The Jesus Prayer

[paul11b]

So I just have a question about the Eastern devotion of praying the Jesus Prayer on a prayer rope similar to the way we pray on a rosary. I love the Jesus prayer and I say it a lot because I feel that it empowers me to resist temptaion. My question is this, since I am a Roman Catholic, is it wrong for me to get an Orthodox Prayer rope to pray the Jesus Prayer on?

 

[Little_One0307]

So I just have a question about the Eastern devotion of praying the Jesus Prayer on a prayer rope similar to the way we pray on a rosary. I love the Jesus prayer and I say it a lot because I feel that it empowers me to resist temptaion. My question is this, since I am a Roman Catholic, is it wrong for me to get an Orthodox Prayer rope to pray the Jesus Prayer on?

Paul,

Oh no it is not wrong. There are many good things in the Eastern Church devotions. Many. I pray with a chotki with the Jesus prayer and with the blessings of my SD. He is a Roman Catholic Priest but he appreciates and has opened up to me the wonderful saints and practices of the Easter Church. In fact he gave me the chotki * and I make use of it frequently.

So rest assured, you are doing no wrong.

God bless.*

 

[paul11b]

Thank you very much. I also have another question that I just thought of that someone may be able to answer for me. I have been feeling very drawn to the Eastern Catholic Rites latley. I was wondering if there was a way to officially become Byzantine Catholic or if I could just start going to Byzantine Liturgy. Also, I pray the morning and evening prayer of the Liturgy of the hours everyday and is this something that is regularly practiced in the Eastern Rite or is it more of a Latin thing? If I become Byzantine Cathoilc can I still attend Roman Mass regularly since there is only Byzantine Liturgy on Sunday around me and I like to try to go to Mass on days during the week if I can? Also, are there any Byzantine Catholic religious orders for lay people like Opus Dei, the Third Order Franciscans or anyhting like that?

 

[Phillip_Rolfes]

To the O.P.

If you are interested in an Eastern prayer rope/chotki/vervitsa/komvoskini (they’re all the same thing) that is made by a Catholic, I make and sell them. I would be happy to provide you with a 33, 50, or 100 knot rope. If you’d like to send me a message I’ll let you know my prices.

As for your second question, don’t consider becoming an Eastern Catholic unless you’ve been attending the Divine Liturgy regularly for about two years. If you haven’t been most bishops will not take your intention to switch seriously. The more you attend an Eastern Catholic parish, the more you will realize that we are very VERY different from Roman Catholicism in liturgy, theology, spirituality, mentality, etc. So attend a parish for a good period of time first, get used to us, see if you are comfortable being with us and feel more at home with us than where you currently find yourself. There is no need to switch sui iuris Church to attend the liturgies of another Catholic Church.

If you do eventually become and Eastern Catholic, you could still pray the Roman Liturgy of the Hours and even attend daily Mass at a Roman Church (most Byzantine parishes do not have daily Liturgy). I would ask why you plan on switching if you wish to continue these practices, however. The East does have its own Liturgy of the Hours, but it is never celebrated privately. One may pray excerpts of it privately, but the Hours as a whole usually are only celebrated by the parish gathered together. If you’d like to get a taste of what our Liturgy of the Hours looks like, I’d recommend checking out an Horologion from Sophia Press available from the Melkite Greek Catholic Eparchy of Newton - www.melkite.org . This, however, will only give you a rough idea because it consists only of the “fixed” parts of the Liturgy of the Hours and not the variable parts taken from the books for the feast of the day, or for the Tone of the week, etc.

One way or another I wish you the best of luck. As one who has made the journey from West to East I can tell you that it is a very rewarding one, although it does force one to broaden one’s perspective on the Church.

ICXC + NIKA,
Phillip

 

[Wesley7]

There’s a book The Jesus Prayer by a Monk of the Eastern Church. . .

archangelsbooks.com/proddetail.asp?prod=SVSMONKEC-01 . .

 

[Aramis]

One comment on the liturgy of the hours: in the Byzantine use, there are (depending upon which Church Sui Iuris or Autocephalous church) between 2 and 4 forms of each hour.

All have a priest lead form.
Almost all have a communal layman-lead form.
Some (especially Ruthenian Recension) have deacon-lead forms.
Some have a private form which is excerpted.

At present, the Ruthenian church has one approved form (priest lead), and two experimental forms (lay reader lead and deacon lead) approved for public use. Instructions for private use by layity of the hours are the same as the reader lead form, but some churches’ private form is instead multiple recitations of the chotki.

