The Immoral The Sanctity of Human Life Act

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mercytruth

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H.R. 212, The Sanctity of Human Life Act as passed by the Republican House in 2011 and supported by Rep.Akin and Rep.Ryan would be an immoral amendment to the U.S. Constitution. Why? In effect, as now written, it would legalize the cloning of human embryos. I urge you to write to your Congressman who supported this bill to strike the cloning portion out of the bill, along with any fertilization methods that would use genetic engineering. We don’t need any more Joseph Mengeles.

SEC. 2. DECLARATION.
In the exercise of the powers of the Congress, including Congress’ power under article I, section 8 of the Constitution, to make necessary and proper laws, and Congress’ power under section 5 of the 14th article of amendment to the Constitution of the United States–

(1) the Congress declares that–

(A) the right to life guaranteed by the Constitution is vested in each human being, and is the paramount and most fundamental right of a person; and

(B) the life of each human being begins with fertilization, cloning, or its functional equivalent, irrespective of sex, health, function or disability, defect, stage of biological development, or condition of dependency, at which time every human being shall have all the legal and constitutional attributes and privileges of personhood; and

opencongress.org/bill/112-h212/text

God’s peace

micah
 
As I read this, this law does not legalize cloning of humans, it simply states that fi a human is cloned, then all the cloned embryos are de-facto people and immediately have all the human rights of persons however they came to exist.
 
anruari said:
As I read this, this law does not legalize cloning of humans, it simply states that fi a human is cloned, then all the cloned embryos are de-facto people and immediately have all the human rights of persons however they came to exist.
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This is correct.
 
anruari said:
As I read this, this law does not legalize cloning of humans, it simply states that fi a human is cloned, then all the cloned embryos are de-facto people and immediately have all the human rights of persons however they came to exist.
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Since there is no Federal law against the cloning of human embryos or the genetic modification of human embryos, this bill if introduced as an amendment to the US Constitution would in effect legalize the cloning of human embryos. This is a very poorly written bill and I urge you to write Congressman Ryan to have him strike this portion of the bill from the record. It is contrary to Catholic teaching which absolutely forbids human cloning.

God’s peace

micah
 
mercytruth said:
Since there is no Federal law against the cloning of human embryos or the genetic modification of human embryos, this bill if introduced as an amendment to the US Constitution would in effect legalize the cloning of human embryos. This is a very poorly written bill and I urge you to write Congressman Ryan to have him strike this portion of the bill from the record. It is contrary to Catholic teaching which absolutely forbids human cloning.

God’s peace

micah
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It’s better to leave it in there. Since there is no prohibition on cloning, then a cloned human being would not have any legal protection or rights under the law without this. It might not be a problem today but it could be 30 years from now.
 
Bill_Martin said:
It’s better to leave it in there. Since there is no prohibition on cloning, then a cloned human being would not have any legal protection or rights under the law without this. It might not be a problem today but it could be 30 years from now.
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My God, don’t you realize that a cloned ‘human’ or a genetically modified ‘human’ is not a human being? It is like the days of Noah, when the fallen angels had relations with female humans and created giants.

Our Congressmen should be spend time enacting a bi-partisan bill that would federally outlaw human cloning and the genetic alteration of the human species. Already in England this year scientists have created human embryos in the lab.

Now is the time to urge our Congress and Senate to outlaw human cloning and human genetic engineering before it is too late. Waiting until disaster and God’s judgment strikes is foolish.

God’s peace

micah
 
Just thinking, it’s against church teaching to use IVF, would we want to make sure that is not part of this law also? I think I agree with Bill, better to leave it there, in case future children need it for protection. I would like to see laws that prohibit cloning of humans, and if this law would complicate things I can see your concern. I personally don’t see how it would.
 
neophyte said:
On what grounds do you make such a claim?
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Because we are created in the image and likeness of God and by God with our own unique attributes.

Not by mad scientists who want to clone a super human soldier for the Defense Dept. or for some madly concocted half human-half animal that we see in Greek mythology.

Please,write your Congressman to oulaw human cloning and genetic engineering of the human being in order to avoid all this. Already in England they have cloned human embryos in the lab. Time is running out.

God’s peace

micah
 
mercytruth said:
My God, don’t you realize that a cloned ‘human’ or a genetically modified ‘human’ is not a human being? It is like the days of Noah, when the fallen angels had relations with female humans and created giants.
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What. No, really. What. Or for a little more force on that –WHAT!?! Are you seriously arguing that a clone would not have a soul and is not a human person?!? Yes, the church teaches against cloning (although, and hopefully someone with more bioethics under his or her belt can help me out here and correct me if I’m wrong, that’s IIRC because it’s bound up in in-vitro fertilization, which does not allow for the child to be created in an act of unitive love, not for the cloning itself), but the clone would still be a living, breathing human with an eternal soul, just as an IVF baby/“test tube baby” is.

By your lights, though, we SHOULD be able to kill clones. Unfortunate implications much?
 
Pat_Payne said:
What. No, really. What. Or for a little more force on that –WHAT!?! Are you seriously arguing that a clone would not have a soul and is not a human person?!? Yes, the church teaches against cloning (although, and hopefully someone with more bioethics under his or her belt can help me out here and correct me if I’m wrong, that’s IIRC because it’s bound up in in-vitro fertilization, which does not allow for the child to be created in an act of unitive love, not for the cloning itself), but the clone would still be a living, breathing human with an eternal soul, just as an IVF baby/“test tube baby” is.

By your lights, though, we SHOULD be able to kill clones. Unfortunate implications much?
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As I have already stated several times, I believe that we are indeed created in the image and likeness of God with unique attributes.

