The Need for Catholic Masculinity

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I think you could say I had bad role models. I came from a split Protestant family where my parents divorced and both ‘re-married’.

Step dad lived up to the stereotype completely. Mean as hell, he was an alcoholic who died of lung cancer after physically and mentally abusing me for years, and I mean serious abuse with broken bones on myself. He would not dream of setting foot in a church because church was for women and children only. He encouraged me to smoke and drink at a very young age.

My biological dad was a Casper Milktoast type and step-mom wore the pants in the family. He was very obedient to her.

I think human men should be individuals and I am an individualist, and I still believe that being a man comes from the inside.

Those “men” standing outside the parish hall getting drunk first thing in the morning were hypocrites. Even the pastor told me they were unfaithfull to a man, while beating their wifes if the so much as looked at a man other than their husbands.
Andrew hello,

I’m sorry about you’re childhood. Good for you for not continuing the cycle of violin or addictions.

What do you mean by individualist? And why do you use Catholic terminology when discussing you’re childhood? You stated you were Protestant growing up?

Pax,
Tarpeian
 
I prefer the society in which I live now, where all religions are respected and we are free to choose which religion to follow. That said, yes, I’d prefer a society not led by Catholics because I wouldn’t want all our laws based on Catholic rules or laws anymore than I would want our laws based on any other religion’s rules and laws. Besides that, you imply only Catholic men can effectively lead a country and that’s just false. There are good people out there, men and women, Catholic and non-Catholic. Being Catholic doesn’t automatically earn one a gold star.
Should Islam be respected? Curious?

Pax,
Tarpeian
 
So what are our laws based on?
Ed
Whatever you want to say our laws are based on, it’s not against the law, for example, to miss Mass on Sunday, and no one will haul you off to jail for doing so. Obviously our civil laws go beyond what’s in the ten commandments in some instances, and obviously don’t include all sins as taught by the Church.
 
It didn’t work for pre-protestant England. Thankfully those days are over and unlikely to ever return.
Please explain how you believe pre-protestant England was led by men of “Catholic standing” and “guided by individuals firmly rooted in their moral principles”?

Does not match my reading of history.
 
Whatever you want to say our laws are based on, it’s not against the law, for example, to miss Mass on Sunday, and no one will haul you off to jail for doing so. Obviously our civil laws go beyond what’s in the ten commandments in some instances, and obviously don’t include all sins as taught by the Church.
Not familiar with any laws in pre-protestant England which hauled people off for missing Mass on Sunday. OTH, I am fairly positive in parts of post-catholic England (namely puritan governed New England) not attending Sunday services was certainly an offense that would land one in jail.
 
Please explain how you believe pre-protestant England was led by men of “Catholic standing” and “guided by individuals firmly rooted in their moral principles”?

Does not match my reading of history.
Oh I don’t doubt that pre-protestant England was led by anything more than those men who claimed to be men of “Catholic standing” and “guided by individuals firmly rooted in their moral principles”. However, note that Thomas More was one such man highly regarded by Catholics, and in fact canonized a Saint, but who also directly ordered the burning of heretics at the stake. Not a world I would want to live in. A Catholic radical is just as dangerous as a Muslim radical, or any other radical.
 
Andrew hello,

I’m sorry about you’re childhood. Good for you for not continuing the cycle of violin or addictions.

What do you mean by individualist? And why do you use Catholic terminology when discussing you’re childhood? You stated you were Protestant growing up?

Pax,
Tarpeian
I converted when I was 17 and discarded by my step and real parents. I was 17 when I went to the parish I have been discussing.
 
Not familiar with any laws in pre-protestant England which hauled people off for missing Mass on Sunday. OTH, I am fairly positive in parts of post-catholic England (namely puritan governed New England) not attending Sunday services was certainly an offense that would land one in jail.
Both in Pre-protestant England, and in post-Catholic England, people were hauled off to jail for offenses against the religion that ruled the monarch. Not a safe place for anyone to be. Words can’t even express how grateful I am to God for putting me here instead of there.
 
I went to a Catholic Men’s conference the last 2 years. There is something special about a couple of hundred men praying the rosary. It was amazing. I highly recommend the experience.

The best Catholic man I know (other than priests) is my wife’s father. What a patriarch! He is humble, powerful, and the most charitable man I have ever met. In my opinion, he’s a living saint. His wife has severe Alzheimer’s and he cares for her and loves her without complaint.

She was close to death earlier this year (congestive heart failure). The doctor had pulled my wife aside and asked her if she was ready for her mother’s death. My father-in-law never lost faith, never gave up hope, and I believe her recovery was a miracle.

What an inspiration he is to his children, grandchildren, and great-grandchildren! What a model to us all.
 
I went to a Catholic Men’s conference the last 2 years. There is something special about a couple of hundred men praying the rosary. It was amazing. I highly recommend the experience.

The best Catholic man I know (other than priests) is my wife’s father. What a patriarch! He is humble, powerful, and the most charitable man I have ever met. In my opinion, he’s a living saint. His wife has severe Alzheimer’s and he cares for her and loves her without complaint.

