The Gospel

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DD2007

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If someone asked you “what is the gospel?” What would you say?

Note the disclaimer:

Galatians 1:8 ESV
8 But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed.
 
Good news that Christ died and was buried and rose again from the grave
1 Corinthians 15:1-4
Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

Also I feel its good (great) news that through Christ there is an escape from spending an eternity in hell. Can’t find a verse for that though.

Gospel = Good news = euangellion
 
I don’t get the “disclaimer”. :confused: What is the OP fishing for here? What Catholics see as the Gospel message?
 
The wage of sin is death (Romans 6:23). We all deserve to die and suffer, for we all sin (Romans 3; Proverbs 20:9; 1 John 1:8). God the Word (who is Lord and Savior), who became incarnate (John 1) and lived a perfectly sinless life (1 John 3:5), decided to die for us (Matthew 26-27), that we may have salvation and a relationship with the Lord God Almighty. He was resurrected in a glorified and incorruptible body (Matthew 28), signifying and promising that we too shall inherit new, incorruptible and glorified bodies (1 Corinthians 15:42-44). The just live by faith (Romans 1:17; Galatians 3:11). By faith, we are justified in the eyes of God (Acts 16:31; Romans 3:28; Romans 4:5; Romans 5:1; Romans 10:9; Romans 11:6; Galatians 2:16). Our works regenerate the faith, keep our faith alive and healthy, and justify us in the eyes of man (James 2:14-26).

That’s the Gospel I preach. 🙂
 
I don’t get the “disclaimer”. :confused: What is the OP fishing for here? What Catholics see as the Gospel message?
Basically he wants Catholics to say what they think the “Gospel” is, so he can say how non-Christian it is and how we are wrong. I post over on the CARM forum, and they do this exact post a number of times.
 
1 Corinthians: 15:1-4. Look it up.

Edit: And I see somebody else has beat me to the punch and has quoted the Scripture already. Yaaaaaaaaaaay! See post# 4.
 
The wage of sin is death (Romans 6:23). We all deserve to die and suffer, for we all sin (Romans 3; Proverbs 20:9; 1 John 1:8). God the Word (who is Lord and Savior), who became incarnate (John 1) and lived a perfectly sinless life (1 John 3:5), decided to die for us (Matthew 26-27), that we may have salvation and a relationship with the Lord God Almighty. He was resurrected in a glorified and incorruptible body (Matthew 28), signifying and promising that we too shall inherit new, incorruptible and glorified bodies (1 Corinthians 15:42-44). The just live by faith (Romans 1:17; Galatians 3:11). By faith, we are justified in the eyes of God (Acts 16:31; Romans 3:28; Romans 4:5; Romans 5:1; Romans 10:9; Romans 11:6; Galatians 2:16). Our works regenerate the faith, keep our faith alive and healthy, and justify us in the eyes of man (James 2:14-26).

That’s the Gospel I preach. 🙂
But not a word from Christ’s own lips about what the gospel is!

Why not start with this?

“If you would enter into life, keep the commandments.” Matt. 19:17
 
But not a word from Christ’s own lips about what the gospel is!

Why not start with this?

“If you would enter into life, keep the commandments.” Matt. 19:17
Keep the commandments, huh? This is interesting, because you sound like a Judaizer. Paul rebuked the Judaizers greatly in the Book of Galatians. Also, you posted the verse out of context to support your beliefs. Atheists can do the same thing to “prove” their belief that no God exists:

Psalm 14:1
There is no God.

Of course, this verse from Psalms is out of context. The true verse says: “The fool says in his heart, “There is no God.” They are corrupt, their deeds are vile; there is no one who does good”. I’d appreciate it if you kept things within their context.

