The pill to regularize cycles

  • Thread starter Thread starter utunumsint
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
U

utunumsint

Guest
Hi,

Our priest has given my wife permission to use the pill to regularize her cycles.

Based on my understanding, the mini-pill is out of the question because

1-It does not regularize cycles.
2-Its primary function is to prevent implantation of a fertilized egg.

IUDs are also out of the question for the same reasons.

It seems as though there is no available options out there for breastfeeding women to use to regularize their cycles. Is this true?

Obviously I am not asking for medical opinions here, but anecdotal information we can bring to our own doctor, who is not pro-life, and has not offered any morally acceptable alternatives.

Note: I am pretty sure that the regular estrogen/progesteron pill would be acceptable given her needs, but would also have the side effect of drying up her milk supply.

God bless,
Ut
 
The pill does not regularize anything, the pill makes women have a fake cycle.

Get her to a good NFP only doctor.
 
Actually, the church does allow the pill to be used solely for the purpose of regulating a woman’s cycle. However, you have a problem here because I assume you and your wife will continue to have marital relations, and therefore, the pill will either prevent pregnancy, or cause a chemical abortion. If your wife is going to use the pill, you must not have marital relations during that time.

thecatholicletter.com/birth-control-abortion-article-subjects-40/100-the-catholic-birth-control-a-sex-faq#3
3 - If a woman is using birth control for medical reasons other than preventing pregnancy, it is okay to have sex?
No, but not because she would be preventing pregnancy. Any chemical birth control products on the market right now used to regulate things like menstrual cycles also have abortifacient properties. In other words, they would not be guilty of using birth control, but they would be guilty of murder. If your doctor is recommending such drugs, seek a second opinion. Most of the time, other drugs can be used to accomplish the same medical benefits that birth control does.
 
Actually, the church does allow the pill to be used solely for the purpose of regulating a woman’s cycle. However, you have a problem here because I assume you and your wife will continue to have marital relations, and therefore, the pill will either prevent pregnancy, or cause a chemical abortion. If your wife is going to use the pill, you must not have marital relations during that time.

thecatholicletter.com/birth-control-abortion-article-subjects-40/100-the-catholic-birth-control-a-sex-faq#3
What you say is true of the mini pill and the IUDs.

The estrogen/progesteron pill only has a theoretical and unproven possibility of causing an abortion. The church does not require one to abstain in such cases. Or at least that is what the cannon lawyer told me.

The question I’m asking about right now is if anyone knows about a pill that works while breastfeeding that is no progesterone only.

God bless,
Ut
 
What you say is true of the mini pill and the IUDs.

The estrogen/progesteron pill only has a theoretical and unproven possibility of causing an abortion. The church does not require one to abstain in such cases. Or at least that is what the cannon lawyer told me.

The question I’m asking about right now is if anyone knows about a pill that works while breastfeeding that is no progesterone only.

God bless,
Ut
I am not a canon lawyer, so you can take my opinion for what it is worth, but it is my understanding that you cannot have sex if you are using any kind of birth control at all. If it doesn’t cause abortions, just the act of preventing pregnancy is still a mortal sin.

I would definitely get a second opinion as to the answer to what kind of pill you can use. Any chemical you use is going to have side effects, though, that is just the nature of medication. All birth control runs the risk of blood clots and other problems. You’re messing with hormones, and that can be very tricky.
 
The truth is, I don’t think there are any morally acceptable alternatives. While breastfeeding, any sort of chemical contraception can interfere with the milk, at least in some way. Even the combination pill you mentioned doesn’t always prevent ovulation. And, as mentioned above, it won’t regulate the cycle, it’ll just give the appearance of regulation.

My question would be: What is your motive for regulating cycles while nursing? In general, there is more infertile times while breastfeeding. But yes, there are also longer periods of abstinence. God made us this way to help space children. If something is going on, perhaps she needs to find the source of the irregularity instead of simply treating the symptoms. I am certainly no expert. Try www.omsoul.com for a list of people who are.
 
Here is what Fr. Serpa said on this matter on this very site:

This is a very important matter that is widely misunderstood:

The Church considers a miscarriage to be a physical evil. Since abortion DELIBERATELY causes a miscarriage, it is therefore also a MORAL evil. The Church sees an UNintended miscarriage as only a physical evil since it is not deliberately caused by the couple.

