has lost the faith’’, and has turned to this rubbish. that kind of teaching goes against all of what the early church fathers taught and all the Popes down through the centuries, and if you look in your Cathechism to paragraphs 1506, 1237, 2850, 2853-2854, 517, 550, 1673. so according to these passages which is the doctrine of our faith, it is absoulute heresy.

Thank you for all the other advice though
God bless
Stephen <3

 

[centurionguard]

If the adoration chapel is a separate space, this should be okay. But if it is the same “room” as the body of the church, it is inappropriate to have the Blessed Sacrament exposed during the Mass.

Did the priest genuflect or bow? If the tabernacle was empty, I do not think a bow would be out of line.

Again, on Good Friday, a bow is not out of the question, and on that day a genuflection is made to the cross.

tee

Permission or Not from the priest…(“No Lay Person has the right”) to enter the Tabernacle and remove the Blessed Sacrament. Only a Ordained minister of the Catholic Church… Bishop, Priest or Deacon has the authority. I’m not surprised in that this kind of thing is happening. It’s happening in my own parish. It’s just another fine example of the priest relinquishing his priestly duties a passing it on to the laity.

 

[Joannm]

Permission or Not from the priest…(“No Lay Person has the right”) to enter the Tabernacle and remove the Blessed Sacrament. Only a Ordained minister of the Catholic Church… Bishop, Priest or Deacon has the authority. I’m not surprised in that this kind of thing is happening. It’s happening in my own parish. It’s just another fine example of the priest relinquishing his priestly duties a passing it on to the laity.

No, you are wrong. Laity, usually extraordinary ministers of Holy Communion, are allowed with permission of the pastor to remove the Blessed Sacrament from the Tabernacle and place it in the Monstrance for Adoration or to bring to the homebound.

 

[Stephentlig]

Permission or Not from the priest…(“No Lay Person has the right”) to enter the Tabernacle and remove the Blessed Sacrament. Only a Ordained minister of the Catholic Church… Bishop, Priest or Deacon has the authority. I’m not surprised in that this kind of thing is happening. It’s happening in my own parish. It’s just another fine example of the priest relinquishing his priestly duties a passing it on to the laity.

She is a Eucharistic minister though so there is no problem in her doing it. it just seems weird that they do it before the mass rather than after the mass.

at least that is what I saw done in another parish, the host was taken out for adoration before mass and then put back in again during mass.

 

[centurionguard]

No, you are wrong. Laity, usually extraordinary ministers of Holy Communion, are allowed with permission of the pastor to remove the Blessed Sacrament from the Tabernacle and place it in the Monstrance for Adoration or to bring to the homebound.

A Eucharistic Minister IS NOT Allowed by Canon Law to enter the Tabernacle.

 

[Stephentlig]

A Eucharistic Minister IS NOT Allowed by Canon Law to enter the Tabernacle.

wow, how suprising, could you qoute us the canon?
Thank you
Stephen

 

[Cluny]

If the Tabernacle is not tenanted (which is unlikely except on Holy Friday), or the Sacrament is reserved in a separate place, a bow is made to the Altar.

 

[Stephentlig]

Can.941 S2 ''Exposition of the blessed sacrament may not take place while Mass is being celebrated in the same area of the church or oratory.

 

[centurionguard]

wow, how suprising, could you qoute us the canon?
Thank you
Stephen

Stephen my apologies seems you do have a point

This is an addition to the revised 1983 edition of Canon Law

Can. 943 The minister of exposition of the Most Blessed Sacrament and of Eucharistic benediction (((is))) a priest or deacon; in ((“special circumstances”)), the minister of exposition and reposition alone without benediction is the acolyte, extraordinary minister of holy communion, or someone else designated by the local ordinary; the “prescripts” of the diocesan bishop are to be observed.

The 1917 Canon Law does not support this liberalized addition

 

[Stephentlig]

Can.900S’’ The only Minister who, in person of Christ, can bring into being the sacrament of the Eucharist is a validly ordained priest.’’

found it praise be God of course.

