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Friar_David_O.Carm
Guest
Exactly!
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Khalid
Guest
No, or theyâd be called Eastern Catholics, without bringing my opinion on the specifics of the bankruptness of Byzantine theology in to sight. âOrthodoxâ means ethnic, Palamite, hesychist, rejecting Papal authority, tainted by many centuries of being crushed under the heel of Mahometans, rejecting the filioque, etc.** âOrthodoxâ and âCommunion with Romeâ are mutually exclusive.**
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Friar_David_O.Carm
Guest
The bolded statement is enough to make any opinion you post suspect from here on out.
How nice of you to come here and insult a sizable subset of Catholics.
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JRRTFAN
Guest
Well, there might be some, I donât know everybody in the Orthodox Churches. But in point of fact, one who holds to Eastern liturgical tradition and wishes to be in communion with the Roman Pontiff, becomes an Eastern Rite Catholic and eschews Orthodoxy. Call me carzy.
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Hesychios
Guest
My opinion is that the Orthodox churches do not teach anything that the Roman Catholic church would consider heretical. Therefore, anything the Orthodox church teaches is ok for a Roman Catholic communicant to learn.
You may feel differently.
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Cavaradossi
Guest
Iâm glad to see that you are filled with such humility that you have learned to judge without being blinded by pride. What a holy man you are.
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josephback
Guest
I first learned Catholic Communion theology from the Othodox, but the view of the Papacy wouldnât be kosher to an RC or an EC. Other than that though, we really are similar
My parish is Latin Rite OF, but I really liked the Liturgy of St. John Chrysostom when I was attending an Orthodox Church. It would be nice to find an EC out hereâŚ
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dzheremi
Guest
This is also how I felt as an RC, and so it always confused me to hear fellow RCs argue as they did about the errors of the Orthodox. I found a few friends among my fellow RCs who agreed with me that thereâs nothing wrong in Orthodox teachings, but when I asked them why they then remained Catholic (as the ones who held this view were generally very enamored of Eastern Orthodoxy), they said âI was born into itâ or âI donât knowâ.
It was quite an eye-opener, as I wasnât born into it, and was at that time quite conflicted between what I had experienced in a Byzantine church (which did NOT seem at all theologically bankrupt, thank you very much Khalid) and even in a traditional Benedictine monastery and the day-to-day experience of being RC. Of course then I stopped going altogether, so maybe I donât agree with your last sentence, Hesychios.
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Friar_David_O.Carm
Guest
Do not the Orthodox teach against papal infallibility?
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JRRTFAN
Guest
Yes, the Orthodox Churches are not in communion with Rome. I donât want to leave any question about that. There are Eastern Rite Catholics but they are not Orthodox. If by Orthodox, you mean isolated individuals, then you may be right, but their Churches are not.
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JRRTFAN
Guest
no, they do not.
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JRRTFAN
Guest
Itâs really not a matter of how I feel, itâs a matter of fact. The Otrthodox Churches are in schism with Rome. It;s easy to look up.
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Hesychios
Guest
I agree that Rome is in schism from Holy Orthodoxy.
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Hesychios
Guest
The Orthodox have no such doctrine, know of no such doctrine.
That is not a teaching.
Orthodox also do not have a teaching against, nor for, a flat earth.
What Orthodox teach is not heretical, which is why Orthodox theology does not come up in discussions between the churches. Only Roman Catholic theology becomes the basis for talking points.
Pope Benedict (as Cardinal Ratzinger) made that clear when he made his famous statement âŚ
Rome must not require more from the East with respect to the doctrine of primacy than had been formulated and was lived in the first millennium âŚ
What people rarely quote was the second part âŚ
Reunion could take place in this context if, on the one hand, the East would cease to oppose as heretical the developments that took place in the West in the second millennium and would accept the Catholic Church as legitimate and orthodox in the form she had acquired in the course of that development, while, on the other hand, the West would recognize the Church of the East as orthodox and legitimate in the form she has always had âŚ
No mention of Orthodox theology.
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Dave_in_Dallas
Guest
This post has de-railed a bit
The Eastern catholic churches are orthodox churches in communion with the Pope. Now there can be a great diversity in how their eastern faith is lived in out in their particular parish. Some are more âLatinizedâ than others, then again some Orthodox are more âLatinized / Proetstantizedâ than others.
The real sadness is that the Catholic and Orthodox churches are not in communion with one another.
