The Papal AntiChrist

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justinthemartyr said:
You have what authority? according to whom? and to who’s interpretation of scripture? your own?

Are you infallible then?
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I have all the authority given to me by Jesus.
There is no interpretation necessary, it is a plain and clear reading.
I am not infallible but Jesus is and so is His word.
 
J_C said:
agreed. but remember there is no one protesttant church. in fact there is no protestant “church” at all. There is only One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church.

The protestesats are ecclesial communities, isn’t that how Pope Bendict described them recently? they are not churches. they have a *certain *relationship to the true faith, but being not in communion with it and not under its authority they are little more than bible studies in a perpetual state of argumentaion with one another.
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The pope is in error, once again.
 
Schultzz said:
I wonder what happened to the other "L’ in your handle. Did someone tell you to get the “L” outta here? Who died and made you the boss? You do NOT speak for all Catholics. You are a “rabble rouser” (whatever that is).
They bash us. You bash them. Let’s see, I’ ll bet you think you are better than a typical Protestant. Please respond. Whatever happened to the peacemakers? Division is what YOU seem to be all about. That Mr. Excel is how the dark side works. If I were you I would take your anger, indignation, resentment, and bitterness to the cross and leave it there. The Catholic church has survived through the ages just fine without your help. It doesn’t need you to defend Her. Especially when your are trying to engage the wrong enemy. Wake up people. It is NOT other Christians that we need to convert. It is us. We need to convert from sin to holiness. Then let’s join together and celebrate what we have in common, then let’s fight the “good fight”. Excel if you don’t know what the good fight is all about then go get a spiritual director, go on retreat and learn who the real enemy is. You may need to see an eye doctor who has a chainsaw.
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:clapping:

Well said!

1 Cor 10:12-13
12 Therefore let any one who thinks that he stands take heed lest he fall.
 
Schultzz said:
I wonder what happened to the other "L’ in your handle. Did someone tell you to get the “L” outta here? Who died and made you the boss? You do NOT speak for all Catholics. You are a “rabble rouser” (whatever that is).
They bash us. You bash them. Let’s see, I’ ll bet you think you are better than a typical Protestant. Please respond. Whatever happened to the peacemakers? Division is what YOU seem to be all about. That Mr. Excel is how the dark side works. If I were you I would take your anger, indignation, resentment, and bitterness to the cross and leave it there. The Catholic church has survived through the ages just fine without your help. It doesn’t need you to defend Her. Especially when your are trying to engage the wrong enemy. Wake up people. It is NOT other Christians that we need to convert. It is us. We need to convert from sin to holiness. Then let’s join together and celebrate what we have in common, then let’s fight the “good fight”. Excel if you don’t know what the good fight is all about then go get a spiritual director, go on retreat and learn who the real enemy is. You may need to see an eye doctor who has a chainsaw.
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Well Schultzz, its good to see you are so attentive to language. Please continue to correct my spelling. Before I get the “L” outta here I would like to point out that you have read but not learned. The Catholic Lord told you not to offend or insult others, yet you call me a rabble rouser. They called the Lord this as well, thank you. The Jewish Messiah did not come to unite he came to divide. You have become so complacent in your faith that you can accept the protestant hate mongering. I cannot. You seem at peace with live and let live yet there is a large contingency of your protestant freinds who do not allow you the same grace.

All the protestants can do is deny the Catholic faith and they don’t even realize that they deny themselves as well. If the Catholic Church has no authority then the protestant church’s have even less. They refuse to accept that the KJV is cursed. Because of their saftey in America, they think they can afford to treat this as a casual decision. No one is here to kill us right. There are no Romans with their Lions and gladiators to tear the early church apart. No, they are safe here. The protestants think that they just came along after all the Church has done and just take over. None of you realize that if they got their wish and the HCC went away, this world would die. If America losts it’s Catholics, it would collapse. The protestant church does not have the power or the authority to defeat satan. We have held him at bay for two thousand years. Not a word of thanks from the protestants, just hate and denial.

Your life in America has blinded to the way life really is for most of humanity and the way it has been throughout most of history. America is an anomally, this is not the way things are supposed to be. The history of man is the history of suffering. You protestants have a false and skewed view of reality and America has given it to you. So it is easy to hide your heads in the sand and deny the true Church, because you have no intractable foe to face. Go ahead and deny this, your denial will not conjure up the kind of enemies the Catholic Church has faced. Why? Because God knows you are not up to the challange He knows the altered and damaged book you call the KJV. You are given the truth, but like the Jews of old whom Peter called the false Jews, you reject it because it is too inconvenient. In it’s place you offer hate, lies and accusations. Have I missed anything?

Oh yes, one more thing. The Church does indeed need me and others like me to defend her. We have always been there, even when the peace lovers stayed safe at home.

My complaint and my only complaint is the with the protestant hate for and denial of the church, whats yours?
 
This is a horribly sad thread. It is the kind that awakens the hostility amongst us that should be buried with the old Adam, and not present with the ressurected Christ.

