the habitual use of extraordinary ministers of Holy Communion at Mass

[water]

I am confused.

Your website says 2 priests and 5 deacons!

and Debbie George runs 6 ministries herself.

You are confused indeed as I said 1 priest, 1 deacon per mass.

BTW, for Debbie George, she is a wonderful person and she is in many ministries - this is her life after retirement.

We have over 500 volunteers in many ministries. I am in 4 different ministries myself.

We are praying to get a 3rd priest for this large parish.

 

[water]

WOuld you say that 1000-1200 is a large group of communicants? I thin this is a situation where the precious blood shoud not be offered. The vatican has spoken on this very subject in Redemptionis Sacramentum.

102. The chalice should not be ministered to lay members of Christ’s faithful where there is such a large number of communicants189 that it is difficult to gauge the amount of wine for the Eucharist and there is a danger that “more than a reasonable quantity of the Blood of Christ remains to be consumed at the end of the celebration.”190 The same is true wherever access to the chalice would be difficult to arrange, or where such a large amount of wine would be required that its certain provenance and quality could only be known with difficulty, or wherever there is not an adequate number of sacred ministers or extraordinary ministers of Holy Communion with proper formation, or where a notable part of the people continues to prefer not to approach the chalice for various reasons, so that the sign of unity would in some sense be negated.

I don’t serve as an EMHC during mass but for Nursing Home only. I don’t know how much amount of Jesus’ blood left, but yes, we do serve It every Sunday.

For arranging the chalices, there is no problem.

 

[puzzleannie]

I actually did start my thread on Liturgy and Sacraments. But even there it didn’t get a lot of reaction.

perhaps because we have recently finished two lengthy (and acrimonious) discussions on this topic?

 

[palmas85]

I’ll be delighted to take you there when you have a chance. Just PM me.

saintwilliams.org

A brand new church holding ~1,700 seats - Saint William of Round Rock, TX. It should be the biggest parish by now of Diocese of Austin.

It has 3550 registered families. So I would guess from your estimates on Mass size that just about everybody registered goes to Mass every Sunday since between 6 and 7000 are attending on any given Sunday.

The Parish lists two Priests and five Deacons or has that changed?

A call to their business office confirmed that normal Mass attendance runs at about the national average of 25-30% of those registered in the Parish except for Holiday Masses such as Christmas and Easter.

Taking the larger figure, 30% of 3550 comes out to about 1050 families or so. Divide by the six Sunday Masses and you have roughly 175 families per Mass. By your description of 1200 per Mass that works out to about seven family members per family give or take a few at each Mass

If the figures you provided are correct I applaud the Parishes obvious love of children and the non use of contraceptives.

Of course, I believe that in your zeal to promote the use of Extraordinary Ministers and the need to justify them you exagerrated just a bit on the Mass sizes. While I have no doubt that there are mega Masses from time to time I somehow doubt that all of them are, particularly given the Mass times as posted.

I do have one question. I watched the dedication Mass video. Vrty nice, lots of active participation both female and otherwise …but where is the Tabernacle located? I didn’t see it. Is it behind the Altar near the large Crucifix or is it off on the side somewhere?.

Just curious.

 

[water]

If the figures you provided are correct I applaud the Parishes obvious love of children and the non use of contraceptives.

Of course, I believe that in your zeal to promote the use of Extraordinary Ministers and the need to justify them you exagerrated just a bit on the Mass sizes. While I have no doubt that there are mega Masses from time to time I somehow doubt that all of them are, particularly given the Mass times as posted…

The number is the estimation given to us during a homily about 8 months or so ago - I believed the priest said it was nearly 8,000 attending for all the Sunday masses.

That is how I have come to the number. Besides that, I have attended most of the mass being schedule and as I see, most of the rows are quite filled up.

I don’t promote anything here for myself is not an EMHC for any mass. I only volunteer to take the Eucharist to the elderly which I am blessed to have this call.

You could be right that when he said it, it was for some occasion. I just don’t remember it correctly but I remembered the number.