She was close to death earlier this year (congestive heart failure). The doctor had pulled my wife aside and asked her if she was ready for her mother’s death. My father-in-law never lost faith, never gave up hope, and I believe her recovery was a miracle.

What an inspiration he is to his children, grandchildren, and great-grandchildren! What a model to us all.
Thank you. My mother was also saved recently. May God be praised.

Peace,
Ed
 
Curious, what does that even mean?? What are you specifically asking?
Well now the government schools want to teach its ok that Timmy thinks 2+2=5. As long as Timmy can demonstrate why he thinks 2+2=5 then its acceptable and should be respected, not corrected. Charity demands correction. I cringe every time I hear something false should be respected and perpetuated. Jesus at the well said “go and sin no more.” Not I’m ok you are ok, keep on committing adultery.

Pax,
Tarpeian
 
Oh I don’t doubt that pre-protestant England was led by anything more than those men who claimed to be men of “Catholic standing” and “guided by individuals firmly rooted in their moral principles”. However, note that Thomas More was one such man highly regarded by Catholics, and in fact canonized a Saint, but who also directly ordered the burning of heretics at the stake. Not a world I would want to live in. A Catholic radical is just as dangerous as a Muslim radical, or any other radical.
Thomas More was a government official. Romans 13 indicates that to keep order governement officials may use the sword, i.e. captial punhishment. This may be against our modern day sensitivity but it’s in the Word of God! Committing mortal sin is worse than physically dieing and causing others to commit mortal sin is worse than physical murder.

Trying to read 21st century sensibilities into past history is dubious. Every generation has its cross. You are free to speculate about how much better the times are but 70 million slaughtered, when you include contraception. All in the name of choice and civility. No wonder St. Thomas towers over every other statesman and was canonized. If he was a radical I wonder what God thinks of 21st century man? St. Thomas pray for us!!!

Pax,
Tarpeian
 
Your statements are unsubstantiated.

Peace,
Ed
No, they’re not. Our laws are not written to cater specifically to one religion or another. And any one religion’s laws do not make up the laws in the US. For example, one of the ten commandments is to honor the Sabbath. However, no one is called out on it when they miss Mass or the Sabbath.
 
Well now the government schools want to teach its ok that Timmy thinks 2+2=5. As long as Timmy can demonstrate why he thinks 2+2=5 then its acceptable and should be respected, not corrected. Charity demands correction. I cringe every time I hear something false should be respected and perpetuated. Jesus at the well said “go and sin no more.” Not I’m ok you are ok, keep on committing adultery.

Pax,
Tarpeian
Which schools are teaching 2+2=5?
 
Thomas More was a government official. Romans 13 indicates that to keep order governement officials may use the sword, i.e. captial punhishment. This may be against our modern day sensitivity but it’s in the Word of God! Committing mortal sin is worse than physically dieing and causing others to commit mortal sin is worse than physical murder.

Pax,
Tarpeian
Yeah, thanks, you made my point 🙂 That’s EXACTLY what I wouldn’t support. And that’s EXACTLY why I thank God for being born here instead of there.
 
With respect to the OP, here are just a few of my notions.

FIRST, it’s a mistake to say that “all men” are into the main professional (couch-sitting/spectating) sports.

I think sports have been a good thing . . . WHEN you participate even at a mediocre level. … but have been a BAD THING for men when all you do is sit on your duff watching.

The chest-pounding is sophomoric. C’mon, you have to admit. What’s particularly distressing , a real downer, is watching fat old guys wearing expensive sports gear that they have absolutely no intention of really using, and spouting on and on about how they USED TO play football. . . like maybe three games in high school about 25 years ago!

What jocks!

SECOND, I admire balance. I admire a guy who does sports, keeps fit, and does the whole “sound mind in a sound body” thing. This tends to exclude the nancy boys.

THIRD, as a man, I think it’s extremely cool to be able to do ANYTHING. . . to be a Swiss Army knife kind of guy. . . able to fix a car, patch the roof, talk about Kant, canoe, play a sport reasonably well, know Mozart and play electric guitar.

Of course, a real man is involved in his community and takes on some of the basic community chores: serves on committees, helps with an organization or two, gets involved with the church, etc.

FOURTH, I just don’t see homosexuality as masculine in any way. Sorry. Doesn’t cut it.
 
Yeah, thanks, you made my point 🙂 That’s EXACTLY what I wouldn’t support. And that’s EXACTLY why I thank God for being born here instead of there.
wdtprs.com/blog/2013/08/obamamath-common-core-curriculum-to-infect-catholic-schools/

If you don’t want a Roman Catholic source let me know, I will supply you with a secular one if needed.

And you have made mine my friend:) If you’re idea of utopia is relativism then enjoy it while you can. The fallacy of “freedom and liberty” served up by Locke and Hobbes is crumbling as we speak. Give me a Monarch any day even a tyrant. At least the tyrant believed he would ultimately be judged by God. If we are going to be moralistic then give me the crusades and inquisitions of 1500 years of Christendom. You can have the 227 MILLION deaths in the name of “freedom and liberty.”

I for one will happily take death of the body over the soul in Hell for eternity.

Pax,
Tarpeian
 
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