The papacy is not antichrist, and neither is Martin Luther. As we blind ourselves with these past condemnations, we miss not only the rising threats to all Christians, but also the opportunities to work in closer harmony, to seek convergence where we can, discuss and pray about divergence in the love and charity that Christs expects, and to help the least of God’s children and bring others to Christ.

To everyone involved in this thread, I pray His peace.
Jon
 
Excelency said:
The Catholic Church survived the pagans, the dark ages, the plagues, the protestants and the nazi’s. The nice comfortable road the protestants have put themselves on with their American book printed in English was paved by the blood of the Catholic Church in two thousand of history. The protestants have no intractable enemy to face, they have America to fight their battles. The Revelation they hail so loudly does not even include them. There was no anticipation of a rebellious protestant reformation by the author. It was written to the seven Churches, the protestant church is not one of them. Rather, the persecution of the true Church is happening before our very eyes, at the hands of protestants. We Catholics do not hate you, but you most certainly hate us.
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Code: 
                “And I say to thee: That thou art                      Peter; and upon this rock                      I will build my church, and the gates of                      hell shall not prevail against it.” *Matthew* 16: 18 DRB]

                “Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: **and behold I am with you all days,                      even to the consummation of the world.”** *Matthew* 28: 20 DRB]

                             Those who break away from Rome contravene what our Lord has ensured us about his Church, that She will never fall.
 
I love my pope and am grateful for his authority Jesus gave him. He is the “glue” that holds it all together. Being 1.5 billion Roman Catholics and 2500+ dioceses around the world, he guides us so there isn’t any confusion or chaos like with other “religions”.
 
Protestant101 said:
I am not the least bit offended by any of your remarks above in your first post. I actually appreciate you sharing your true feelings here. I have noticed that when a Catholic posts in the vein which you have chosen to do here in this thread; that they always ignore the doctrinal disagreement end of it, and opt instead, for an aggressive assertion of “authority.” Their last-ditch stand seems to make it’s strongest appeal to their church “authority,” rather than the Scriptures.
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Thank you Protestant101. Your point on doctrinal disagreement is well taken. I must remind you though that as Catholics, we do not challenge the Churches interpretation of scripture nor do we assume any role in it’s interpretation. We accept decisions of the Church hierarchy even if we disagree. The protestants do not, if they disagree too strongly, they find another church. Certainly they can find one that thinks like they do. No such luck for the Catholics. I personally despise authority but I realize that the Church must have authority or else other opinions creep in. Opinions like those of the gonstics and pagans and French preists who think they can disregard Rome and Catholic Churches in communist China whom the state wants to oversee. To some extent it is about authority.
 
Excelency said:
Thank you Protestant101. Your point on doctrinal disagreement is well taken. I must remind you though that as Catholics, we do not challenge the Churches interpretation of scripture nor do we assume any role in it’s interpretation. We accept decisions of the Church hierarchy even if we disagree. The protestants do not, if they disagree too strongly, they find another church. Certainly they can find one that thinks like they do. No such luck for the Catholics. I personally despise authority but I realize that the Church must have authority or else other opinions creep in. Opinions like those of the gonstics and pagans and French preists who think they can disregard Rome and Catholic Churches in communist China whom the state wants to oversee. To some extent it is about authority.
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Well; if you truly “despise authority,” then you are not a very good Catholic. :tsktsk:

I think that underneath all of that rough talk of your’s here, there is a human being with a heart that seeks God and truth. I will look forward to hearing more from you. 🙂

I have been on this forum for over a year, so I don’t really need to be reminded about the Catholic stand on authority, as it pertains to doctrine; however, this is not the biggest difference between Catholics and Protestants.
 
Excelency said:
Greetings, this is my vent post about all the bashing of the Catholic Church. If the protestants don’t like it, well I’m sorry but this how I see the of the church.

The Catholic Church is and remains one of the ancient religions of ancient Israel.
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Hardly:​

  • 1. There is an historical continuity between Catholicism & the religion of ancient Israel - but that doesn’t justify saying that the later religion “is” the earlier. Orthodoxy & Protestantism are also historically continuous with Israel’s religion. Whether a religion is in theological continuity with an earlier one to which it is related, is a separate question.
  • 2. It does not follow that because something is found in a later form of a religion, it existed in an earlier form of the same religion. So Christians would be mistaken in reasoning that because the Blessed Trinity is found in Christianity, it must have been believed in by pre-Christian Judaism.
The appearance of it’s leader was prophesied by the patriarchs of ancient Israel centuries before his arrival. The Jewish Messiah/Catholic Lord was a Jew, his deciples were Jews.
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He was, & they were; but His arrival was not predicted; the alleged predictions can be more satisfactorily accounted for by being taken in their historical context. The “predictions” are applications to Him of passages which in their proper sense do not refer to Him. To re-use a text by applying it to what it does not, properly speaking, signify is a legitimate type of interpretation; but an applied sense is not the same thing as a proper sense.​

The religion was by, of and for the Jews and for the Jews first. The first converts were Jews followed immediately by the Romans and Greeks. (these conversions happening Christ before Christ was crucified).