I have no clue what the total of families now, but it is growing quite fast.

 

[water]

I do have one question. I watched the dedication Mass video. Vrty nice, lots of active participation both female and otherwise …but where is the Tabernacle located? I didn’t see it. Is it behind the Altar near the large Crucifix or is it off on the side somewhere?.

Just curious.

Yeah, I myself like the tabernacle to be at the center because I’ve been to more than 1/2 of my life to a church in Vietnam which you probably consider more traditional.

The tabernacle is on the left side where parishioners can kneel and get very close to It.

 

[water]

I forgot to mention there are many people who have not registered and/or from different parishes like to go to mass here. Most of the ones from different parishes come to mass because they either like the new church or they like our pastor’s homily.

 

[palmas85]

Yeah, I myself like the tabernacle to be at the center because I’ve been to more than 1/2 of my life to a church in Vietnam which you probably consider more traditional.

The tabernacle is on the left side where parishioners can kneel and get very close to It.

I will have to go there.

 

[joelacour]

If you have 1,200 at a Mass with 1 priest (or 2) and 1 deacon, I think you’d need at least 4 communion stations, so either 1 or 2 EM’s.

Now, contrast this to a Monday AM Mass I went to @ my mom’s church. There were perhaps 30 in attendence, priest, deacon, and Lector/EM.

When it came to communion, the deacon took the chalice and the EM took the ciborium (sp)! The priest sat down. Sorry, you did not need an EM there and I keep wondering why both forms?

 

[water]

I will have to go there.

If you could, that would be great. But I warn you, people do hold hands here during Our Father prayer, I don’t.

The number of parishioners is not what impresses me, but the anthusiasm and amount of volunteer works being dedicated to the parish is what motivates me.

 

[water]

If you have 1,200 at a Mass with 1 priest (or 2) and 1 deacon, I think you’d need at least 4 communion stations, so either 1 or 2 EM’s.

Now, contrast this to a Monday AM Mass I went to @ my mom’s church. There were perhaps 30 in attendence, priest, deacon, and Lector/EM.

When it came to communion, the deacon took the chalice and the EM took the ciborium (sp)! The priest sat down. Sorry, you did not need an EM there and I keep wondering why both forms?

It will blow you and folks here away if I say the number of EMHC.

Including 1 priest and 1 deacon: ~11 for chalices, and 11 for ciborium. So, average is above 20 people for the Communion.

 

[jediliz]

My sister’s parish in the Omaha Archdiocese isn’t a TLM parish, but they overuse EMHC’s. They do have 5 permanent deacons available, but only one is ever used at the Masses I have been to. They have at least two priests (the pastor and an assistant) and then a part time assistant that’s I can’t remember what order - he has a beard and might be a franciscan. (They don’t have two priests at Mass, though) I have outright refused to receive from any EMHC the last two times I attended Mass while visiting them. I dragged my niece with me to the priest’s line, accidentally cutting in to get into the line. She’s having her first communion come April 2008 and I fear she won’t understand the wine is not necessary (they offer both, I have never taken the Wine, I knew the species are present in both, I don’t need both). My brother in law converted 8 years ago, and he takes the wine even though I have told him he doesn’t need to.

I also have noticed that the priests rarely give communion in the mouth unless you practically have to open your mouth wide to receive I don’t receive in the hand, and one time I had to go to an EMHC that was shorter than me and I had to lean down to receive in the mouth. They also use altar girls, and the altar servers (neither of the two - uuually a boy and a girl) never assist at communion time with the palent or whatever the thing is called…they also never ring bells during the Consecretion.

I can understand the use of EMHC’s for shutins, as my paternal grandmother, God rest her soul, received communion from one (or he might have been an acolyte) daily when she was home bound.

My mom told me the next time I go to Mass there, just don’t go to Communion if I don’t want to receive from a non priest.