 

[Stephentlig]

Stephen my apologies seems you do have a point

This is an addition to the revised 1983 edition of Canon Law

Can. 943 The minister of exposition of the Most Blessed Sacrament and of Eucharistic benediction (((is))) a priest or deacon; in ((“special circumstances”)), the minister of exposition and reposition alone without benediction is the acolyte, extraordinary minister of holy communion, or someone else designated by the local ordinary; the “prescripts” of the diocesan bishop are to be observed.

The 1917 Canon Law does not support this liberalized addition

thats us both corrected then

God bless
Stephen

 

[FrDavid96]

No, you are wrong. Laity, usually extraordinary ministers of Holy Communion, are allowed with permission of the pastor to remove the Blessed Sacrament from the Tabernacle and place it in the Monstrance for Adoration or to bring to the homebound.

In order to “be” an Extraordinary Minister of Holy Communion, one must be appointed by a priest for that particular moment, and for a legitimate reason, and out of true necessity. If the priest himself (or another priest or a deacon) is there, then there is no legitimate reason nor any necessity for anyone else to be opening the tabernacle. Therefore the permission to appoint extraordinary ministers of Holy Communion does not apply.

 

[FrDavid96]

Good evening forum members across the board, I was at mass this morning, and just before mass began, a local Lady by permission of the parish priest, proceeded to take The Blessed Sacrament from the Tabernacle and place it in the adoration chapel. during the mass then our Lord was not present in the tabernacle the priest went ahead and bowed in front of it anyway during the mass.

Is this allowed? it seems quite clear to me that it is not allowed.

and if so, other than pray for him, what should I do?

I’ve been speaking to the local bishop before about this priest when he spoke heresy from the pulpit ( modernism ) and tryed to explain away the miracle that Jesus didnt really cast out actual devils, that back then when someone had a devil in them that they just had a bad temper and nothing else.

I never got word back from the bishop as I phoned him twice and sent him an e-mail, but still no word back. with the local bishop not responding what should one do in such a difficult situation?

your advice and help is much needed
Pax Christi
Ave Maria
Stephen <3

Stephen,
Perhaps he bowed simply out of habit. If he is “so liberal” it’s not very likely that he would be trying to make some point of bowing the the tabernacle. I would rather suspect that he would make more of a point of not bowing to the Tabernacle (unless he meant it out of sarcasm, but that’s taking things a bit far).

 

[Stephentlig]

In order to “be” an Extraordinary Minister of Holy Communion, one must be appointed by a priest for that particular moment, and for a legitimate reason, and out of true necessity. If the priest himself (or another priest or a deacon) is there, then there is no legitimate reason nor any necessity for anyone else to be opening the tabernacle. Therefore the permission to appoint extraordinary ministers of Holy Communion does not apply.

where does it state that in the code of canon law though?

 

[Stephentlig]

Stephen,
Perhaps he bowed simply out of habit. If he is “so liberal” it’s not very likely that he would be trying to make some point of bowing the the tabernacle. I would rather suspect that he would make more of a point of not bowing to the Tabernacle (unless he meant it out of sarcasm, but that’s taking things a bit far).

Well, first of all, if he has not bowed in front of the tabernacle because our Lords presence is not there, then I could see the reason for it, perhaps he bowed out of habit who knows, but its not necessarily that that I have a problem with, its the fact that Our Lord was taken from the tabernacle before the celebration of mass and placed the oratory room for adoration after mass.

thus it breaks canon 941s2 ‘‘Exposition of the blessed sacrament may not take place while Mass is being celebrated in the same area of the church or oratory.’’

God bless
Stephen.

 

[Joannm]

Well, first of all, if he has not bowed in front of the tabernacle because our Lords presence is not there, then I could see the reason for it, perhaps he bowed out of habit who knows, but its not necessarily that that I have a problem with, its the fact that Our Lord was taken from the tabernacle before the celebration of mass and placed the oratory room for adoration after mass.

thus it breaks canon 941s2 ‘‘Exposition of the blessed sacrament may not take place while Mass is being celebrated in the same area of the church or oratory.’’

God bless
Stephen.

Was exposition in the same area as Mass, or was it in a different place? We have an adoration chapel that is not in the same space where Mass would be going on.