The headquarters of the church eventually moved to Rome were it is today, but it is a line unbroken. It does not matter how loud John Hagee screams or how hard the evangelicals clap their hands, these facts cannot be truthfully disputed.
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However unbroken the line of bishops of Rome may be, that does not in itself show continuity of faith. Continuity of succession is perfectly compatible with apostasy; as many Protestants are well aware, even if Catholics are not. Conversely, there can be continuity of faith even where there is no continuity of Church organisation. What Catholics have to do is take account of both sorts of continuity, & not take for granted that organisational continuity proves continuity in faith.​

Weak arguments for Catholicism have nothing to recommend them; only people who cannot think clearly will be convinced by them. If we are going to use arguments, we owe non-Catholics the best reasons & reasoning possible.
The Catholic Church survived the pagans, the dark ages, the plagues, the protestants and the nazi’s. The nice comfortable road the protestants have put themselves on with their American book printed in English
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:confused:​

was paved by the blood of the Catholic Church in two thousand of history. The protestants have no intractable enemy to face, they have America to fight their battles. The Revelation they hail so loudly does not even include them. There was no anticipation of a rebellious protestant reformation by the author. It was written to the seven Churches, the protestant church is not one of them. Rather, the persecution of the true Church is happening before our very eyes, at the hands of protestants.
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:confused: :confused: :confused:​

We Catholics do not hate you, but you most certainly hate us.
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:confused: Yes indeed - we love you so much we’re going to insult & belittle you 😦​

As Catholics we know there is more to being a member of Christs church than simply praising the Catholic Lord. You protestants just do not want to do the hard things required of a Catholic, and since you are not willing to live like us, you escape into hatred. How can you be children of the light yet seek such darkness. How can you cut yourselves off from the Apostolic light that Christ has given us. If you hate Christs church, you hate Christ.
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This is a very sweeping generalisation - to put it no more strongly​

We have blazed the trail for you long ago, get off the hate bandwagon or be shown be lukewarm you truly are.

The proteatant church has no authority, it is self appointed and engineered the way rebellious people want it to be but it is not the way of this ancient religion of the ancient Israelites.
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Hisalone said:
As a disciple of Jesus I have all the authority He has given me.
If you have an issue with that then take it up with Him…
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disciple of Jesus? which one? St Peter, St John, St Thomas,etc…? why couldnt you be just one of follewers of the disciples?
take it up with Jesus? He never told us you are one of His disciples, He would not know what we would be talking about.
with God, power is given, we dont just assume to have just by reading the Bible. otherwise, we could all claim the same thing. see the light yet? read the Bible again you might see some things there that says something like this: Thank you Father for hidden these things from them and reveal to these only.

I]“The catholic faith even when waterdown can boil the world into rags.” Chesterton
 
JonNC said:
This is a horribly sad thread. It is the kind that awakens the hostility amongst us that should be buried with the old Adam, and not present with the ressurected Christ.

The papacy is not antichrist, and neither is Martin Luther. As we blind ourselves with these past condemnations, we miss not only the rising threats to all Christians, but also the opportunities to work in closer harmony, to seek convergence where we can, discuss and pray about divergence in the love and charity that Christs expects, and to help the least of God’s children and bring others to Christ.

To everyone involved in this thread, I pray His peace.
Jon
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👍 👍 👍 That’s a beautiful post 🙂 - keep them coming 🙂​

 
Hisalone said:
I have all the authority given to me by Jesus.
There is no interpretation necessary, it is a plain and clear reading.
I am not infallible but Jesus is and so is His word.
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So you dare to compare yourself to Jesus. So much that you say Jesus is fallible but you arre not infalible? How dare you. Shame on you.

Well…okay I know that’s not what you meant. But re-read what you wrote.

As baptized Chrisitans we share in Christ’s inheritance as priest, prophet and king. But never the kind of authority you claim. That authority was left to the Church, not a church and most certainly not an individual person. Even Papal infalibility is grossly misunderrstood. To much read about it on Catholic Answers if you wish to learn.

Hisalone, what really happened to turn you away from the Catholic Church? Do you come from a mixed religious background as I did?
 
vocatio said:
So you dare to compare yourself to Jesus. So much that you say Jesus is fallible but you arre not infalible? How dare you. Shame on you.

Well…okay I know that’s not what you meant. But re-read what you wrote.

As baptized Chrisitans we share in Christ’s inheritance as priest, prophet and king. But never the kind of authority you claim. That authority was left to the Church, not a church and most certainly not an individual person. Even Papal infalibility is grossly misunderrstood. To much read about it on Catholic Answers if you wish to learn.

Hisalone, what really happened to turn you away from the Catholic Church? Do you come from a mixed religious background as I did?
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Jesus does not err.
I err
How more plain can I make it.
What authority do disciples have
Authority to trample on serpents and scorpions,
Authority to cast out demons, to lay hands on the sick to mend the brokenhearted to preach the good news of salvation. To declare the day of the Lord.
To name a few.

I went outside the Catholic Church to learn about the Holy Spirit. NonCatholics have a more substantial body of work on the workings of the Holy Spirit.
 
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