 

[Cecilianus]

To the O.P.: My chotki was bought at an Orthodox book store. You are supposed to have the blessing of your spiritual director before you start praying it, however, which is usually not a problem. The book “The Jesus Prayer” by Fr. Gillet (A Monk of the Eastern Church) is a good one; I recommend “The Prayer of Jesus” by St. Ignaty Brianchaninov.

 

[Rolltide]

The great thing about the Catholic Church is that it is inclusive of many rites. There is no reason that you cannot remain in the Roman rite and also practice Eastern Catholic traditions as well. You can even regularly attend an Eastern Catholic parish, although you are still bound to the laws and feasts of the Roman rite.

 

[ConstantineTG]

Thank you very much. I also have another question that I just thought of that someone may be able to answer for me. I have been feeling very drawn to the Eastern Catholic Rites latley. I was wondering if there was a way to officially become Byzantine Catholic or if I could just start going to Byzantine Liturgy. Also, I pray the morning and evening prayer of the Liturgy of the hours everyday and is this something that is regularly practiced in the Eastern Rite or is it more of a Latin thing? If I become Byzantine Cathoilc can I still attend Roman Mass regularly since there is only Byzantine Liturgy on Sunday around me and I like to try to go to Mass on days during the week if I can? Also, are there any Byzantine Catholic religious orders for lay people like Opus Dei, the Third Order Franciscans or anyhting like that?

Let me outline it for you

a. As a Catholic, you can fulfill your “obligation” to attend/assist at any Catholic Liturgy at any Catholic Rite. So it can be Roman,Byzantine, Coptic, Syriac, Armenian, etc.
b. You do not need to change Rites to attend another Rite regularly. Many do that, both ways. There are many Eastern Catholics who attend RC Mass exclusively after they have migrated to another place where there is either no parish of their Rite, or even if its just more convenient for them to go to the nearby RC parish. For whatever reason, you can attend any Catholic Liturgy as often as you want, and receive Communion and have your Confessions heard in that Rite as well.
c. There are Byzantine Orders, but not as much as Roman ones. You can grow your spirituality even though you are not within an order. The way the Byzantine Rite is, we are all called to be monastics even though not in the way the monks are.
d. We have the Hours, you can pray it. Ask your priest or Spiritual Father to teach you how to do it, there’s parts omitted if there is no priest because the parts are for a priest.

 

[Little_One0307]

Let me outline it for you

a. As a Catholic, you can fulfill your “obligation” to attend/assist at any Catholic Liturgy at any Catholic Rite. So it can be Roman,Byzantine, Coptic, Syriac, Armenian, etc.
b. You do not need to change Rites to attend another Rite regularly. Many do that, both ways. There are many Eastern Catholics who attend RC Mass exclusively after they have migrated to another place where there is either no parish of their Rite, or even if its just more convenient for them to go to the nearby RC parish. For whatever reason, you can attend any Catholic Liturgy as often as you want, and receive Communion and have your Confessions heard in that Rite as well.
c. There are Byzantine Orders, but not as much as Roman ones. You can grow your spirituality even though you are not within an order. The way the Byzantine Rite is, we are all called to be monastics even though not in the way the monks are.
d. We have the Hours, you can pray it. Ask your priest or Spiritual Father to teach you how to do it, there’s parts omitted if there is no priest because the parts are for a priest.

ConstantineTG,

Thata is most informative. Thanks for posting this. I do have a question. If I attend an Eastern Rite Church I have heard that the Eastern Rite does not like to give communion to Western Rite, is this true? I know that the Roman Rite does not have any objection to Eastern Rite taking Holy Communion, but I am not sure how it works the other way around. Does the Eastern Rite have Communion guidelines for Roman Catholics?

Thanks for taking time in responding to this.

God bless.

 

[Aramis]

ConstantineTG,

Thata is most informative. Thanks for posting this. I do have a question. If I attend an Eastern Rite Church I have heard that the Eastern Rite does not like to give communion to Western Rite, is this true? I know that the Roman Rite does not have any objection to Eastern Rite taking Holy Communion, but I am not sure how it works the other way around. Does the Eastern Rite have Communion guidelines for Roman Catholics?

Thanks for taking time in responding to this.

God bless.

The issue there is confusion of the Rite with the churches using said rite…

The Eastern Catholics will, but might require you go to confession the night before.
Generally, the Orthodox won’t commune you, normally, but some exceptions occur.