The theology between the two is essentially the same yet expressed in different manner, at least when compared to the majority of Protestants. As been shown on this forum and on such radio/podcast shows like Fr. Loyaâs âLight of the Eastâ there is a difference of emphasis. Grant it sometimes there almost seems ot be some linguistic gymnastics required, i.e. the filioqueâŚ
Peace to all.
dave
The Eastern catholic churches are orthodox churches in communion with the Pope. Now there can be a great diversity in how their eastern faith is lived in out in their particular parish. Some are more âLatinizedâ than others, then again some Orthodox are more âLatinized / Proetstantizedâ than others.
The real sadness is that the Catholic and Orthodox churches are not in communion with one another.
The theology between the two is essentially the same yet expressed in different manner, at least when compared to the majority of Protestants. As been shown on this forum and on such radio/podcast shows like Fr. Loyaâs âLight of the Eastâ there is a difference of emphasis. Grant it sometimes there almost seems ot be some linguistic gymnastics required, i.e. the filioqueâŚ
Peace to all.
dave
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jwinch2
Guest
It is my understanding that Pope B16 has encouraged the Eastern Churches to retain and return to their roots regarding their traditions and liturgy. If so, I think that is wonderful.This post has de-railed a bit
The Eastern catholic churches are orthodox churches in communion with the Pope. Now there can be a great diversity in how their eastern faith is lived in out in their particular parish. Some are more âLatinizedâ than others, then again some Orthodox are more âLatinized / Proetstantizedâ than others.
dave
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I looked quite seriously at the OSB a few months ago but ended up staying away from it due to the perception that I had that the translation was not all it was touted to be and that the study notes were not very deep, and not always Orthodox in its teaching. I was hoping that as a new convert, the OSB would give me a good understanding of the Eastern tradition in interpreting Sacred Scripture and planned to use it along side my Bible commentaries from the Latin tradition.
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Alexander_Roman
Guest
Itâs just that today we simply say that Rome and Orthodoxy are separated from one another.
Rome and Orthodoxy are and will be working on ways to heal the separation.
Alex
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Alexander_Roman
Guest
Well, Brother, Eastern Catholics do use the term âOrthodox Christiansâ in their liturgy and I do believe the Latin Mass refers to those who teach the âOrthodox Faith.â
In 1596, the Union of Brest led those who signed it to call themselves âOrthodox in communion with Rome.â That is a fact and even the Orthodox acknowledge that - so you are wrong on this.
Roman Catholics in history, and especially when there was the monolithic Tridentine tradition, have likewise been âethnocentricâ that led to the failure of RC missions in Asia and elsewhere. You are wrong on that score as history will bear out.
St Gregory Palamas is recognized as a saint by Rome (this occurred in 1973) and you can look this up online. Hesychasm has now become better understood by Roman Catholics and is no longer considered by RCâs in terms of what you describe.
Orthodoxy did reject Filioquism as a heresy due to how it understood âAnd the Sonâ as saying that the Spirit has two Origins within the Trinity (if this was how the RC Church actually understood the Procession of the Spirit, then Rome would be condemning itself as it rejects this idea).
âPapal authorityâ in terms of papal jurisdiction never existed over the Eastern Churches in the first millennium. That Rome was an authority in faith and morals then - yes absolutely. But papal jurisdiction held no sway over the Christian East in the first millennium but was only a court of final appeal.
So your own RC Church would strenuously disagree with your assessment of Orthodoxy which seems rather angry.
From my own experience, angry people seldom base their conclusions upon actual facts.
Alex
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Zhenia
Guest
Fr Joe Loya is a wonderful priest! He baptized my daughter when we were in the Byzantine Catholic church. How can I find these podcasts you mention, âLight of the Eastâ?This post has de-railed a bit
The Eastern catholic churches are orthodox churches in communion with the Pope. Now there can be a great diversity in how their eastern faith is lived in out in their particular parish. Some are more âLatinizedâ than others, then again some Orthodox are more âLatinized / Proetstantizedâ than others.
The real sadness is that the Catholic and Orthodox churches are not in communion with one another.
The theology between the two is essentially the same yet expressed in different manner, at least when compared to the majority of Protestants. As been shown on this forum and on such radio/podcast shows like Fr. Loyaâs âLight of the Eastâ there is a difference of emphasis. Grant it sometimes there almost seems ot be some linguistic gymnastics required, i.e. the filioqueâŚ
Peace to all.
dave
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Hesychios
Guest
Unless I am mistaken the father Joe Loya you are referring to, the Augustinian priest, is a cousin of father Tom Loya (eparchy of Parma) who speaks on Theology of the Body and has the radio show-podcast.
Their common grandfather was a married Catholic priest.
The radio show is archived here âŚ
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