The faith of the Devil?

[JonNC]

Lately Satan’s church of choice seems to be the Evangelical Lutheran Church of America and the Episcopal Church. Those that do his bidding attract his attention the most!

And since both Churches are filled with our brothers and sister in Christ, they may need the most prayers from all of the rest us that the Holy Spirit will guide and deliver them from the mistakes of their leadership.

Jon

 

[dangel]

I have never understood how one could be a Christian and Wiccan at the same time. The two to me seem completely incompateable.

This was something I was lucky to get explained to me. Basically Wicca isn’t a religion unless you make it so, really it’s a spirituality which you can mould to your own beliefs and so on.

So while she does go to church and worship Jesus Christ she also celebrates the pagan Sabbats and does a bit more on the ritual side. I’ve seen a few examples of this on DVD when they filmed a Winter Pagan Solstice (It’s like a Christmas Carol thing I think) which looked a lot of fun.

 

[dangel]

None of it is all that old. Almost all of it is modern persons re-creating what they imagine the pre-Christian pagan religions might have been like. There’s no continuity with antiquity. It’s basically make believe and all in all pretty lame. I’d have a good laugh at it before being afraid of it. “Sure, buddy… dance around naked and cast a spell on me… oh no, don’t put the evil eye on me… 'ya goof!”

XD! They don’t all run around naked (or Skyclad as the term is known). In fact I don’t know anyone that does.

And while Wicca was begun in the 1950s it incorporates practices going back before the birth of Jesus Christ and the accuracy is so that you can match the same methods of ritual to those jotted down on tablets used as reference going as far back as 300 AD (and even further back if you go by what the Egyptians documented).

(P.s Wiccans don’t hex and the evil eye is a protection ritual, not a curse)

 

[dangel]

Actually, most satanists don’t believe satan exists. They use satan as a symbol.

I’ve heard this too! I always thought it was silly but, well, that’s life.

 

[dangel]

I wonder if they argue and fight over theological differences like we do?!

I think the chances are if there’s more than one person in a group, whether it’s the same religion or one differing even slightly, people will differ over certain details. I know that there are loads of different groups of Wiccans who all believe different from each group and they seem to bicker just as much as everyone else.

 

[Publisher]

I have friends who are Wiccan. One of them was raised Wiccan, her husband became Wiccan some 40 years ago. They’ve been involved in covens of the Alexandrian and Gardnerian traditions, but these days they consider themselves “Eclectic” and “Solitary”.

They have a reverence for the Earth. They revere life and their fellow man. They both voluteer in soup kitchens and offer to work on Christmas for their employer so those Christians who may have plans can do so.

They are kind and good hearted people. I have gone with them to a few “Pagan Gatherings”…and except for not liking the heavy smell of incense and the “natural” body odor some of them seem to have…enjoyed my time with them. It took some getting use to seeing some of the women go without shaved legs and underarms…but all in all they are enjoyable to be around.

We have joined in working on peace issues.

 

[dangel]

I have friends who are Wiccan. One of them was raised Wiccan, her husband became Wiccan some 40 years ago. They’ve been involved in covens of the Alexandrian and Gardnerian traditions, but these days they consider themselves “Eclectic” and “Solitary”.

They have a reverence for the Earth. They revere life and their fellow man. They both voluteer in soup kitchens and offer to work on Christmas for their employer so those Christians who may have plans can do so.

They are kind and good hearted people. I have gone with them to a few “Pagan Gatherings”…and except for not liking the heavy smell of incense and the “natural” body odor some of them seem to have…enjoyed my time with them. It took some getting use to seeing some of the women go without shaved legs and underarms…but all in all they are enjoyable to be around.

We have joined in working on peace issues.

Yeah, they look like fun Even if I do have faiths that differ I’d still love to experience it in some way.

 

[dangel]

Anyway, bottomline people, stay away from the practice of any occult. It is dangerous even if it starts out as just fun. I’ve seen this.

The Occult means an organisation that keeps its rituals and practices secret (as far as I’m aware). Does the Catholic faith have secret ceremonies?

 

[KyivAndrew]

Does the Catholic faith have secret ceremonies?

NO The Catholic Church would like all souls to find the Truth and propagates the Salvific message of Christ and Church to all. The Church is in the business of truth and saving souls not little-ditty secretive rituals that make adults get that tingly feeling of being a bad little kid who has learned a dirty little secret. The temptation for that is common enough.

 

[Le_Cracquere]

Is Wicca really believed to be led by Satan?

I’ve heard rumours that it is but that the followers don’t realise it.

I’m pretty sure that Satan has more pride than that. Still, I wouldn’t be surprised if their gormless cavortings caused him some satisfied amusement.

 

[CHRISTINE77]

Wiccans believe in the power of nature and in Mother Earth and the Sun and other natural phenomena. The believe in they cycles of nature and in the different powers of each season. Even the Catholic Church has some of this in its holy days, such as All Souls Day, Christmas, Easter and other days, they are based on the seasons.

However Catholics also believe in the Bible and that there is one triune God in Heaven, who cares for us and will judge us in the latter day. Wiccans don’t believe in Christ. They are generally a bit amoral, because they really don’t believe in good and evil, just the powers of nature.

 

[workingman]

dangel;5639612]This was something I was lucky to get explained to me. Basically Wicca isn’t a religion unless you make it so, really it’s a spirituality which you can mould to your own beliefs and so on.