See, the 20-some Eastern Orthodox and 14 Byzantine (“Greek”) Catholics all use the Byzantine Rite…

The Armenian Catholics and Armenian Orthodox se the same rite, and generally the Armenian Orthodox will admit Catholics to communion.

The Assyrian Church of the East will admit any Catholics in some places, and Chaldean Catholics pretty much anywhere. The Chaldeans and Assyrians both use the same Rite.

The Alexandrian Rite churches within the Oriental Orthodox Communion (Coptic Orthodox, Eritrean Orthodox, Ethiopian Orthodox) generally do not commune Catholics. The same rite is used by the Coptic Catholics and Ethiopian Catholics; the Eritrean Catholics are part of the Ethiopian Catholic Church, as are the Roman priests in Ethiopia.

 

[Little_One0307]

The issue there is confusion of the Rite with the churches using said rite…

The Eastern Catholics will, but might require you go to confession the night before.
Generally, the Orthodox won’t commune you, normally, but some exceptions occur.

See, the 20-some Eastern Orthodox and 14 Byzantine (“Greek”) Catholics all use the Byzantine Rite…

The Armenian Catholics and Armenian Orthodox se the same rite, and generally the Armenian Orthodox will admit Catholics to communion.

The Assyrian Church of the East will admit any Catholics in some places, and Chaldean Catholics pretty much anywhere. The Chaldeans and Assyrians both use the same Rite.

The Alexandrian Rite churches within the Oriental Orthodox Communion (Coptic Orthodox, Eritrean Orthodox, Ethiopian Orthodox) generally do not commune Catholics. The same rite is used by the Coptic Catholics and Ethiopian Catholics; the Eritrean Catholics are part of the Ethiopian Catholic Church, as are the Roman priests in Ethiopia.

Aramis,

Thanks for posting this, this was very informative. So I guess a good rule of thumb it to call the Church that I am going to, to ask beforehand seeing there are different procedures and such.

The next question is when you say Orthodox, you mean those that are in Communion with Rome and not the Russian Orthodox? I get so confused when that word comes up. I dont’ know who it who anymore.

God bless.

 

[Lee_Aaronaldo]

Shalom brothers and sisters in Christ,

I read about the article on ‘Is Yoga harmful for Catholics’ recently. Upon looking at the picture on the article which is the yoga poses, I felt it is somehow similar to the poses we do for Jesus’s prayer. Does Jesus’s prayer rooted in Yoga or I am just thinking irrationally? Correct me if I’m wrong. Thanks for the reply in-advance.

Between, feel free to visit my new site here:

C.K. A@rOn - Words of WISDOM

“Not to oppose error is to approve it;and not to defend truth is to suppress it”. Pope St. Felix III

anawesomeromanticoutstandinglynobel.wordpress.com

Your comments are highly appreciated. God bless

 

[Stephentlig]

I have a 100knot chotki blessed by an Orthodox priest and sent to me by an Orthodox friend.

It is black and red ( I think this means the blood of martyrdom if it is red. )

I’m unsure if I would prefer the rope or beads though. Which are you more comfortable with? ( there I go again that word ‘‘comfort’’ )

I have a 50 knot prayer rope with tassle that I took to get blessed by my local roman parish priest and I can remember him saying ‘‘oh this looks very muslim’’. And get strange looks from my local cistercian community when in their shop and ask about chotkis they look at me strange. I think ignorance of the Eastern rite in Ireland is larger than it would be in America. We only have one Eastern Catholic rite parish in the whole of Ireland ‘‘Blessed Nicholas Hieromartyr’’.

 

[Aramis]

Aramis,

Thanks for posting this, this was very informative. So I guess a good rule of thumb it to call the Church that I am going to, to ask beforehand seeing there are different procedures and such.

The next question is when you say Orthodox, you mean those that are in Communion with Rome and not the Russian Orthodox? I get so confused when that word comes up. I dont’ know who it who anymore.

God bless.

No. By Orthodox, with a capital “O”, I mean the Russian Orthodox, the Greek Orthodox, the Syrian Orthodox, the Romanian Orthodox, the Coptic Orthodox, the Ethiopian Tehwado Orthodox, etc - those churches not in communion with Rome.

Thing is, there are, for example, two Coptic Churches. One, the Coptic Catholic Church, is in full communion with Rome. The other is the Coptic Orthodox Church, which is not (and is the senior church of the Oriental Orthodox Communion, in the same way that the Roman Church is the senior church of the Catholic Communion).

 

[Little_One0307]

I have a 100knot chotki blessed by an Orthodox priest and sent to me by an Orthodox friend.