Albert Barnes did a nice commentary on Matthew 19:17:
Albert Barnes:
The young man thought he had kept them, and was relying on them for salvation. It was of great importance, therefore, to convince him that he was, after all, a sinner. Christ did not mean to say that any man would be saved by the works of the law, for the Bible teaches plainly that such will not be the case (Romans 3:20, Romans 3:28; Romans 4:6; Galatians 2:16; Ephesians 2:9; 2 Timothy 1:9). At the same time, however, it is true that if a man perfectly complied with the requirements of the law he would be saved, for there would be no reason why he should be condemned. Jesus, therefore, since he saw he was depending on his works, told him that if he would enter into life that is, into heaven - he must keep the commandments; if he was depending on them he must keep them perfectly, and if this was done he would be saved.The reasons why Christ gave him this direction were, probably:
  1. Because it was his duty to keep them.
  2. Because the young man depended on them, and he ought to understand what was required if he did - that they should be kept perfectly, or that they were not kept at all.
  3. Because he wanted to test him, to show him that he did not keep them, and thus to show him his need of a Saviour.
Now, here is the rest of the Scripture of that young rich man:
Matthew 19:16-26 KJV
(16) And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
(17) And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
(18) He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,
(19) Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
(20) The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet?
(21) Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.
(22) But when the young man heard that saying, he went away sorrowful: for he had great possessions.
(23) Then said Jesus unto his disciples, Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven.
(24) And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.
(25) When his disciples heard it, they were exceedingly amazed, saying, Who then can be saved?
(26) But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible.
What is Jesus saying here? Is He saying we are justified and enter salvation through keeping the Law? Absolutely not. Quoting chapter 17 of this is like quoting a Pharisee, or Job when he was suffering. We need to examine everything. Jesus begins by telling the man he would enter salvation through keeping the whole Law. This is true. If I kept the entire Law from birth, I wouldn’t need Jesus. Of course, no man keeps the Law, for all men sin. The man claimed to be a keeper of the Law. Jesus told the man to sell, give to the poor, and follow Him; to forsake all to follow Christ. The rich man could not do it. He sinned by doing so. He broke the Law. The disciples were amazed when Jesus said that it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God. They doubted, because no one keeps the law. They asked, “Who then can be saved?” Jesus assured them, “With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible.” This is true. With God, all things are possible. God made the way to salvation possible: Have faith. Repent. Trust Christ. Trust the Gospel.

We are told that obeying the Law gives us no salvation, but faith does:

Romans 3:28
*For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from observing the law. *

Galatians 3:24
*So the law was put in charge to lead us to Christ that we might be justified by faith. *

Romans 5:1
*Therefore, since we have been justified through faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, *

**Ephesians 2:8–9 **
*For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— not by works, so that no one can boast. *

Notice that Paul never, ever, says “we have been justified through faith with works”. He always and only mentions faith. The only guy to mention faith and works was James. What Catholics don’t understand is that James talks about dead faith. Faith that demons even have: belief. Demons believe in Christ. They don’t have saving faith though. Saving faith is accompanied by good works. If one says they are saved, yet works against Christ, they are not saved. We are justified in front of God by faith, and in front of men by faith and works. Also, James’ targets were those who had that demonic “faith”. Works evidence and regenerate faith. But our works do not save us, for Christ did not teach works-righteousness. It’s funny when Catholics say private interpretation is bad, when they interpret the book of James by itself. You must look at other passages to get the true meaning. I won’t learn truth by one book. I must examine all.

God bless.
 
You’re on. John 3:16.
John 3:16:

For God so loved the world that he gave 7 his only Son, so that everyone who believes in him might not perish but might have eternal life.

Those are *not *the very words Christ preached. Please quote the *very words of the gospel * that Christ himself *actually preached * to his disciples while on this earth.

This is how we know what love is: Jesus Christ laid down his life for us. And we ought to lay down our lives for our brothers.

1 John 3:16
 
John 3:16:

For God so loved the world that he gave 7 his only Son, so that everyone who believes in him might not perish but might have eternal life.

Those are *not *the very words Christ preached. Please quote the *very words of the gospel * that Christ himself *actually preached * to his disciples while on this earth.

This is how we know what love is: Jesus Christ laid down his life for us. And we ought to lay down our lives for our brothers.

1 John 3:16
Mark 1:15 KJV
(15) And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.
 
Keep the commandments, huh? This is interesting, because you sound like a Judaizer. Paul rebuked the Judaizers greatly in the Book of Galatians. Also, you posted the verse out of context to support your beliefs. Atheists can do the same thing to “prove” their belief that no God exists:

Psalm 14:1
There is no God.

Of course, this verse from Psalms is out of context. The true verse says: “The fool says in his heart, “There is no God.” They are corrupt, their deeds are vile; there is no one who does good”. I’d appreciate it if you kept things within their context.

