The Messiah in Judaic belief

[Kaninchen]

I get the 2nd part

But not the first. Too peculiar for my slow brain maybe

But let me give my thought process. Catholics are free to disagree with Church teachings. However, all those you mention has basically no compromise. Non are acceptable to the Church. But neither points have anything to do with accepting the Messiah via “back door”. seems way too sinister

MJ

The point I was making was about what was within the ‘normative’ range - in the far future somebody might say that there were Catholics who believed in all sorts of things and that statement or set of statements might well be ‘true’ but time would have removed any way to measure that ‘truth’ ie about what some Catholics believed in 2013, how many such groups existed and how many people were involved in these non-normative ideas.

What we get in this context are lots and lots of conjecture about a whole range of interpretations of ‘Messiah’ but nobody can say how deeply, or widespread, any particular set of ideas were held at a differently crucial time for both religions.

What both sides (Jews and Christians) have are how things developed within our different paradigms.

 

[jonathan_hili]

Oh, I’ve been around so long, I expect I could be considered CAF furniture by now and sometimes I’m a bit cryptic, as if I imagine everybody’s been around a long time as well.

Oh, good, I’m glad you’re not miffed!

My first girlfriend was Jewish. She was actually surprised one day when I showed her a Catholic Bible that we had the same Scriptures in the Old Testament that she had in her Bible.

 

[Kaninchen]

Oh, good, I’m glad you’re not miffed!

Dick Bruna has a lot to answer for in the early years of so many!

 

[MartinJordan]

The point I was making was about what was within the ‘normative’ range - in the far future somebody might say that there were Catholics who believed in all sorts of things and that statement or set of statements might well be ‘true’ but time would have removed any way to measure that ‘truth’ ie about what some Catholics believed in 2013, how many such groups existed and how many people were involved in these non-normative ideas.

.

Catholicism is about revealed Truths and how God speaks to his greatest creation as well as us (Catholics) being obedient to the Church’s teachings. Why does it matter to you what disobedient Catholics believe in this secular influenced world?

What we get in this context are lots and lots of conjecture about a whole range of interpretations of ‘Messiah’ but nobody can say how deeply, or widespread, any particular set of ideas were held at a differently crucial time for both religions.

What both sides (Jews and Christians) have are how things developed within our different paradigms.

You seem to be using today’s context to figure out 2 millenium year old context

Excuse me if Im not getting what you mean. Im hardly an intellectual

MJ

 

[Kaninchen]

.Catholicism is about revealed Truths and how God speaks to his greatest creation as well as us (Catholics) being obedient to the Church’s teachings. Why does it matter to you what disobedient Catholics believe in this secular influenced world?

It doesn’t matter to me at all. I was trying to draw a parallel between people making conjectures/statements about what Jews believed two thousand years ago and somebody in the far future making statements about what ‘Catholics’ believed thousands of years in their (the people making the statements) past, with the implication that there were a group of believers who have been erased in the Catholic establishment’s version of history.

So, one might say “there were Jews at the time of Jesus who were waiting for a Messiah a bit like Jesus turned out to be.” Saying something like that sounds really important, as if there were large numbers of Jews sitting around waiting for Jesus and those Jews have been erased from normative Judaism’s version of history, on the other hand it’s rather less important if it’s just a couple of guys sitting out in the desert somewhere.

In other words, you can suggest all sorts of things about the far past when there’s no possibility of ‘quality control’ on what you say.

 

[MartinJordan]

It doesn’t matter to me at all. I was trying to draw a parallel between people making conjectures/statements about what Jews believed two thousand years ago and somebody in the far future making statements about what ‘Catholics’ believed thousands of years in their (the people making the statements) past, with the implication that there were a group of believers who have been erased in the Catholic establishment’s version of history.

So, one might say “there were Jews at the time of Jesus who were waiting for a Messiah a bit like Jesus turned out to be.” Saying something like that sounds really important, as if there were large numbers of Jews sitting around waiting for Jesus and those Jews have been erased from normative Judaism’s version of history, on the other hand it’s rather less important if it’s just a couple of guys sitting out in the desert somewhere.

In other words, you can suggest all sorts of things about the far past when there’s no possibility of ‘quality control’ on what you say.

I think I get it. Thank you “Cryptic Kaninchen”

MJ