My brother in law pointed out that their parish is large (over 1000 families, maybe he said more than that, can’t recall) but I don’t think that’s a good excuse not to use the assistant pastor plus at least a second permanent deacon at Mass.

 

[water]

My mom told me the next time I go to Mass there, just don’t go to Communion if I don’t want to receive from a non priest.

Would you do what your mom suggests?

 

[Joannm]

Would you do what your mom suggests?

Why would anyone refuse to receive our Lord just because who is distributing it? The Eucharist is the Eucharist no matter who distributes it. To not receive in such a situation is making a political statement and has no place in the celebration of the Eucharist.

 

[water]

The Eucharist is the Eucharist no matter who distributes it.

 

[universalindult]

Including 1 priest and 1 deacon: ~11 for chalices, and 11 for ciborium. So, average is above 20 people for the Communion.

There is simply no justification whatsoever for that kind of liturgical abuse, given the guidelines that started this thread.

 

[water]

There is simply no justification whatsoever for that kind of liturgical abuse, given the guidelines that started this thread.

How many do you think they should have so that there will be no abuses?

 

[Brenda_V]

So you guys have 1000 to 12000 per mass at each of 6 Sunday Masses huh??

Where do you guys come up with this stuff?

tell you what, PM me the name of this extraordinary parish and I will go there this Sunday. I’ve got to see this place:thumbsup:

Palmas, I did PM you with my Parish - we only have a maximum of 5 EMHC’s at any given Sunday/Holy Day Mass though because of the large number of people at my Parish we do not offer the Cup as per the GIRM I believe (if there are too many people you don’t offer the Precious Blood).

How many do you think they should have so that there will be no abuses?

Water - for the most part your Parish sounds like mine except that on Sunday’s we do not offer the Cup because of the large number of people. Like your Parish also, we have a fair number of people who come but are not registered. I never remember the numbers when I have been given them as to how many registered families there are but I do know we are the largest Parish in the Archdiocese.

Some hold hands but not all - I am among the non-hand holders and was totally taken aback recently when I went to the Immaculate Conception Mass and this lady moved over, and tried to take my hand (they were folded down in front of me and my eyes were closed), I had to shake my head for her to stop trying, then when it came to the sign of peace she wouldn’t even look at me! Pray for her, she may have been lonely and just didn’t get it, I wasn’t rejecting her, just the action!

Brenda V.

 

[water]

Some hold hands but not all - I am among the non-hand holders and was totally taken aback recently when I went to the Immaculate Conception Mass and this lady moved over, and tried to take my hand (they were folded down in front of me and my eyes were closed), I had to shake my head for her to stop trying, then when it came to the sign of peace she wouldn’t even look at me! Pray for her, she may have been lonely and just didn’t get it, I wasn’t rejecting her, just the action!

Brenda V.

Brenda, I hope you have a website for your parish. Could you pm me for that? our parish just built the website and we need new ideas especially on the designing part. We have yet found a web designer. Thanks!

About holding hands. I used not to think of it; I didn’t care much about it until I came to this very forum. What happened next is that I got bothered when came to “Our Father” prayer because I’ve become aware of what people are doing. Now, when praying I just close my eyes and ask God to help me focus on praying instead of what others are doing. I am not trying to avoid the problem or abuses, I am trying not to let this thing defeat the purpose of what I come to mass for. It isn’t nice when you allow yourself to be bothered.

 

[jediliz]

Why would anyone refuse to receive our Lord just because who is distributing it? The Eucharist is the Eucharist no matter who distributes it. To not receive in such a situation is making a political statement and has no place in the celebration of the Eucharist.

I would rather receive from a priest, who is ordained or a permanent deacon, than from a lay woman or a lay man that automatically assumes I want to receive in the hand.

My own parish in the Lincoln diocese is much smaller than my sister’s parish, and we have at least two priests giving communion to the Faithful. Then we have an acolyte that gives communion to the choir and then takes whoever is in the pews at the adoration station area. I receive from a priest when I receive communion and I don’t have to worry about being forced to go to an EMHC.