R
Rand_Al_Thor
Guest
Peace be with you!
I read over a little of the thread on the Rosary, and I thought I’d give a detailed explanation of the Hail Mary prayer for our Protestant brothers and sisters here. I’d like some responses from them after reading this.
“Hail, Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee: blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus.”
*Like a Protestant poster in the other thread said, Protestants should not have a problem with this first part because, except for the addition of the names of Mary and Jesus, it is word-for-word straight from the Gospel of Luke.
“Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death. Amen.”
*I understand that this is the part that our Protestant brothers and sisters take issue with. I’m sorry to disappoint you, but this is straight out of Scripture as well. The word “saint”, which refers to all those in Heaven (and also the saints on earth) means “holy”. In Latin saints are referred to as “sancte” or “sancta”, which is literally translated as “holy”. When this translation comes to English, it is usually translated as “saint” when referring to a person. Mary is a saint, therefore she can legitimately be called holy because she has been glorified and is now in Heaven with God.
**Elizabeth calls Mary “the mother of [her] Lord” in Luke chapter one. John the Baptist recognized her as such when he leapt in his mother’s womb, which is what prompted Elizabeth to make that comment. Mary is biologically the mother of Jesus. Jesus is God. Mary is biologically the mother of God. That doesn’t mean she gave him his divinity; it simply means that she was Jesus’ mother. She didn’t give him his divinity, but she did give him his humanity. If Jesus didn’t need a mother, then he wasn’t truly fully man; only fully God. I don’t know of a Protestant who would make this claim; it is heresy and any good Protestant would rightly name it as such.
***I challenge any Protestant to show me a passage in the Bible where it says that those in Heaven cannot pray for us. I refer you to Revelation chapter 5. To pray means to ask (ex. I pray thee help me"). The saints are shown in Rev. 5 before the throne of God offering up their prayers. If praying is asking, then what could these saints be asking for? In Heaven we have want of nothing for ourselves–we will have been glorified and will be with God for all time. The only thing anyone there would be asking for would be to pass on the prayers of the saints on earth.
I’ve never gotten a clear answer to this question from any Protestant–if we can ask people on earth to pray for us, then why in the world can’t we ask someone in Heaven to pray for us, someone who is eternally in God’s presence??? Asking someone to pray for us cannot seriously be considered worship…to even entertain that thought is complete ridiculousness. Am I worshipping my friends at church when I ask them to pray for me? Certainly not! It is EXACLTY the same as asking a saint to pray for us. Let’s face it, we’re sinners and we need as much help as we can get. I’m sure that every one of my Protestant brothers and sisters will agree with me on that one! So what will help the most, only asking a couple of friends to pray for us, or asking all the saints and choirs of angels in Heaven–who are eternally in Our Lord’s presence–to pray for us? After all, James tells us, in Scripture, that “the prayers of a righteous man availeth much.” And all those in Heaven are certainly righteous, or else they wouldn’t be there!
In Christ,
Rand
I read over a little of the thread on the Rosary, and I thought I’d give a detailed explanation of the Hail Mary prayer for our Protestant brothers and sisters here. I’d like some responses from them after reading this.
“Hail, Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee: blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus.”
*Like a Protestant poster in the other thread said, Protestants should not have a problem with this first part because, except for the addition of the names of Mary and Jesus, it is word-for-word straight from the Gospel of Luke.
“Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death. Amen.”
*I understand that this is the part that our Protestant brothers and sisters take issue with. I’m sorry to disappoint you, but this is straight out of Scripture as well. The word “saint”, which refers to all those in Heaven (and also the saints on earth) means “holy”. In Latin saints are referred to as “sancte” or “sancta”, which is literally translated as “holy”. When this translation comes to English, it is usually translated as “saint” when referring to a person. Mary is a saint, therefore she can legitimately be called holy because she has been glorified and is now in Heaven with God.
**Elizabeth calls Mary “the mother of [her] Lord” in Luke chapter one. John the Baptist recognized her as such when he leapt in his mother’s womb, which is what prompted Elizabeth to make that comment. Mary is biologically the mother of Jesus. Jesus is God. Mary is biologically the mother of God. That doesn’t mean she gave him his divinity; it simply means that she was Jesus’ mother. She didn’t give him his divinity, but she did give him his humanity. If Jesus didn’t need a mother, then he wasn’t truly fully man; only fully God. I don’t know of a Protestant who would make this claim; it is heresy and any good Protestant would rightly name it as such.
***I challenge any Protestant to show me a passage in the Bible where it says that those in Heaven cannot pray for us. I refer you to Revelation chapter 5. To pray means to ask (ex. I pray thee help me"). The saints are shown in Rev. 5 before the throne of God offering up their prayers. If praying is asking, then what could these saints be asking for? In Heaven we have want of nothing for ourselves–we will have been glorified and will be with God for all time. The only thing anyone there would be asking for would be to pass on the prayers of the saints on earth.
I’ve never gotten a clear answer to this question from any Protestant–if we can ask people on earth to pray for us, then why in the world can’t we ask someone in Heaven to pray for us, someone who is eternally in God’s presence??? Asking someone to pray for us cannot seriously be considered worship…to even entertain that thought is complete ridiculousness. Am I worshipping my friends at church when I ask them to pray for me? Certainly not! It is EXACLTY the same as asking a saint to pray for us. Let’s face it, we’re sinners and we need as much help as we can get. I’m sure that every one of my Protestant brothers and sisters will agree with me on that one! So what will help the most, only asking a couple of friends to pray for us, or asking all the saints and choirs of angels in Heaven–who are eternally in Our Lord’s presence–to pray for us? After all, James tells us, in Scripture, that “the prayers of a righteous man availeth much.” And all those in Heaven are certainly righteous, or else they wouldn’t be there!
In Christ,
Rand
