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Reformed
Guest
Well…your very first line is contradicted by other Roman Catholics who believe the Magestrium teaches about the exclusive elect of God and predestination.
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BlestOne
Guest
Ummmm… proof? I don’t think so… I have never been taught that and neither has anybody else I know… Please reference it with Magesterial teaching.
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TriuneUnity
Guest
True…but that may be because there’s so much wrong to stereotypeI am sure that it is. At least anti-CAtholics don’t keep repeating the same canards over and over
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ralphinal
Guest
Now that was just plain wrongTrue…but that may be because there’s so much wrong to stereotype
Besides, when it comes to those claims, we have been called worse by better
Let he with no heresy cast the first stone.
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TriuneUnity
Guest
Now that was just plain wrong
Besides, when it comes to those claims, we have been called worse by better
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ralphinal
Guest
ha ha ha
Everyone knows there are no Lutheran athletes.
Afterall, brat eating is not an officail olympic sport
Everyone knows there are no Lutheran athletes.
Afterall, brat eating is not an officail olympic sport
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TriuneUnity
Guest
mmmmmm bratwurst.
Actually, in all seriousness, if there is one benefit to spending time on this forum is to make me realize how much I do have in common with Rome compared to some of the blatantly goofy stuff I’ve seen Protestants say here (not to mention the Calvinists
)
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ralphinal
Guest
It is one of the tragedies of all of it. Many Catholics do not know how close some non-Catholic faiths are, and vice-versa. Likewise, many non-Catholics do not know the real range of systems held by non-Catholics.mmmmmm bratwurst.
Actually, in all seriousness, if there is one benefit to spending time on this forum is to make me realize how much I do have in common with Rome compared to some of the blatantly goofy stuff I’ve seen Protestants say here (not to mention the Calvinists
I am about to start a new thread. I have a question
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Reformed
Guest
LOL… you don’t know which fork on the road to take, do you?mmmmmm bratwurst.
Actually, in all seriousness, if there is one benefit to spending time on this forum is to make me realize how much I do have in common with Rome compared to some of the blatantly goofy stuff I’ve seen Protestants say here (not to mention the Calvinists
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ralphinal
Guest
You use the meat fork. One never uses the shellfish fork for brats, and the salad fork is incorrect as well. Don’t they teach you folks anything now-a-days?
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TriuneUnity
Guest
You use the meat fork. One never uses the shellfish fork for brats, and the salad fork is incorrect as well. Don’t they teach you folks anything now-a-days?
Gnostic Philistines!
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mikeledes
Guest
Tell me about it. You learn new Protestant “goofy stuff” all the time.mmmmmm bratwurst.
Actually, in all seriousness, if there is one benefit to spending time on this forum is to make me realize how much I do have in common with Rome compared to some of the blatantly goofy stuff I’ve seen Protestants say here (not to mention the Calvinists
God Bless,
Michael
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distracted
Guest
define faith… You Protestant posters here at CAF (some anyway) never really define your terms… What does saved by faith mean, exactly?
i can do you one better (than just seeing…)… I have known Protestants who not only believe (as i said in my post… that they can live any kind of way & it doesn’t matter becaue they are saved regardless)… but have LIVED that philosophy QUITE well…
In fact people of all religious faiths live as though they believe in “God is love, therefore, he won’t punish me… and i don’t have to do anything i don’t want to do… because, since God loves me, he won’t send me to Hell… or Purgatory…”
It is human nature to fool oursleves this way…
Not to mention devilish nature…
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distracted
Guest
well… that’s refreshing… to someone like me who has seen far too many Protestants @ CAF… just arguing and arguing with the Catholics… and never admitting that anything “catholic” is right…mmmmmm bratwurst.
Actually, in all seriousness, if there is one benefit to spending time on this forum is to make me realize how much I do have in common with Rome compared to some of the blatantly goofy stuff I’ve seen Protestants say here (not to mention the Calvinists
God bless.
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mikeledes
Guest
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TriuneUnity
Guest
Trust that the person and work of Christ reconciles us to the Father by atoning for our sins and for obeying the Law for us.
And I’ve seen Catholics behave this way too. It’s called SIN. It doesn’t have anything to do with theology.
