The horrible truth about euthenasia and organ donation/harvesting

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How can donation of organs be moral, if the donor has to be killed to remove the organs?

A friend of my family had a stroke recently. He had an operation to remove some presure in his brain, although he was awake prior to the operation, when he did not come out of his comma within 40 hours of the operation being completed, his doctor declared him “brain dead”–wink wink–sooooo legelly he no longer had any rights and could be taken off his ventilator at any time (in 22 states the doctor can remove “brain dead” patients from life support at their discretion). My friend was an organ donor, so the doctor and family agreed to allow him to continue living until they could harvest his organs for donation (since he wouldn’t need them anymore since he was dead…although they were still keeping him alive??? you figure it out)

I thought that the Catholic position was that death occured when your soul leaves your body…not when you are in a deep (possibly irreversible) coma??? But it was explained to me that once “real” death occurs the organs begin decompossing right away and the organs can’t be harvested, so doctors just take them while the patient is still alive…hence the invention of the term “brain death” in the late 60s. The organ donation is actually what kills the donors!!!

Of course if his brain was really dead, he could not have kept his blood pressure up, nor maintained his body temperature, so is “brain death” just another 1984/Brave New World medical term we’ve been sold.

Go figure!!!
 
oh I forgot to add that “brain dead” patients who are in comas have to be given anastetics as they are being sawed open in order for their organs to be removed…if they are actually dead (as they are legelly) then why the pain killers???
 
liberal friend:
oh I forgot to add that “brain dead” patients who are in comas have to be given anastetics as they are being sawed open in order for their organs to be removed…if they are actually dead (as they are legelly) then why the pain killers???
We are all doomed:nope: We are commodities:nope: :crying: :crying:
 
seems like the sortof thing Jimmy would answer if you emailed him at his blog
 
The fact that we are kept alive to harvest our organs is exactly why I am not an organ donor. It is paramount to murder on the doctor’s part to remove organs from a patient who is still alive.

The very fact that they must administer morphine and other analgesics to keep the brain dead patient from convulsing in pain is evidence enough that the soul is still in the body. Ultimately what kills every person is when the heart stops beating, not when the brain stops functioning.

There’s no more decisve way to kill a patient than to remove his heart!
 
wow…not many people interested in this topic…I wonder why–it seems like it is an important one we face now.

Of course when “brain death” was invented…uh…I mean discovered in 1968–it was a great thing for the pro-abortion folks…the notion that a person can be declared “legally dead” and can be denied all legal rights…it leads to R v. W in 1973.

It is way too materialiatic of us to look at life, in terms of perceived brain function instead of the soul.
 
I am proud to be a card carrying organ donor. When it’s time for me to go, my family knows what to do… If any of my stuff can help someone else, they are welcome to it…
 
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Bella3502:
I am proud to be a card carrying organ donor. When it’s time for me to go, my family knows what to do… If any of my stuff can help someone else, they are welcome to it…
Great…and when is it “time for you to go”? When you hear the saw starting up? In reality, the doctors decide when to “turn you off” (as if you were a machine)…most organ donors are not allowed to die naturally.…they die as their chest is opened up for their organs to be harvested. This may not be in the least bit troubling to you, but it causes many thoughtful people to pause, reflect, and pray on this issue.
 
liberal friend:
How can donation of organs be moral, if the donor has to be killed to remove the organs?

A friend of my family had a stroke recently. He had an operation to remove some presure in his brain, although he was awake prior to the operation, when he did not come out of his comma within 40 hours of the operation being completed, his doctor declared him “brain dead”–wink wink–sooooo legelly he no longer had any rights and could be taken off his ventilator at any time (in 22 states the doctor can remove “brain dead” patients from life support at their discretion). My friend was an organ donor, so the doctor and family agreed to allow him to continue living until they could harvest his organs for donation (since he wouldn’t need them anymore since he was dead…although they were still keeping him alive??? you figure it out)

I thought that the Catholic position was that death occured when your soul leaves your body…not when you are in a deep (possibly irreversible) coma??? But it was explained to me that once “real” death occurs the organs begin decompossing right away and the organs can’t be harvested, so doctors just take them while the patient is still alive…hence the invention of the term “brain death” in the late 60s. The organ donation is actually what kills the donors!!!

Of course if his brain was really dead, he could not have kept his blood pressure up, nor maintained his body temperature, so is “brain death” just another 1984/Brave New World medical term we’ve been sold.

Go figure!!!
I am sorry I don’t believe it is this way. My friends in the medical field say that the ventilator is turned off and the patient is allowed to die naturally, then declared dead. Only in the next moments after that are the organs harvested.
 
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Bella3502:
I am proud to be a card carrying organ donor. When it’s time for me to go, my family knows what to do… If any of my stuff can help someone else, they are welcome to it…
Thank you Bella. It’ll be a person like you that (I hope) will save my life someday! :bowdown2:
 
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paramedicgirl:
The fact that we are kept alive to harvest our organs is exactly why I am not an organ donor. It is paramount to murder on the doctor’s part to remove organs from a patient who is still alive.