It is black and red ( I think this means the blood of martyrdom if it is red. )

I’m unsure if I would prefer the rope or beads though. Which are you more comfortable with? ( there I go again that word ‘‘comfort’’ )

I have a 50 knot prayer rope with tassle that I took to get blessed by my local roman parish priest and I can remember him saying ‘‘oh this looks very muslim’’. And get strange looks from my local cistercian community when in their shop and ask about chotkis they look at me strange. I think ignorance of the Eastern rite in Ireland is larger than it would be in America. We only have one Eastern Catholic rite parish in the whole of Ireland ‘‘Blessed Nicholas Hieromartyr’’.

Stephentlig,

I am more “comfortable” with the rope as to Rosary beads when doing short prayer. Of course I have made a new adaptation. I wanted to post this earlier but will do it in this response. I do latch hook and every stitch I put in, I say my short prayer. There’s 165 stiches across in one row and 100 rows in all. It is a most relaxing and awesome way that I have found that works for me.

LOL. I get that response when I use my chotki and someone else sees it. I am glad that I am not the only one that gets comments. But I find that using Rosary beads in place of the chotki is somewhat distracting becuase of the Our Father bead and it is harder for me to keep count. Mine has 100 knots in it.

God bless.

Aramis,

Thank you for taking out time to answer my question again. God bless you.

 

[Stephentlig]

Stephentlig,

I am more “comfortable” with the rope as to Rosary beads when doing short prayer. Of course I have made a new adaptation. I wanted to post this earlier but will do it in this response. I do latch hook and every stitch I put in, I say my short prayer. There’s 165 stiches across in one row and 100 rows in all. It is a most relaxing and awesome way that I have found that works for me.

LOL. I get that response when I use my chotki and someone else sees it. I am glad that I am not the only one that gets comments. But I find that using Rosary beads in place of the chotki is somewhat distracting becuase of the Our Father bead and it is harder for me to keep count. Mine has 100 knots in it.

God bless.

Aramis,

Thank you for taking out time to answer my question again. God bless you.

No I was not talking about praying them on rosary beads but ‘‘Jesus Beads’’ like the same format as the ‘‘rope’’ but with ‘‘beads’’ ( such as 100 beads ) instead of with the 100knot rope.

In Christ
Stephen

 

[Little_One0307]

No I was not talking about praying them on rosary beads but ‘‘Jesus Beads’’ like the same format as the ‘‘rope’’ but with ‘‘beads’’ ( such as 100 beads ) instead of with the 100knot rope.

In Christ
Stephen

Stephen,

Man I was posting late. Sry, don’t know what I was thinking. The answer still stands. I perfer the rope, but due to wierd reactions I am getting to the rope chotki, I am thinking about getting a 100 bead Job’s Tears format made. I know someone who would do that for me.

Thanks for your clarification and sorry that I got confused. Late night posting can do that.

God bless.

 

[Alexander_Roman]

The Archabbey of St Meinrad makes and sells “Jesus Beads” or one hundred beads ending in a Jerusalem Cross.e

In fact, “prayer ropes” were once universal in both East and West. Knotted cords were used in the West and Dominicans once wrapped their knotted cord rosaries around their left wrists as Orthodox and EC clergy do today. Knotted cord rosaries are still the most widespread type of rosary and are used extensively in the mission fields.

Prayer ropes will have several divisions - including that of divisions into “decades.” The prayer “Most Holy Theotokos save me a sinner” is often used on the dividing knots/beads.

And our Revered Beadsman Extraordinaire, Phillip Rolfes, makes the best prayer ropes/beaded cords ever!

Alex

 

[Little_One0307]

The Archabbey of St Meinrad makes and sells “Jesus Beads” or one hundred beads ending in a Jerusalem Cross.e

In fact, “prayer ropes” were once universal in both East and West. Knotted cords were used in the West and Dominicans once wrapped their knotted cord rosaries around their left wrists as Orthodox and EC clergy do today. Knotted cord rosaries are still the most widespread type of rosary and are used extensively in the mission fields.

Prayer ropes will have several divisions - including that of divisions into “decades.” The prayer “Most Holy Theotokos save me a sinner” is often used on the dividing knots/beads.

And our Revered Beadsman Extraordinaire, Phillip Rolfes, makes the best prayer ropes/beaded cords ever!

Alex

Alex,

I was wondering if you or someone else could answer this question. I am looking at my chotki and it has three large wooden beads in it. It is dividing the knots up. Is there a reason for this? There’s more than 10 knots in one divions, so it can’t be a decade. Thanks.

God bless.