The Liturgy of the Hours

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MiserereMeiDeus

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Fratres,

I am contemplating purchasing the Liturgy of the Hours (4 Volume set) in order to pray the Office of Readings and the other hours with a priest friend of mine. (I currently use the Monastic Diurnal) However, the translation of the LoTH is not my favorite. Is there a possibility in the future of a new translation? Also, does the LoTH come in Latin or English, or just Latin?

(If anyone knows where I can get the set cheap let me know haha)

Sincerely,

Miserere
 
TheMc said:
I would not use universalis. It is not the correct translation. But… if you have an iPhone, you can get the Divine Office app, which uses the official translation.

I believe there is a new translation in the works, but it will be way down the road. The one we have now is here to stay for quite a while.
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Yes, I use the Divine Office Liturgy of the Hours for iPhone. It comes with audio and includes a choir singing the hymns. Awesome stuff.
 
TrueLight said:
Yes, I use the Divine Office Liturgy of the Hours for iPhone. It comes with audio and includes a choir singing the hymns. Awesome stuff.
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I have the 4-Volume leather version from before iPhones and apps existed. I loved it, but now I have an iPhone and try to pack as much on it as I can (I have to use those 32 MB for something. I absolutely love the iPhone version. It’s a great app and worth the relatively low cost in comparison. I paid $15 for the iPhone app and about $160 for the 4-Volume version.
 
I have also heard that it will be a long time before we get a new translation of the Liturgy of the Hours.

You can get the LOTH in English or other vernaculars, or in Latin, and I know of one edition with both English and Latin but I believe that one is incomplete.

For the LOTH in Latin you can try paxbook.com/ , “the exclusive and authorized Internet distributor for publications of the Vatican Publishing House and many other Catholic institutes”. Search under “Liturgia Horarum”. Not all of the volumes are currently available, the ones that are available are on the expensive side, and sorry, I don’t know how much they charge for shipping.

You can also try the Midwest Theological Forum in this country. They are publishing their own edition of of the LOTH in Latin, but the leather edition is $900 (!). They have a regular edition in hardback, but that is still $450. You’ll have to save your pennies for these.

For Latin and English I know of Lauds and Vespers from St. Augustine’s Press. It has what it says, Lauds (Morning Prayer) and Vespers (Evening Prayer) for the year with the official Latin and an unofficial English translation. Unfortunately it has no Office of Readings which I think you need and I think it’s also missing some other material from the complete LOTH, like the Proper of Saints if I’m not mistaken.

The Paulines in Africa recently published a new edition in English for Africa and it looks like the price isn’t too bad. Being an African edition there might be a few differences from UK and US editions, like in rank of certain feasts, etc. But it uses the recent revision of the Grail Psalms, so maybe the language might be a little more to your taste, and the price isn’t too shabby: $100 for 4 volumes. That’s cheaper than the US set usually costs, but I don’t know about the shipping or other charges involved.

Also, since you intend to pray with your priest friend, the fact that it’s not the US edition (I’m assuming you’re in the US) might be a problem. Your priest friend would be obligated to use the local edition (as far as I know). Among other things, reciting the psalms together could get awkward sometimes because of the revised psalm translation.

There’s also the Divine Office, the LOTH in English published by Collins for the UK in 3 volumes. I’ve heard the translation for this is a little better than the US LOTH but if I’m not mistake it uses the same Grail translation for the psalms (someone correct me if I’m wrong). So you and your friend might be together reciting (chanting?) the psalms but you might have problems staying together with the other prayers.

I know others will disagree with me but I like Universalis and I recommend it to laypeople under no canonical obligation to pray the office. I wouldn’t say the translation is incorrect. It’s simply unofficial and that’s the problem. It’s not suitable for public worship, like Sunday Vespers at the parish church, or for your priest friend to fulfill his obligation. Being a different translation of prayers and scripture you wouldn’t be able to stay together and you might have some difficulty following your priest friend.

So in the end my suggestion, and I say this in the nicest ways possible, is to suck it up and use the LOTH we have. Someday there will be a new translation. In the meantime it’s still the prayer of the Church. It’s the same psalms in Latin or Hebrew or Greek. The richness of wisdom and knowledge is there in the Office of Readings. Just be willing to be open to it.
 
I know others will disagree with me but I like Universalis and I recommend it to laypeople under no canonical obligation to pray the office. I wouldn’t say the translation is incorrect. It’s simply unofficial and that’s the problem. It’s not suitable for public worship, like Sunday Vespers at the parish church, or for your priest friend to fulfill his obligation. Being a different translation of prayers and scripture you wouldn’t be able to stay together and you might have some difficulty following your priest friend.
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You’re right, some will disagree with you.
I’ve never been a fan of the “I’m a layperson with no canonical obligation so I can do what I please” mentality, which I’ve come across fairly frequently.
The Liturgy of the Hours is just that- liturgy. It is the public prayer of the Church, and has prescribed and approved forms, even though there is quite a bit of adaptability in their celebration, as one can see in the General Instruction of the Liturgy of the Hours.

If we truly want to enter into the Church’s liturgy, to me it makes sense to use an approved text.
Just as with the sacraments, where the further you depart from the form and matter the more doubt is introduced as to the liceity and even validity of the sacrament, so with the rest of the liturgy; the further you depart from the approved version, the less it would seem to be truly the prayer of the Church.
How far can one depart before the action completely ceases to be truly “liturgy”? I don’t even pretend to say, but as you mention, at some point it would be so far as not to fulfill a clerical or religious obligation.

