The Immaculate Conception, holiness, and free will

[FuzzyBunny116]

This will be difficult for me to word, but I’ll try my best.

If God does not have the ability to sin, why was it not imparted to us? If God does not have the ability to sin, doesn’t this inhibit His free will? How did the Immaculate Conception still let Mary retain free will if she was given so much grace (while having never approved of such grace) that she was to never commit a sin?

Do you see where I am getting at? How does grace and God’s inability to sin NOT inhibit man or God’s free will?

 

[Veritas41]

Maybe this article will help:

ic.net/%7Eerasmus/RAZ505.HTM

 

[johnnycatholic]

God does have the ability to choose evil but he doesn’t. This ability was passed onto us but was messed up by Adam and Eve. Mary had the ability to choose evil but didn’t.

 

[FuzzyBunny116]

God does have the ability to choose evil but he doesn’t. This ability was passed onto us but was messed up by Adam and Eve. Mary had the ability to choose evil but didn’t.

Vertias: I will read that response later, as it is lengthy.

JC: Would that mean it is POSSIBLE although highly unlikely that God is able to commit evil, then?

 

[Nebuchadnezzar]

Vertias: I will read that response later, as it is lengthy.

JC: Would that mean it is POSSIBLE although highly unlikely that God is able to commit evil, then?

God cannot commit evil given that he is perfect (infinitely Good). When he created Man we were perfect but in order for our love for him to be authentic he had to give us the ability of free will, Which of course Satan umderstood and helped Adam and Eve commit sin by trying to be God.At least I think that is it.

 

[mlcampbell]

This will be difficult for me to word, but I’ll try my best.

If God does not have the ability to sin, why was it not imparted to us? If God does not have the ability to sin, doesn’t this inhibit His free will? How did the Immaculate Conception still let Mary retain free will if she was given so much grace (while having never approved of such grace) that she was to never commit a sin?

Do you see where I am getting at? How does grace and God’s inability to sin NOT inhibit man or God’s free will?

I think that it’s also important to note that grace actually actualizes our freedom rather than impedes it. That’s what the doctrine of the Immaculate Conception is all about. Ratzinger, in God is Near Us, says this:

“Without the freely given assent of Mary, God cannot become man. Certainly, this Yes Mary says is wholly by grace. The dogma of the Immaculate Conception of Mary, whereby she was freed from original sin, has in fact just exactly this as its sole significance: that no human being can set in motion the process of salvation by his own powers alone, but that his Yes is wrapped around and supported within by that divine love…Grace does not remove freedom; rather, it brings it into being” (19-20).

 

[m134e5]

This will be difficult for me to word, but I’ll try my best.

If God does not have the ability to sin, why was it not imparted to us? If God does not have the ability to sin, doesn’t this inhibit His free will? How did the Immaculate Conception still let Mary retain free will if she was given so much grace (while having never approved of such grace) that she was to never commit a sin?

Do you see where I am getting at? How does grace and God’s inability to sin NOT inhibit man or God’s free will?

A sin is something that offends God. I suppose since God is all-powerful, He could if He wanted- but God is also all good (with goodness comes responsibility- so God is all responsible as well), so there’s no way He would. You can cuss yourself out as much as you want- though it may bring down your self-esteem, you probably won’t offend yourself unless there is something wrong with you.

 

[mlcampbell]

Just thinking about this a bit–if goodness (i.e. not sinning)means obeying the will of God, and if God is the source of all good (is in fact, the Good), then, if God were to sin, wouldn’t He contradicting Himself? I would say then that it’s impossible for God to sin.

 

[thistle]

Just thinking about this a bit–if goodness (i.e. not sinning)means obeying the will of God, and if God is the source of all good (is in fact, the Good), then, if God were to sin, wouldn’t He contradicting Himself? I would say then that it’s impossible for God to sin.

Yes its impossible for God to sin.

 

[FuzzyBunny116]

So could an answer to the question, simply put, be God could DESIRE to sin, thus he has free will, but to sin is to go against and to have an ABSENCE of God, so by His very defintion God CANNOT sin?

 

[mlcampbell]

So could an answer to the question, simply put, be God could DESIRE to sin, thus he has free will, but to sin is to go against and to have an ABSENCE of God, so by His very defintion God CANNOT sin?

Well, God doesn’t ever “desire” to sin. The desire to sin only exists in human beings. There’s actually another thread on here that discusses just exactly what we’re all talking about here. Check it out. It’s pretty cool.

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=125149

 

[Ghosty]

God’s Goodness is the same as His Power is the same as His Will is the same as His Holiness, ect. Everything we call a “trait” of God is one in Him, a single unified principle of all Divinity. It is impossible for God to sin because God’s Will and His Goodness are the same thing.

This isn’t a limit on God’s freedom, however, because sin is simply the falling short of doing good. In other words, sin is something lacking, not something that exists on its own. When we sin it’s because we do something less than the goodness we can do, and since God is omnipotent and good, He can always do the full goodness He can do. It is sinners who lack the fullness free will and power, not people who only do good, because sin is failing to do what we can.

Mary could have sinned, but she was given such a surplus of Grace that she had no compulsion to. Her will was still her own, however, just as Adam and Eve’s were. Rather than limiting her freedom, the Grace she received removed all limits on it. She was completely free to choose good in a way that most people are not, because she wasn’t weighed down by the emptiness of Original Sin. She was also free to choose evil, and any evil she chose would have been among the most extreme evils possible, possibly surpassing that of the fallen angels, because she was the recipient of such Grace as to give her no “excuse” for any evil action, even the most minor.

Peace and God bless!

 

[mlchance]

It’s mind-boggling that some folks think that one can only be truly free if one is able to do something evil.

– Mark L. Chance.

 

[FuzzyBunny116]

It’s mind-boggling that some folks think that one can only be truly free if one is able to do something evil.

– Mark L. Chance.

Then if someone is tainted by having Original sin, thus they have a tendency to sin, does that inhibit their free will?

 

[Ghosty]

Then if someone is tainted by having Original sin, thus they have a tendency to sin, does that inhibit their free will?

In a certain sense, yes. Not in any absolute way, but it does impede it in the way that an incline impedes easy movement. It isn’t enough to take away free will, nor to make someone not culpable for their actions, but it certainly makes the free exercise of good harder. This is one reason why Mary’s sinlessness is viewed in the West as being part and parcel with her making a truly free choice.

Peace and God bless!