The very fact that they must administer morphine and other analgesics to keep the brain dead patient from convulsing in pain is evidence enough that the soul is still in the body. Ultimately what kills every person is when the heart stops beating, not when the brain stops functioning.

There’s no more decisve way to kill a patient than to remove his heart!
I am not an organ donor, either. But, at age 66, I can’t imagine that anybody would want anything I have anyway. Especially if you are a cancer survivor.
 
My DW had a stroke eleven years ago and was declared brain dead the next day, but only after an EEG revealed absolutely no brain activity. Her body was kept functioning by machines other than just a ventilator and her organs were harvested on the second day. I, too, questioned why an anesthesiologist was needed if she was dead and got a lenghty explanation as to the reasons. I remember very little of the details, but do remember being told that the anesthesiologist does a lot more that just make the patient oblivious to pain.

I would respectfully suggest anyone having a problem with organ donation talk with a Catholic neurosurgeon and a Catholic anesthesioligist before making uninformed or misinformed statements about what occurs during the process.
 
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Bella3502:
I am proud to be a card carrying organ donor. When it’s time for me to go, my family knows what to do… If any of my stuff can help someone else, they are welcome to it…
I checked the box when I renewed my driver’s license. When I’m done using them, someone else is welcome to them.
 
Eileen T:
I have researched and written about Brain Death and Organ Harvesting for the website I am developing, www.life.org.nz
It covers topics that are of interest to everyone wherever they live.

life.org.nz/euthanasiakeyissuesbraindeath.htm
life.org.nz/euthanasiaethicalkeyissuesorganharvesting.htm

My website is 800-1000 pages and looks at Suicide, Abortion & Euthanasia. Next I will be developing Bioethical issues.
Hi Eileen T - I have pasted below part ot the article you posted on the Catholic Church’s stance on organ harvesting. I am unclear on whether the article says the CC approves of harvesting of unpaired vital organs. Are you able to clarify?
There are two types of organ transplantation that are acceptable to the Catholic Church:

Tissue, a paired organ (i.e. you have two of them like for example, a kidney is a paired organ) or Bone Marrow from a living person The tissue or organ must not be essential for the life or health of the donor such as two kidneys
Tissue after death e.g. the cornea, heart valves, skin, bone and connective tissue (tendon and ligaments)
Unpaired Vital Organs such as the heart or the liver after a declaration of brain death, must be harvested while the heart is beating; there is normal blood pressure and temperature; there are normal salt and water balances and many internal organs and systems are functioning to maintain the unity of the body.

During the hour it takes to remove a heart for transplant, the heart is still beating. Only a beating heart is acceptable for transplant. Such determination of brain death is based on absence of functioning of the brain. A measure of life is the continuing hypothalamic function which controls body temperature. If the patient is warm then that part of the brain is functioning.
 
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davy39:
I am not an organ donor, either. But, at age 66, I can’t imagine that anybody would want anything I have anyway. Especially if you are a cancer survivor.
I too am not a donor; I have never quite trusted them to do their best to save me if they are intent on harvesting organs.

By current standards, that makes me very selfish and non-politically correct, and I am greatly encouraged to read some of your comments here.

Respect for life, as God created it, would mean first of all respect for the life of the potential donor. “Quality of life” is not the issue; it is my life because God gave it to me.
 
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paulito:
I too am not a donor; I have never quite trusted them to do their best to save me if they are intent on harvesting organs.

By current standards, that makes me very selfish and non-politically correct, and I am greatly encouraged to read some of your comments here.

Respect for life, as God created it, would mean first of all respect for the life of the potential donor. “Quality of life” is not the issue; it is my life because God gave it to me.
I know a nurse who has to remain unnamed. She worked in the US during the nursing shortage of the 1980’s. She told me that organ harvesting of comatose transients was big business at one of the hospitals she worked at. :eek:
 
I remember my mother being appalled when I told her a few years ago that I wasn’t an organ donor. But I read a good deal about this subject and came to the conclusion that I didn’t want to be merely a bag of tricks for doctors not interested in doing everything possible to keep me alive if there is any possibility of survival.

She has since come around after witnessing this happen with a friend of hers.
 
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paramedicgirl:
The fact that we are kept alive to harvest our organs is exactly why I am not an organ donor. It is paramount to murder on the doctor’s part to remove organs from a patient who is still alive.

The very fact that they must administer morphine and other analgesics to keep the brain dead patient from convulsing in pain is evidence enough that the soul is still in the body. Ultimately what kills every person is when the heart stops beating, not when the brain stops functioning.
It is my understanding that pain meds are not given, but meds to paralyze the patient are given. Anesthesiologists administer these.
 
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