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deb216
Guest
There are too many seperate ideas to address here.
To the OP. My experience is that every person goes to church for his or her own personal reasons. Obedience? Worship? Guilt? Fellowship? Habit? You cannot assign a reason according to which church a person belongs to. They transcend denomination. It is a “human” thing.
I was raised in a two faith family. I can honestly say that my Protestant relatives love God as much as my Catholic relatives do. They all believe that they have truth on their side. They all strive to be good Christians according to their understanding of what it means to be a good Christian.
I have attended many different kinds of services in many different kinds of churches, with an open mind and an open heart. I never felt the presence of God in any but the Catholic Church. Pehaps it is the Eucharist. Perhaps not. I just know that I have attended Mass in different places. I have heard the Mass in different languages. Whether I am surrounded by family and friends, or a community of strangers, I know that I am home the moment I walk through the door.
I don’t need to know the people I pray with. I don’t need to know the priest. I don’t need to be in a particular building. I don’t need mood music. I definitely don’t need a casserole. I need God. Everything else is just icing on the cake. In my opinion, people who rely on the superficial for their faith don’t have any.
To the OP. My experience is that every person goes to church for his or her own personal reasons. Obedience? Worship? Guilt? Fellowship? Habit? You cannot assign a reason according to which church a person belongs to. They transcend denomination. It is a “human” thing.
I was raised in a two faith family. I can honestly say that my Protestant relatives love God as much as my Catholic relatives do. They all believe that they have truth on their side. They all strive to be good Christians according to their understanding of what it means to be a good Christian.
I have attended many different kinds of services in many different kinds of churches, with an open mind and an open heart. I never felt the presence of God in any but the Catholic Church. Pehaps it is the Eucharist. Perhaps not. I just know that I have attended Mass in different places. I have heard the Mass in different languages. Whether I am surrounded by family and friends, or a community of strangers, I know that I am home the moment I walk through the door.
I don’t need to know the people I pray with. I don’t need to know the priest. I don’t need to be in a particular building. I don’t need mood music. I definitely don’t need a casserole. I need God. Everything else is just icing on the cake. In my opinion, people who rely on the superficial for their faith don’t have any.
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Montgomeryatty
Guest
Allow me to attempt to revive this thread. I’d like to return to the question asked by the OP, but to phrase it a bit differently: When we attend church, what precisely defines “worship”? Protestants sing songs and pray in a manner/mood designed to, as some cutely describe it, “demonstrate God’s worth-ship.” Because the attempt is to sing/pray/preach in a most heartfelt way, and because attitude/emotion often is contagious, it is very easy in contemporary society to label this corporate act as “worship.”
The Catholic approach is more formal, more reverent, and as a necessary byproduct of its repetitive nature from week to week, can (although doesn’t necessarily) become rather “rote” and not terribly “heartfelt” to some individuals. I’m not saying this is good or bad, nor that this is/should be the case for devout Catholics. But to outsiders, this is no doubt the perception, and it no doubt turns some off because they doubt that Catholics are “worshipping” God. So let me ask the question:
Should we call the Catholic Mass a “worship” event?
In other words, is “worship” what we are called to do as Christians when we come together in the Church? Or is worship simply one component of the Mass, along with other actions better labeled as something else? Perhaps Catholics have fallen into a Protestant trap by labeling a service in a church as “worship.” Or perhaps they have let the Protestants recharacterize “worship” as an act only undertaken in a Protestant (read: evangelical) church.
My intent is not to gotcha someone, but to best understand how to think of worship. When I was younger, I misunderstood the notion of freedom/liberty because I thought it meant the ability to do whatever I wanted. Only once I grasped the distinction between freedom/liberty versus license did I understand that freedom has a meaning narrower than the ability to do anything I desired, that it means the ability to do what I ought to do. In a similar vein, is “worship” not supposed to be about singing songs or praying to show God his “worth-ship,” but rather something broader or narrower, or something entirely different?
I hope my inquiry makes sense. It seems crucial to me for understanding/passing on an understanding of the difference between the Mass and a Protestant service. Thanks!
The Catholic approach is more formal, more reverent, and as a necessary byproduct of its repetitive nature from week to week, can (although doesn’t necessarily) become rather “rote” and not terribly “heartfelt” to some individuals. I’m not saying this is good or bad, nor that this is/should be the case for devout Catholics. But to outsiders, this is no doubt the perception, and it no doubt turns some off because they doubt that Catholics are “worshipping” God. So let me ask the question:
Should we call the Catholic Mass a “worship” event?
In other words, is “worship” what we are called to do as Christians when we come together in the Church? Or is worship simply one component of the Mass, along with other actions better labeled as something else? Perhaps Catholics have fallen into a Protestant trap by labeling a service in a church as “worship.” Or perhaps they have let the Protestants recharacterize “worship” as an act only undertaken in a Protestant (read: evangelical) church.
My intent is not to gotcha someone, but to best understand how to think of worship. When I was younger, I misunderstood the notion of freedom/liberty because I thought it meant the ability to do whatever I wanted. Only once I grasped the distinction between freedom/liberty versus license did I understand that freedom has a meaning narrower than the ability to do anything I desired, that it means the ability to do what I ought to do. In a similar vein, is “worship” not supposed to be about singing songs or praying to show God his “worth-ship,” but rather something broader or narrower, or something entirely different?
I hope my inquiry makes sense. It seems crucial to me for understanding/passing on an understanding of the difference between the Mass and a Protestant service. Thanks!
