The Mass Reduced to a show by the pope

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Let us pray that he is as passionate today as he was then and that he lead the way in this development. Look to the East. We have developed in our liturgical expressions but not in any radical ways.

I pray that someway, somehow, American RCism regain the sense of the sacred once again. Perhaps Churches like St. John Cantius will show the way.

Dan L
 
Your punctuation (or lack thereof) in the subject line was alarmingly misleading.
 
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Pentecost2005:
Your punctuation (or lack thereof) in the subject line was alarmingly misleading.
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Yes very. You must see the title of the article to understand the thread title.
 
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Pentecost2005:
Your punctuation (or lack thereof) in the subject line was alarmingly misleading.
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I agree.

“Let’s go out and murder, Joe,” said the pirate chief.
“Let’s go out and murder Joe,” said the pirate chief.

It makes quite a difference–especially to Joe.
  • Liberian
 
I think the pope should abstain from showing off…especially during mass.😛

Dan L
 
I, too, hope for a reform of the reform. I do not, however, hope for a return to the single uniform Mass said in Latin.
 
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JKirkLVNV:
I, too, hope for a reform of the reform. I do not, however, hope for a return to the single uniform Mass said in Latin.
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Highly unlikely. That would be the quickest road to schism. There would be priests and bishops around the world who would absolutely refuse to comply with such a directive.
 
Dr. Bombay:
Highly unlikely. That would be the quickest road to schism. There would be priests and bishops around the world who would absolutely refuse to comply with such a directive.
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Yes, I know. But if he ordered it tomorrow, I would comply. I’d be sad for the rest of my life, but I would obey him. I’ve heard that bishops sometimes threaten schism. They should be removed.
 
why would anyone want Latin mass back?
I can’t see the point of it- I don’t know Latin, nor do my children so it would reduce the mass to meaningless words for us. Some of the sung Latin masses are beautiful music but why would you want Latin for everyday?:confused:
 
Well, I know Latin, and I miss it. I also know English, and French, and bits of pieces of other languages. Each new word, phrase, element of grammar, history, etc. is an enrichment to my life. Adding Latin to your base of English knowledge is bound to enrich your life as well. A lot of “English” in use today–slang, techno terms etc.–is “known” by a smaller group–teens, technologists–fully, but in less than full, yet still valuable ways by larger groups. You don’t have to be able to open up “The Confessions of St. Augustine” and read it through like a Latin scholar in order to understand the Latin which is used in a typical Mass.

Latin is a rich language. You’d be surprised at how quickly you would pick up the cognates (words from which our English and other languages come from). Spiritus–spirit. Dei (God, deity, etc.).

Open your mind, your ears, and your heart to the ENRICHMENT of Latin.
 
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garfield:
why would anyone want Latin mass back?
I can’t see the point of it- I don’t know Latin, nor do my children so it would reduce the mass to meaningless words for us. Some of the sung Latin masses are beautiful music but why would you want Latin for everyday?:confused:
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The Latin Missals contain the English translation right next to the Latin. For example:

Latin
Suscipe, sancte Pater, omnipotens aeterne Deus, hanc immaculatam hostiam, quam ego indignus famulus tuus offero tibi, Deo meo vivo et vero, pro innumerabilibus peccatis, et offensionibus, et negligentiis meis, et pro omnibus circumstantibus, sed et pro omnibus fidelibus Christianis vivis atque defunctis. ut mihi, et illis proficiat ad salutem in vitam aeternam.

English
Accept, O Holy Father, Almighty and eternal God, this spotless host, which I, your unworthy servant, offer to You, my living and true God, to atone for my numberless sins, offenses and negligences; on behalf of all here present and likewise for all faithful Christians living and dead, that it may profit me and them as a means of salvation to life everlasting.

I wouldn’t dare refer to these as “meaningless words.”
 
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garfield:
why would anyone want Latin mass back?
I can’t see the point of it- I don’t know Latin, nor do my children so it would reduce the mass to meaningless words for us. Some of the sung Latin masses are beautiful music but why would you want Latin for everyday?:confused:
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Perhaps you should think about learning some Latin!
Many of our words come from Latin. If you would like your children to go into the medical field or any of the sciences, they will have a much easier time with a backround in Latin (and greek).
When we lost the Latin Mass we lost our need for learning Latin. I am blessed to be in a parish which as a sprinking of Latin in the Liturgy.
When I say that a long A in Latin sounds like the A in Father, I can also say, “See the A in Agnus.” It makes it much easier for them.

BTW, if you know the mass in the vernacular, you can follow in Latin. I attended a Polish funeral Mass. I do not speak Polish but my girls (7 & 5) and I followed along just fine.
 
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GregoryPalamas:
I think the pope should abstain from showing off…especially during mass.😛

Dan L
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or at least refrain from dancing or wearing a clown costume (see past posts on liturgical abuses).
 
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garfield:
why would anyone want Latin mass back?
I can’t see the point of it- I don’t know Latin, nor do my children so it would reduce the mass to meaningless words for us. Some of the sung Latin masses are beautiful music but why would you want Latin for everyday?:confused:
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every language is meaningless to someone who does not understand it. It used to be a requirement that every Catholic learn latin in school precisely so that the prayers of the Mass could be understood. Latin until a generation ago was still taught in most public schools and private schools to anyone with college aspirations. At the very least children in Catholic school (CCD used to be the exception, not the rule) learned the latin Mass prayers and their English meanings. The rot set in when they stopped teaching Latin.
 
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JKirkLVNV:
I, too, hope for a reform of the reform. I do not, however, hope for a return to the single uniform Mass said in Latin.
Click to expand...
From Sacrosantum Concilium
  1. In Masses which are celebrated with the people, a suitable place may be allotted to their mother tongue. This is to apply in the first place to the readings and “the common prayer,” but also, as local conditions may warrant, to those parts which pertain to the people, according to tho norm laid down in Art. 36 of this Constitution.
    Nevertheless steps should be taken so that the faithful may also be able to say or to sing together in Latin those parts of the Ordinary of the Mass which pertain to them.
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So it would appear that even when the permission to translate parts of the mass to the vernacular, the original intention was not that the entire mass necessarily be said in the vernacular, just parts of it.

Having just come into the Church 4 years ago, one of the things I enjoy most is the uniformity (or at least the intended uniformity) of the mass between parishes, dioceses and countries. So I can go to any mass anywhere and know whats going on even if I don’t understand the words at the time.

This uniformity increases whenever parts are said in Latin. This really struck home when watching coverage of the funeral et al, and hearing the Salve Regina sung in Latin (which I’ve learned from our sung night prayer, Benediction) and being able to sing along with my brothers and sisters across the world! I loved it!

I pointed this out to my priest just last night and requested that on occasion we learn some of the mass parts, Our Father etc in Latin or some great old hymns such as Tantum Ergo in Latin for just that reason.
 
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