I would love to hear this explanation. I find it funny it is not a religion due to the fact that they have a web sight and it is a church. It it actualy a recognised religion. Here is a link. wiccanchurchmn.org/
Last I checked spirituality nomaly equals religion.

So while she does go to church and worship Jesus Christ she also celebrates the pagan Sabbats and does a bit more on the ritual side. I’ve seen a few examples of this on DVD when they filmed a Winter Pagan Solstice (It’s like a Christmas Carol thing I think) which looked a lot of fun.

mixing pagan days and Christianity. Sounds like a recipe for trouble to me. “Nature religion” or not worship of the seasons/elements sounds like worship of idols or worship of the created instead of the Creator.

 

[NoWings]

Ihmmm: mixing pagan days and Christianity. Sounds like a recipe for trouble to me. “Nature religion” or not worship of the seasons/elements sounds like worship of idols or worship of the created instead of the Creator.

Are you serious?

“Mixing pagan days and Christianity”? Every main Wiccan holiday has a Christian counterpart. Yule becomes Christmas, Midsummer becomes St John’s Day and all that.

That’s why I never understood folks who went “Wheel of the Year” pagan. I’ve tried to think of something that that type of paganism has that Christianity doesn’t and there isn’t one thing.

Everything has an equal.

 

[dangel]

Some Wicca as stated above in this thread even include Christian symbols. I learned some of this once listening to a Catholic radio show where the guest was a fomer wiccan/pagan who had practiced magic in Eastern Europe right after the fall of communism (a brief spiritual vacuum), which practice she divided into “white magic” and “black magic”, which differences to me sound just like semantics and pretending to good while engaging in “white magic” occult. How is one spirit “white” and one “black”. She suffered for it and became a committed Catholic. Besides the CC explicitly condemns occult divinizations.

Well informed Wiccans do not believe in Black or White magic.

and Christian symbols are integrated within Wicca just like Pagan events are integrated within Christianity.

 

[dangel]

I would love to hear this explanation. I find it funny it is not a religion due to the fact that they have a web sight and it is a church. It it actualy a recognised religion. Here is a link. wiccanchurchmn.org/
Last I checked spirituality nomaly equals religion.

mixing pagan days and Christianity. Sounds like a recipe for trouble to me. “Nature religion” or not worship of the seasons/elements sounds like worship of idols or worship of the created instead of the Creator.

Like I said, it’s not a religion unless YOU MAKE IT SO. Otherwise it’s a spirituality.

JUST because something is on the net doesn’t mean it’s real, and while there are Wiccans out there who use Wicca as a full based religion doesn’t mean all do the same. It’s not that black and white.

And Christianity has tons of Pagan days, Christmas/Yule for one. Christianity took all the previous holidays and just renamed them to suit themselves.

 

[dangel]

Wiccans believe in the power of nature and in Mother Earth and the Sun and other natural phenomena. The believe in they cycles of nature and in the different powers of each season. Even the Catholic Church has some of this in its holy days, such as All Souls Day, Christmas, Easter and other days, they are based on the seasons.

However Catholics also believe in the Bible and that there is one triune God in Heaven, who cares for us and will judge us in the latter day. Wiccans don’t believe in Christ. They are generally a bit amoral, because they really don’t believe in good and evil, just the powers of nature.

Not all Wiccans denounce the Catholic God.

And it’s true, most Wiccans do refuse to go along with ‘good and evil’ as if they are two separate things, they regard both as natural and equal actions within the human emotion and psyche that aren’t governed by the actions of someone like Satan.

 

[dangel]

NO The Catholic Church would like all souls to find the Truth and propagates the Salvific message of Christ and Church to all. The Church is in the business of truth and saving souls not little-ditty secretive rituals that make adults get that tingly feeling of being a bad little kid who has learned a dirty little secret. The temptation for that is common enough.

What about within the Vatican? I’ve seen ceremonies there where only a strict number of people are allowed in and no one is allowed to talk about the actions within EVER (between God and the [insert clergy title here] I can’t remember what the event was called but it’s something like that).

That’s occult.

And just because something is secret does not mean it’s a bad thing. Good things can be secret too.

 

[dangel]

I’m pretty sure that Satan has more pride than that. Still, I wouldn’t be surprised if their gormless cavortings caused him some satisfied amusement.

That’s probably just very uncalled for. Come on now, don’t spit your dummy out over a simple conversation.

 

[CHRISTINE77]

Not all Wiccans denounce the Catholic God.

And it’s true, most Wiccans do refuse to go along with ‘good and evil’ as if they are two separate things, they regard both as natural and equal actions within the human emotion and psyche that aren’t governed by the actions of someone like Satan.

I’ve never met any Wiccans who believed in the Catholic God. Why would they?

 

[Le_Cracquere]

That’s probably just very uncalled for. Come on now, don’t spit your dummy out over a simple conversation.

I’m not positive what it means to “spit one’s dummy out,” so I can’t say I haven’t done it. Still, a quick glance at the formation of modern Wicca & its founders, such as Gerald Gardner & Raymond Buckland, offers grist for considerable (though, I grant you, uncharitable) amusement.

The pet theories, sexual preoccupations, and ginned-up ceremonies of the early Wiccans caused them to look less like noble pagans of olde OR satanic votaries, and more like victims of an elaborate and malicious practical joke. This quality has continued to cling to its modern practitioners. It’s this vaguely duncelike quality that makes me think it a poor fit for the devil, who is not merely the Prince of Lies, but the Prince of Pride. Still, he might believe that useful idiots are nevertheless useful for all that: hence, my original comment.