A cloned human being would not have unique attributes. A half man half animal would not be a human being. If we allow protection of such ‘creatures’ we are opening a pandora’s box of unimaginable proportions. Satan desires to be like God in every way, he desires to create beings that are in conflict with God’s creation. Just as it was in the days of Noah when there were giants in the earth.

All of this can be avoided. There is nothing to stop Congress from passing a bi-partisan Federal bill that would outlaw human cloning and the genetic alteration of human beings.

Please contact your congressmen fo enact such a bill. This year, England cloned human embryos in the lab. Time is running out.

God’s peace

micah
 
mercytruth said:
As I have already stated several times, I believe that we are indeed created in the image and likeness of God with unique attributes.

A cloned human being would not have unique attributes. A half man half animal would not be a human being. If we allow protection of such ‘creatures’ we are opening a pandora’s box of unimaginable proportions. Satan desires to be like God in every way, he desires to create beings that are in conflict with God’s creation. Just as it was in the days of Noah when there were giants in the earth.

All of this can be avoided. There is nothing to stop Congress from passing a bi-partisan Federal bill that would outlaw human cloning and the genetic alteration of human beings.

Please contact your congressmen fo enact such a bill. This year, England cloned human embryos in the lab. Time is running out.

God’s peace

micah
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My argument against that is similar to my argument against being able to abort children conceived by rape. The child does not have control over how they are conceived, and should therefore not be punished for the sins of their father/mother.

It would be immoral to punish the clone because he had no hand in its own conception and development.
 
ProdglArchitect said:
My argument against that is similar to my argument against being able to abort children conceived by rape. The child does not have control over how they are conceived, and should therefore not be punished for the sins of their father/mother.

It would be immoral to punish the clone because he had no hand in its own conception and development.
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So if a Josef Mengele type forcibly (name removed by moderator)lanted a cloned embryo, or genetically altered human clone into a woman you would advocate that she give birth to something created by a mad scientist, and not by God himself?

God’s peace

micah
 
Congratulations. You just dropped the Godwin bomb. Thank you for playing, have a copy of our home game.

To more clearly answer your question – Even if that scenario were to happen (and quite honestly, it all sounds like like something ripped fromt he pages of a cheap pulp magazine of the '30s…), IT. IS. NOT. THE. CHILD’S. FAULT. This is not creating Frankenstein’s Monster, but an infant who still needs to be loved and cared for.
 
It amazes me how many people will defend what is clearly immoral, that is the cloning or genetic alteration of a human being. It would be so simple to remove that portion from the The Human Sanctity of Life Act H.R.212.

It would be so simple for Congress to pass a non-partisan Federal bill outlawing human cloning and the genetic alteration of a human being. Why in God’s name do Catholics on this thread keep defending the status quo? What is the matter with you? Has your partisan politics blinded you that much? Can you not admit that this was a poorly written bill?

God’s peace

micha.
 
mercytruth said:
It amazes me how many people will defend what is clearly immoral, that is the cloning or genetic alteration of a human being. It would be so simple to remove that portion from the The Human Sanctity of Life Act H.R.212.

It would be so simple for Congress to pass a non-partisan Federal bill outlawing human cloning and the genetic alteration of a human being. Why in God’s name do Catholics on this thread keep defending the status quo? What is the matter with you? Has your partisan politics blinded you that much? Can you not admit that this was a poorly written bill?

God’s peace

micha.
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Nobody here is defending cloning.
 
Bill_Martin said:
Nobody here is defending cloning.
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You are as long as you defend this bill as it is now written. Once again, there is no federal law against human cloning. If ever this bill was enacted it would effectively legalize embryonic cloning by its defense of cloned embryos.

God’s peace

micah
 
When YOU, hermano, go throwing around the words “non-human” and spin wild tales of wierd science (“Dr. Mengele implanting genetically-modified fetuses into women against their will” indeed…) expect pushback. If you wanted to open a debate about whether cloning and IVF should be allowed and not started to declare the products of said processes as not human, you might have received a better response.

Oh, and by the way, I’m not Republican. I’m not Democrat. I belong to no party. I’m just not going to sit idly by and let someone start sling the word “non-human” around like confetti.
 
mercytruth said:
You are as long as you defend this bill as it is now written. Once again, there is no federal law against human cloning. If ever this bill was enacted it would effectively legalize embryonic cloning by its defense of cloned embryos.

God’s peace

micah
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This is no different than saying that children conceived and born due to rape have all the rights and protections of any other child.

It does not condone rape.

It does not legalize rape.

It just ensures that the child’s life is protected. Same thing here.
 
Pat_Payne said:
When YOU, muchacho, go throwing around the words “non-human” and spin wild tales of wierd science (“Dr. Mengele implanting genetically-modified fetuses into women against their will” indeed…) expect pushback. If you wanted to open a debate about whether cloning and IVF should have been allowed and not started to declare the products of said processes as not human, you might have received a better response.

Oh, and by the way, I’m not Republican. I’m not Democrat. I belong to no party. I’m just not going to sit idly by and let someone start sling the word “non-human” around like confetti.
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Anything is possible when mad scientists are given a free reign to do what their demonically inspired hearts are set out to do. There are scientists out there who have no qualms about creating human chimeras. This is not weird science anymore. England has created human embryos in the lab.

Now if you can prove to me that humans who were to be cloned, or who have been genetically altered are indeed creations of God, and not creatures from the labs of science, please do explain.

We should avoid any possibility of ever having to come to this decision. If it takes extreme examples of what **could happen ** and to wake people up to get their Congressman to expunge this portion of the bill, or to ban cloning and genetic alteration of the human being I will not hesitate. We live in dark times and the devil is in the details.

God’s peace

micah
 
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