This is a ridiculous comment, and you know it, which is why it’s sarcastic.
No - you’re wrong.
- St. Thomas’s errors regarding abortion were purely scientific, not philosophical. Of course we find the topic rudimentary now-with fetal science proving beyond doubt that a fetus is a new human we no longer have any reason to debate what point in development it can be said that a fetus is in fact human-we’ve already proven the point scientifically.
That is completely untrue. There are differences in identity regarding what is human, and
what constitutes a human being or person hood. Just google for a second, and you’ll see that you are wrong.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beginning_of_human_personhood
The beginning of human personhood
is the period in an individual’s life when he or she is recognized, or begins to be recognized, as a person. The precise timing and nature of this occurrence** is not universally agreed upon, and has been the subject of discussion and debate in science, religion and philosophy.** The question of when and how personhood begins is the often
the nexus of controversy on issues such as abortion, stem cell research, reproductive rights, and fetal rights.
swarthmore.edu/Documents/featured_events/gilbert_personhood.pdf
Popular Culture Promotes the Fallacy of
“Sacred DNA”
Dorothy Nelkin and Susan Lindee, The DNA Mystique
- That which is your essence
- That which determines your behaviors
- That from which you can be resurrected
(à la Jurassic Park)
(From Christian Business Network website)
THE NOTION THAT WE ARE PHYSICALLY AND MENTALLY
DETERMINED BY OUR GENES IS SCIENTIFICALLY INVALID.
We are not determined to be “essentially” who or
what we are at fertilization. Many of our
fundamental bodily and behavioral characters are
determined by the environment, not by the genes.
Another Error -
A moment where passive egg meets active sperm - bunk
FERTILIZATION IS A PROCESS, NOT A MOMENT
- CAPACITATION - SPERM FINISH THEIR DEVELOPMENT IN THE
FEMALE REPRODUCTIVE TRACT - there is a 20-24 hour period between sperm and egg contact, and anything zygote. 24 hours of separate nothingness.
Fertilization is not immediate. Coitus does not equal “impregnation.”
It can take 2-5 days. Fertilization is not a moment. It’s a process.
Another error - there is a consensus among scientists as to when personhood begins.
Position 1: Personhood Begins at Fertilization
Q: At what point does that individuation take place?
Dr. Lejeune: Oh, that takes place at fecundation, at fertilization,
at conception. Because it just tells us that the constitution
of this person is unique to this person.
Human Life Review, Spring, 2002
POSITION 2: HUMAN PERSONHOOD BEGINS AT GASTRULATION
Only one unique person can form, rather than
numerous persons.
Renfree (1982): “Assuming that monozygotic twins have separate souls, it follows
that ensoulment must occur after cleavage…at least 12 days after conception!”
Green (2001): “”But twinning and fusion events suggest that, even well after the
formation of the zygote, biological individuality is not firmly established. Only at
gastrulation can we say that the lengthy process of individuation is complete.”
POSITION 3: PERSONHOOD BEGINS WHEN THE FETUS ACQUIRES THE
HUMAN-SPECIFIC EEG (ELECTROENCEPHALOGRAM) PATTERN
MOROWITZ AND TREFEL (1992): “In our usage, we say that our species acquired humanness when
the enlarged cortex developed, and the individual fetus acquires humanness when the cortex
begins to function.”
ESWARAN et al 2007. Clin . Neurol. 118: 1940 – 1946: “We were able to identify specific patterns
and track changes in fetal brain activity starting at 28 weeks of gestation.”
POSITION 4: HUMAN PERSONHOOD
BEGINS AT BIRTH
Legal personhod, Time of one’s identity
Jeffrey Baker:
Birth is not merely a “move from one room to another,” but a
passage through a perilous discontinuity between fetal and newborn life.
REDIRECTION OF DEVELOPMENT:
- LUNGS MUST BE ABLE TO FUNCTION
- FIRST BREATH CHANGES HEART ANATOMY
- FIRST BREATH CHANGES BLOOD CIRCULATION WITHIN HEART
AND WITHIN BODY
- HEAD MUST GET THROUGH BIRTH CANAL
SYMMETRY ARGUMENT FOR EEG CRITERION:
If loss of EEG pattern is considered human death (although heart is beating, cells are
respiring, etc.), then acquisition of EEG should be considered human life.
Argument of similar office:
Embryos and corpses are humans but not persons.
Neither is counted in a census; neither can inherit; neither has moral agency.
- If you;re implying that the Immaculate Conception is a “rudimentary” topic, well, that’s just wrong. It’s extremely complex, and it was hotly debated for a reason. The church uses the reasoning of the philosopher Blessed John Duns Scotus. He specifically responded to Aquinas’s, objections to the Immaculate Conception in an attempt to justify the doctrine. After a lot of debate the conclusion was reached that he succeeded. That doesn’t mean that the topic is simple or rudimentary-far from it. The theology and philosophy behind it are quite complex. That, at least is one thing you’re right about.
Never implied that.
- Let’s say, for the sake of argument, what you’re saying is true. If you’re going to discount Aquinas’s proofs because he got other stuff wrong you’re committing a pretty rudimentary fallacy. I don’t think you’re an idiot-you already know this, so what’s the point of this game you’re trying to play with us?
That’s not what I’m saying - so the rest of your argument is nonsensical.
Ive think I’ve clearly established that you are incorrect in regards to science. I know that believing what you said somehow supports your argument, which is clear doesn’t exist in the first place.
BESIDES Jesus is the really interesting question though.