Albert Barnes did a nice commentary on Matthew 19:17:

Now, here is the rest of the Scripture of that young rich man:

What is Jesus saying here? Is He saying we are justified and enter salvation through keeping the Law? Absolutely not. Quoting chapter 17 of this is like quoting a Pharisee, or Job when he was suffering. We need to examine everything. Jesus begins by telling the man he would enter salvation through keeping the whole Law. This is true. If I kept the entire Law from birth, I wouldn’t need Jesus. Of course, no man keeps the Law, for all men sin. The man claimed to be a keeper of the Law. Jesus told the man to sell, give to the poor, and follow Him; to forsake all to follow Christ. The rich man could not do it. He sinned by doing so. He broke the Law. The disciples were amazed when Jesus said that it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God. They doubted, because no one keeps the law. They asked, “Who then can be saved?” Jesus assured them, “With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible.” This is true. With God, all things are possible. God made the way to salvation possible: Have faith. Repent. Trust Christ. Trust the Gospel.

We are told that obeying the Law gives us no salvation, but faith does:

Romans 3:28
*For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from observing the law. *

Galatians 3:24
*So the law was put in charge to lead us to Christ that we might be justified by faith. *

Romans 5:1
*Therefore, since we have been justified through faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, *

**Ephesians 2:8–9 **
*For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— not by works, so that no one can boast. *

Notice that Paul never, ever, says “we have been justified through faith with works”. He always and only mentions faith. The only guy to mention faith and works was James. What Catholics don’t understand is that James talks about dead faith. Faith that demons even have: belief. Demons believe in Christ. They don’t have saving faith though. Saving faith is accompanied by good works. If one says they are saved, yet works against Christ, they are not saved. We are justified in front of God by faith, and in front of men by faith and works. Also, James’ targets were those who had that demonic “faith”. Works evidence and regenerate faith. But our works do not save us, for Christ did not teach works-righteousness. It’s funny when Catholics say private interpretation is bad, when they interpret the book of James by itself. You must look at other passages to get the true meaning. I won’t learn truth by one book. I must examine all.

God bless.
I completely agree with what you say, yet I also agree with raumzeitmc2 in the sense that a true faith is an active faith that works. Christ does command that we do the good works that He puts before us and prepares us for.

Jon
 
Yes, but the works do not save us. The faith which the works regenerate saves us. 🙂
 
Catholics (at least this one here) believe that the Incarnation itself makes works valuable, because Christ (God in the Flesh) did works. When we cooperate with God’s Grace, it is not me that works, but Christ who works in me, just as Christ said “not my will, but your will be done”.

My own efforts, my own works are of darkness, finite and temporal even at their best. Therefore it is proper to say that our works can’t save us, because the only sufficient good we do is through God’s Grace. Our works can’t save us, but they can deliver Christ’s grace to others, making them salvific and redemptive, because that IS Christ’s work. In our union with Christ we are saved. We must abide in Him.

:twocents:
 
(Snip)

Notice that Paul never, ever, says “we have been justified through faith with works”. He always and only mentions faith. The only guy to mention faith and works was James. What Catholics don’t understand is that James talks about dead faith.
James 2:26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.
James is talking about dead faith?? I don’t see your point??
James is talking about two inseperable things here. Body and Spirit = Faith and Works.
Remove the spirit fromt he Body and the body is dead, remove the Works from the Faith and the Faith dies.
James is clearly saying that you cannot have a living faith without the fruits of that faith which are works; Works of the Holy Spirit; Works that are visible and uplifting to the brethren and beneficial in saving souls.
Faith that demons even have: belief. Demons believe in Christ. They don’t have saving faith though. Saving faith is accompanied by good works. If one says they are saved, yet works against Christ, they are not saved. We are justified in front of God by faith, and in front of men by faith and works. Also, James’ targets were those who had that demonic “faith”. Works evidence and regenerate faith. But our works do not save us, for Christ did not teach works-righteousness. It’s funny when Catholics say private interpretation is bad, when they interpret the book of James by itself. You must look at other passages to get the true meaning. I won’t learn truth by one book. I must examine all.
God bless.
It would take too long to try to explain that Catholics believe that we are saved By Faith Through Grace. Works are a necessary outpouring of a saving grace. This is essentially what you are saying above and Catholics believe and teach this.
If you would like to learn more, HERE is the Catechism which says in part:
1698 The first and last point of reference of this catechesis will always be Jesus Christ himself, who is "the way, and the truth, and the life."24 It is by looking to him in faith that Christ’s faithful can hope that he himself fulfills his promises in them, and that, by loving him with the same love with which he has loved them, they may perform works in keeping with their dignity:
So you see that we agree that works are a natural and necessary outgrowth of true saving faith that is received by the free gift of grace.