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Reformed
Guest
It seems you want to be Catholic but the essential of justification by faith alone would make that impossible. I can see the differences between Luther and Calvin by our own presuppositions. Because Luther tried to retain as much of Roman Catholicism as possible in the light of Scripture, I can see your dilemma on many issues. I can see why it seems you have much in common with Rome. However, the line in the sand of justification can never be crossed, because you seem to see it like me…as being the heart of the gospel of God’s grace…to the glory of God alone. Within the 5 solas, I’m not sure if you personally can let any of them go according to your conscience and Scripture. You are a wild boar Christian if you like it or not.
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TriuneUnity
Guest
It is; Luther was right that justification is the article of faith that defines Christianity apart from every other man-made religion. On that particular article, there can never be any compromise. However, what separates us, Reformed, is that while justification is central, so is orthodox Christology, so is the real presence in the Supper, so is baptismal regeneration, the grace of absolution, and the beauty of the historic Christian liturgy.
It seems you want to be Catholic but the essential of justification by faith alone would make that impossible. I can see the differences between Luther and Calvin by our own presuppositions. Because Luther tried to retain as much of Roman Catholicism as possible in the light of Scripture, I can see your dilemma on many issues. I can see why it seems you have much in common with Rome. However, the line in the sand of justification can never be crossed, because you seem to see it like me…as being the heart of the gospel of God’s grace…to the glory of God alone. Within the 5 solas, I’m not sure if you personally can let any of them go according to your conscience and Scripture. You are a wild boar Christian if you like it or not.
Calvin’s ultimate downfall was his Zwinglian presuppositions; he did not seek to reform the Church, but to reinvent it.
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Reformed
Guest
It seems we both agree with Luther that justification by faith is the article in which the church stands or fall. Why do you seem to make other issues to be lines in the sand? There is much I do not agree with you, but I let it go because we seem to be united on the essentials. If you agree with Luther that the Catholic Church has fallen because of the rejection of the biblical doctrine of justification, why do you seem to unite with them? You gave me your approval of the Cambridge Declaration which denies unity with Rome because of justification. The Cambridge Declaration unites both Lutherans and Reformed Christians, but you seem to want division.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Cambridge_Declaration
Here’s the candid questions. Do you see Orthodox Roman Catholics to be your brother and sisters in Christ or the mission field?
Do you see Reformed Christians to be your brother and sisters in Christ or the mission field?
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TriuneUnity
Guest
I do not unite with them in any ecclesiastical sense. Because Rome herself teaches much that is wrong that does not mean I am willing to send them into Hell. Christ’s atoning work was sufficient to redeem anyone who places their faith in Him from any error in doctrine. I do not make holding to correct doctrine to be what saves us. Holding to the correct Savior is what saves us.
Roman Catholics (or Eastern Orthodox, for that matter) are not a mission field. I will discuss, debate, and argue against their teaching to try and convince them of biblical truth, but I’m not arrogant enough to assume that they are flaming heretics who must be converted or burn for eternity.
I consider any Christian, whether Roman, Lutheran, Arminian, or Calvinist to be a brother and sister in Christ. The true church is not defined by denomination or religious background. It is defined by faith in Christ. I see no reason to doubt the Catholic’s faith in Christ unless they give me a VERY good reason to do so. I do not unite with Rome because of her errors on the papacy, justification, the intercession of the saints, et al…but while I do not unite with her on the basis of pure doctrine I must, out of Christian love, unite with them in confessing one God, one Christ, one Spirit, one baptism, and one resurrection.
In the same sense that I divide from Rome, I divide from Geneva. I do not consider those who deny the Body and Blood of my Savior in the holy eucharist to be a small matter. I do not consider those who deny the saving work of baptism to be a small matter. I do not consider that those who affirm that God decrees who will go to Hell to be an issue worth uniting with them over. I think it pure folly to try and turn Luther into some crypto-Calvinist. Luther was less ecumenical than I am. He considered faithful Catholics to be Christians. He did NOT afford the same courtesy to Zwingli, Bucer, and the other early Reformed theologians. You really need to think twice about identifying Luther as someone who held to what you hold to.
Hoc est Corpus Meum!
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