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DB_AND_ALI
Guest
I have yet to meet a protestant i did not love…the only thing i find hugely amusing is that they often seem to be experts on what we catholics believe and they are , in my experience , not very good listeners ! Fortunately i am old enough to know how to avoid disputes…one thing i do recommend to all non-catholics is that they read SCOTT HAHN’S book : ROME SWEET HOME. Scott would have been just as lovable had he not converted…but after spending years trying to disprove catholicism …he converted anyway ! And the rest of his extended family who were staunch protestants supported Scott and his wife all the way as they entered the catholic faith. Real people…real christianity.Hi,
This protestant thanks you for making your points.
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AlegreFe
Guest
:clapping: I agree completely!!
It seems that some people have their priorities mixed up. I know a protestant person who has said that they will never leave their nondenom church because the people there are very nice. Okay, how secure is that? The people are very nice to her and that is why she won’t leave?!?
That is very sad to me.I will NEVER leave the Catholic Church because I never want to leave Jesus Christ!! I need GOD and I have Him in the Catholic Mass every time I attend and take Communion. I also don’t need to know all the people there during Mass, especially if there are over 2,000 people or so in the church during the Mass. I do know several here and there and we are cordial when we see each other but I certainly don’t know all of them. Fellowship is nice but without Jesus substantially present, fellowship then has a potential to become dry and empty.
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HailMary
Guest
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sandmountainsli
Guest
Ok,
Allow me to put my two cents in.
I attend church for worship and worship only, I do not go to socialize or meet and greet other worshippers.
Some people may go to my church (Congregational Methodist) to socialize before and after the service but I am not among them.
I do not attend Bible Study on sunday mornings, I show up at 11 which is when the morning worship begins and I leave after worship is over. I do not attend wednesday night services or revivals.
WP
Allow me to put my two cents in.
I attend church for worship and worship only, I do not go to socialize or meet and greet other worshippers.
Some people may go to my church (Congregational Methodist) to socialize before and after the service but I am not among them.
I do not attend Bible Study on sunday mornings, I show up at 11 which is when the morning worship begins and I leave after worship is over. I do not attend wednesday night services or revivals.
WP
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lak611
Guest
I would say that most Catholics and Protestants probably feel the same about WORSHIP. The fellowship is available for those who are interested in socializing. Probably just about every church has some type of Bible study, youth group, CCD or Sunday school, outreach to the poor or St. Vincent DePaul Society, men’s or women’s group, etc. to provide those fellowship opportunities to those who are interested.
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sandmountainsli
Guest
I am not fond of the socializing aspect of church, be it Catholic or Protestant, it would suit me if we were forbidden from speaking in church other than prayers.
I am clearly in the minority so I shan’t voice my opinion too much on that.
WP
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lak611
Guest
I agree. Worship is worship. Fellowship can be done at another time.
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Syele
Guest
I don’t mean to be rude, but when I attended Mass (weekly for 6 years, changed parishes three times) Fellowship happened about the 12th of Never.
Fellowship shouldn’t happen DURING the Worship time, but I see nothing wrong with it after church, yet at the church.
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lak611
Guest
I agree. Fellowship is appropriate at the church, but not during the Mass/Service. I always talk to my friends at church after Mass is over or before it starts. We also have coffee hour after Mass once a month. We have Sunday school too (for adults, it is Bible study).
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AlegreFe
Guest
We should never talk to anyone BEFORE Mass starts. That time should be reserved just for Jesus. We have to prepare for the Mass. We could say prayers intended to say before the Mass starts.
A Prayer Before Mass
Act of Oblation before Holy Mass
Prayer Before Mass
And even AFTER Mass we should FIRST pray and then we can talk to our friends.
I pray the Saint Michael Prayer then I pray one of these prayers.A PRAYER FOR AFTER THE HOLY MASS
LORD, Father all-powerful, and ever-living God, I thank Thee,
for even though I am a sinner, Thy unprofitable servant, not
because of my worth, but in the kindness of Thy mercy, Thou
hast fed me with the precious Body and Blood of Thy Son, our
Lord Jesus Christ.
I pray that this holy communion may not bring me condemnation
and punishment but forgiveness and salvation.
May it be a helmet of faith and a shield of good will.
May it purify me from evil ways and put an end to my evil passions.
May it bring me charity and patience, humility and obedience,
and growth in power to do good.
May it be my strong defense against all my enemies, visible and
invisible, and the perfect calming of all my evil impulses, bodily
and spiritual.
May it unite me more closely to Thee, the one true God and lead
me safely through death to everlasting happiness with Thee.
And I pray that Thou willest lead me, a sinner to the banquet
where Thou with Thy Son and Holy Spirit, are true and perfect
light, total fulfillment, everlasting joy, gladness without end, and
perfect happiness to Thy saints.
Grant this through Christ our Lord.
Amen.
A PRAYER FOR AFTER THE HOLY MASS
I Beseech Thee, most sweet Lord Jesus Christ, that Thy Passion
may be to me power by which I may be strengthened, protected
and defended.
May Thy wounds be to me food and drink by which I may be
nourished, inebriated, and delighted.
May the sprinkling of Thy Blood be to me an ablution for all my sins.
May Thy death prove for me unfailing life, and may Thy Cross be
to me eternal glory.
In these be my refreshment, joy, health, and delight of my heart;
Thou who livest and reignest forever.
Amen.
I wish EVERYONE would pray at least BEFORE the Mass; that way those that would normally talk before Mass would not distract me as I pray before the Mass. I think it’s inconsiderate of those talking before the Mass starts. At least if a person wants to talk before the Mass they should talk OUTSIDE the Church and not inside where some people are kneeling and praying before Mass starts.
The same goes AFTER the Mass. I wish all would pray after the Mass also. You can talk later OUTSIDE of the Church or at least talk quietly inside the Vestibule.
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