P.S. there is a search engine for the catechism at the bottom of the page - Most useful

Peace
James
 
Keep the commandments, huh? This is interesting, because you sound like a Judaizer. Paul rebuked the Judaizers greatly in the Book of Galatians. Also, you posted the verse out of context to support your beliefs. Atheists can do the same thing to “prove” their belief that no God exists:
Heretics and schismatics too can (and always have) twisted Scripture to suit their purposes!

But the question is, do we need to keep the commandments to be saved or not?
We are told that obeying the Law gives us no salvation, but faith does:
Romans 3:28
*For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from observing the law. *
Galatians 3:24
*So the law was put in charge to lead us to Christ that we might be justified by faith. *
Romans 5:1
*Therefore, since we have been justified through faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, *
**Ephesians 2:8–9 **
*For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— not by works, so that no one can boast. *
Notice that Paul never, ever, says “we have been justified through faith with works”. He always and only mentions faith. The only guy to mention faith and works was James.
Absolutely not true! And apart from the fact that you didn’t quote Christ even once on this all important subject of salvation, you’re confusing Works of the Law, or rather, Works of the Torah, with the good works of Christians which are a function of grace. But back to St. Paul:

Circumcision means nothing, and uncircumcision means nothing; what matters is keeping God’s commandments.1 Corinthians 7:19

And we are commanded, among other things, to do good works! I recommend you read Works of the Law by James Akin (Jimmy Akin).
What Catholics don’t understand is that James talks about dead faith. Faith that demons even have: belief. Demons believe in Christ. They don’t have saving faith though. Saving faith is accompanied by good works. If one says they are saved, yet works against Christ, they are not saved. We are justified in front of God by faith, and in front of men by faith and works. Also, James’ targets were those who had that demonic “faith”. Works evidence and regenerate faith. But our works do not save us, for Christ did not teach works-righteousness. It’s funny when Catholics say private interpretation is bad, when they interpret the book of James by itself. You must look at other passages to get the true meaning. I won’t learn truth by one book. I must examine all.
Catholics understand perfectly well what St. James means, or will you accuse the greatest Doctor of the Church, St. Augustine himself, of “works-righteousness” or of being a “Judaizer” when he explicitly teaches, for example:

“But if you want to attain to a life that is everlasting and blissful, have a temporal life that is good. It’s good in its work, it’ll be good in it’s reward. But if you refuse to do the work, how can you have the face to seek the reward? If you can’t say to Christ, ‘I have done what you commanded,’ how will you have the nerve to say, ‘Pay me what you promised?’”

Sermon 229H:3:5, p. 298.

books.google.com/books?as_q=&num=10&lr=&btnG=Google+Search&as_epq=If+you+can%27t+say+to+Christ%2C+%22I+have+done+what+you+commanded%2C%22+how+will+you+have+the+nerve+to+say%2C+%22Pay+me&as_oq=&as_eq=&as_brr=0&as_pt=ALLTYPES&lr=&as_vt=&as_auth=&as_pub=&as_sub=&as_drrb_is=q&as_minm_is=0&as_miny_is=&as_maxm_is=0&as_maxy_is=&as_isbn=&as_issn=

Or again:

“He is going to come as a judge, let us not bear the yoke with unbelievers. He is also going to resuscitate the corpses of the dead; let us deserve this transfiguration of the body by a transformation of our minds. He is going to set the bad on his left, the good on his right; LET US CHOOSE OUR PLACE WITH GOOD WORKS.”

Sermon 229D: 1 “On the Holy Day of Easter.”

books.google.com/books?hl=en&client=firefox&rls=com.yahoo:en-US:official&hs=HyZ&num=10&lr=&ft=i&cr=&safe=images&um=1&ie=UTF-8&q=%22LET%20US%20CHOOSE%20OUR%20PLACE%20WITH%20GOOD%20WORKS%22&sa=N&tab=wp

God bless.
 
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