At that point, wherever it may lie, the prayer would cease to be the Liturgy of Hours and become a personal devotion.

Would using Universalis cross the line? I don’t know the answer, but I just do not like doubt, which is another reason I prefer priests to “do the red, say the black.”
 
Thank you all for the information packed responses! I would love to puchase the Latin/English one, but wow the price haha. Even though I am more traditionally minded, (and would love to find an affordable Latin/English Breviary.) But I do want to pray the prayer of the church. I guess the virtue of long suffering applies here as I wait for a better translation haha. Perhaps Pope Benedict will begin a reform of the Breviary? : )
 
Don’t know whether it’s available in the US, but the UK version of the Liturgy of the Hours is a different translation. Comes in 3 volumes instead of 4 (Volume 1 = 1 Sunday of Advent to Tuesday of the 9th week in Ordinary Time, Volume 2 = Lent and Easter, Volume 3 = Monday after Pentecost to Advent).
 
drforjc said:
You’re right, some will disagree with you.
I’ve never been a fan of the “I’m a layperson with no canonical obligation so I can do what I please” mentality, which I’ve come across fairly frequently.
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However that’s not what I wrote or implied. If he’s not bound under canonical obligation then he’s not bound and I have no reason to believe the Universalis translation is innacurate, just unnaproved for public use/celebration. (Off the top of my head I believe the scripture readings are from the Jerusalem Bible, approved in the UK for Mass, I believe the psalms and prayers are a private translation).
The Liturgy of the Hours is just that- liturgy. It is the public prayer of the Church, and has prescribed and approved forms, even though there is quite a bit of adaptability in their celebration, as one can see in the General Instruction of the Liturgy of the Hours.If we truly want to enter into the Church’s liturgy, to me it makes sense to use an approved text.
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I see it as similar to using a Latin-English missal at an Extraordinary Form mass. I don’t believe you’re not participating at mass just because you follow in the English half of the missal. So with Universalis. It’s not perfect. It’s an imperfect method but, I believe, a still worthy method of uniting yourself to the prayer of the universal church. Would you see praying the Little Office of Our Lady the same way?
Just as with the sacraments, where the further you depart from the form and matter the more doubt is introduced as to the liceity and even validity of the sacrament, so with the rest of the liturgy; the further you depart from the approved version, the less it would seem to be truly the prayer of the Church.
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I’m not sure it’s fair to make a direct comparison to the sacraments, the hours and the sacraments work differently.
How far can one depart before the action completely ceases to be truly “liturgy”? I don’t even pretend to say, but as you mention, at some point it would be so far as not to fulfill a clerical or religious obligation.At that point, wherever it may lie, the prayer would cease to be the Liturgy of Hours and become a personal devotion.
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I think it’s safe to say in the case of Universalis it hasn’t gone so far as to be simply “personal devotion”. It strives to convey the LOTH as fully and accurately as possible with its own translation . I think “para-liturgical” might be a better term for it.
Would using Universalis cross the line? I don’t know the answer, but I just do not like doubt, which is another reason I prefer priests to “do the red, say the black.”
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I don’t think Universalis crosses that line but I said I knew some people wouldn’t agree.In the end, since he would be reciting with a priest who is under obligation, I recommended he use the official published LOTH anyway.
 
drforjc said:
You’re right, some will disagree with you.
I’ve never been a fan of the “I’m a layperson with no canonical obligation so I can do what I please” mentality, which I’ve come across fairly frequently.
The Liturgy of the Hours is just that- liturgy. It is the public prayer of the Church, and has prescribed and approved forms, even though there is quite a bit of adaptability in their celebration, as one can see in the General Instruction of the Liturgy of the Hours.

If we truly want to enter into the Church’s liturgy, to me it makes sense to use an approved text.
Just as with the sacraments, where the further you depart from the form and matter the more doubt is introduced as to the liceity and even validity of the sacrament, so with the rest of the liturgy; the further you depart from the approved version, the less it would seem to be truly the prayer of the Church.
How far can one depart before the action completely ceases to be truly “liturgy”? I don’t even pretend to say, but as you mention, at some point it would be so far as not to fulfill a clerical or religious obligation.

At that point, wherever it may lie, the prayer would cease to be the Liturgy of Hours and become a personal devotion.

Would using Universalis cross the line? I don’t know the answer, but I just do not like doubt, which is another reason I prefer priests to “do the red, say the black.”
Click to expand...
I agree with you! 👍

Having said that I have no problem with lay people who do not have any canonical requirements or requirements from a third order to use whatever they want but if they chose to use something other than the approved forms of the Liturgy of the Hours I let them know when they say that they are praying the Liturgy of the Hours that they are not. They are praying a private devotion but it is not the LOTH as the LOTH has a prescribed form and usage that they are not meeting so they are not entering into the prayer of the Church though the LOTH.

This would be like celebrating Mass in a different form from the two approved ones, the Ordinary and the Extraordinary Forms. Like going to a Sarum rite Mass, this is not approved by the Church and does not meet the requirements for one to say that they have been to Mass, though it might be a nice private devotion.

It seems that people see a big difference between the LOTH and the other public prayer (Mass and the other Sacraments) within the Church.
 
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