T
TriuneUnity
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From the Apology of the Augsburg Confession…The point raised here will be bolded…
"Besides, we also grant that the angels pray for us. For there is a testimony in Zech. 1:12, where an angel prays: O Lord of hosts, how long wilt Thou not have mercy on 9] Jerusalem? Although concerning the saints we concede that, just as, when alive, they pray for the Church universal in general, so in heaven they pray for the Church in general, albeit no testimony concerning the praying of the dead is extant in the Scriptures, except the dream taken from the Second Book of Maccabees, 15:14.
The place to look for this in Scripture is actually 1 Cor. 12:26: “If one member suffers, all suffer together.” This does not exclude the glorified in heaven, for even our Lord in His risen glory could say to Saul: “why are you persecuting ME?” To touch His holy Church was to touch Him. Thus, I’d argue, the body as a whole experiences the suffering of the individual member and cries out in intercession. How beautifully did Luther put this in his sermon on John XVII:
“For to everyone who believe, through the word of the Apostles, the promise is given for Christ’s sake and by the power of this prayer, that he shall be one body and one loaf with all Christians; that what happens to him as a member for good or ill, shall happen to the whole body for good or ill, and not only one or two saints, but all the prophets, martyrs, apostles, all Christians, both on earth, and with God in heaven, shall suffer and conquer with him, shall fight for him, help, protect, and save him, and shall undertake for him such a gracious exchange that they will all bear his sufferings, want, and afflictions and he partake of all their blessings, comfort, and joy…For who can harm or injure a man who has this confidence, who knows that heaven and earth, and all the angels and the saints will cry to God when the smallest suffering befalls him?”
The emphasis on “in general” I think is due to this: here on earth, we pray especially for those we know and have been bound to by ties of affection; yet the state of the blessed dead is already perfected in love, so that their love for each is as great as their love for any particular human being. This would certainly be reflected in their intercessions so that their prayers would, of that very reality, be general without ceasing to be highly personal.
“Then I will know fully…” and knowing Him fully embraces knowing Him in “the least of these” fully. One body, one loaf.
Lutherans do not advocate praying to the victorious saints even though we affirm that they pray for us even as they did on this side of the grave. The Christian view of death is indeed at odds with reason that teaches us that death robs a person of all personal interaction. But God’s Word trumps reason: e.g. Matt 22:32 & Luke 19:31.
It isn’t the Lutheran, but the Protestant, that tosses out the baby with the non-baptismal water. We can (and do!) confess that the saints intercede for us, while refraining from praying to them and turning them into a pantheon that caused so much trouble in the pre-reformation church. It is not an either/or, but a both/and.
Nor are Lutherans at liberty to cut out or ignore parts of our Book of Concord that would make Reformed or Baptist Christians uncomfortable. Just as I take comfort knowing that people pray for me here on earth, it also comforts me knowing those who have won the victory in Christ pray for me as well. We are one church. How the prayers of the saints, literally the “holy ones” (here and there) effect my existence is a mystery - but we do know that the prayer of a “righteous person has great power as it is working” (Jas 5:16).
That biblical confession of the power of Christian prayer also defies reason.
"Besides, we also grant that the angels pray for us. For there is a testimony in Zech. 1:12, where an angel prays: O Lord of hosts, how long wilt Thou not have mercy on 9] Jerusalem? Although concerning the saints we concede that, just as, when alive, they pray for the Church universal in general, so in heaven they pray for the Church in general, albeit no testimony concerning the praying of the dead is extant in the Scriptures, except the dream taken from the Second Book of Maccabees, 15:14.
The place to look for this in Scripture is actually 1 Cor. 12:26: “If one member suffers, all suffer together.” This does not exclude the glorified in heaven, for even our Lord in His risen glory could say to Saul: “why are you persecuting ME?” To touch His holy Church was to touch Him. Thus, I’d argue, the body as a whole experiences the suffering of the individual member and cries out in intercession. How beautifully did Luther put this in his sermon on John XVII:
“For to everyone who believe, through the word of the Apostles, the promise is given for Christ’s sake and by the power of this prayer, that he shall be one body and one loaf with all Christians; that what happens to him as a member for good or ill, shall happen to the whole body for good or ill, and not only one or two saints, but all the prophets, martyrs, apostles, all Christians, both on earth, and with God in heaven, shall suffer and conquer with him, shall fight for him, help, protect, and save him, and shall undertake for him such a gracious exchange that they will all bear his sufferings, want, and afflictions and he partake of all their blessings, comfort, and joy…For who can harm or injure a man who has this confidence, who knows that heaven and earth, and all the angels and the saints will cry to God when the smallest suffering befalls him?”
The emphasis on “in general” I think is due to this: here on earth, we pray especially for those we know and have been bound to by ties of affection; yet the state of the blessed dead is already perfected in love, so that their love for each is as great as their love for any particular human being. This would certainly be reflected in their intercessions so that their prayers would, of that very reality, be general without ceasing to be highly personal.
“Then I will know fully…” and knowing Him fully embraces knowing Him in “the least of these” fully. One body, one loaf.
Lutherans do not advocate praying to the victorious saints even though we affirm that they pray for us even as they did on this side of the grave. The Christian view of death is indeed at odds with reason that teaches us that death robs a person of all personal interaction. But God’s Word trumps reason: e.g. Matt 22:32 & Luke 19:31.
It isn’t the Lutheran, but the Protestant, that tosses out the baby with the non-baptismal water. We can (and do!) confess that the saints intercede for us, while refraining from praying to them and turning them into a pantheon that caused so much trouble in the pre-reformation church. It is not an either/or, but a both/and.
Nor are Lutherans at liberty to cut out or ignore parts of our Book of Concord that would make Reformed or Baptist Christians uncomfortable. Just as I take comfort knowing that people pray for me here on earth, it also comforts me knowing those who have won the victory in Christ pray for me as well. We are one church. How the prayers of the saints, literally the “holy ones” (here and there) effect my existence is a mystery - but we do know that the prayer of a “righteous person has great power as it is working” (Jas 5:16).
That biblical confession of the power of Christian prayer also defies reason.