The use of the pill for medical reasons may cause an UNintended miscarriage. Women often have unintended miscarriages—sometimes without even knowing it. It is only miscarriages that are INTENDED that the Church considers immoral. The Church never allows the pill to be used as an abortifacient. But it does allow the use of the pill for medical reasons with the possiblity of producing an unintended miscarriage—without obliging the couple to abstain from sexual relations during that time.

Fr. Vincent Serpa, O.P.
 
The truth is, I don’t think there are any morally acceptable alternatives. While breastfeeding, any sort of chemical contraception can interfere with the milk, at least in some way. Even the combination pill you mentioned doesn’t always prevent ovulation. And, as mentioned above, it won’t regulate the cycle, it’ll just give the appearance of regulation.

My question would be: What is your motive for regulating cycles while nursing? In general, there is more infertile times while breastfeeding. But yes, there are also longer periods of abstinence. God made us this way to help space children. If something is going on, perhaps she needs to find the source of the irregularity instead of simply treating the symptoms. I am certainly no expert. Try www.omsoul.com for a list of people who are.
I have good reasons. And I know all the NFP methods.

God bless,
Ut
 
What you say is true of the mini pill and the IUDs.

The estrogen/progesteron pill only has a theoretical and unproven possibility of causing an abortion. The church does not require one to abstain in such cases. Or at least that is what the cannon lawyer told me.
I would love to see the documentation that the mini-pill is more likely to cause a miscarriage than the regular pill… 🤷

The regular pill ALSO works in the same manner as the mini-pill - read ANY package insert for ANY pill and you’ll see that it works by
Mode of Action
Combination oral contraceptives act by suppression of gonadotropins. Although the primary mechanism of this action is inhibition of ovulation, other alterations include changes in the cervical mucus (which increase the difficulty of sperm entry into the uterus) and changes in the endometrium (which reduce the likelihood of implantation).
Here are some package inserts… they all say the same thing (above).
berlex.bayerhealthcare.com/html/products/pi/fhc/YAZ_PI.pdf?WT.mc_id=www.berlex.com
seasonique.com/docs/prescribing-information.pdf
ortho-mcneilpharmaceutical.com/ortho-mcneilpharmaceutical/shared/pi/cycltri.pdf#zoom=100
The question I’m asking about right now is if anyone knows about a pill that works while breastfeeding that is no progesterone only.
The mini-pill is only considered better for breastfeeding because it does not contain estrogen (which can affect the milk supply). Any regular pill would contain estrogen.

Another reason to avoid using the pill:
thepillkills.com/

Are you sure the irregular menstrual cycles are something that requires treatment? I’ve heard it’s perfectly normal and healthy to have irregular cycles while breastfeeding… 🤷 :o
NFP CAN be used effectively while breastfeeding with irregular cycles… just so you know! 🙂
 
I would love to see the documentation that the mini-pill is more likely to cause a miscarriage than the regular pill… 🤷

The regular pill ALSO works in the same manner as the mini-pill - read ANY package insert for ANY pill and you’ll see that it works by

Here are some package inserts… they all say the same thing (above).
berlex.bayerhealthcare.com/html/products/pi/fhc/YAZ_PI.pdf?WT.mc_id=www.berlex.com
seasonique.com/docs/prescribing-information.pdf
ortho-mcneilpharmaceutical.com/ortho-mcneilpharmaceutical/shared/pi/cycltri.pdf#zoom=100
The difference is that the mini pill does not suppress ovulation, which makes the possibility of fertilization much greater. One of its primary functions is to harden the uterine wall making implantation impossible.

The estrogen/progesterone pill is supposed to stop ovulation most of the time, therefore it is much less likely that the implantation scenario would occur.
The mini-pill is only considered better for breastfeeding because it does not contain estrogen (which can affect the milk supply). Any regular pill would contain estrogen.
Which is why I am looking for something that would be better suited for breast feeding.
Another reason to avoid using the pill:
thepillkills.com/
Are you sure the irregular menstrual cycles are something that requires treatment? I’ve heard it’s perfectly normal and healthy to have irregular cycles while breastfeeding… 🤷 :o
NFP CAN be used effectively while breastfeeding with irregular cycles… just so you know! 🙂
Not if you have constant cervical mucus, wildly irregulat cycles, and an obvious hormone issue that was present before the pregnancy.

God bless,
Ut
 
There are some pills out there that preven ovulation, but if ovulation does occur, and fertilisation takes place, the woman will get pregnant at the same rate as if she were not on the pill. The church (the POPE, by the way) in the same document that reaffirms the sinfulness of contraceptives, allows for heir use for therapeutic reasons. It is totally fine to use the pill for theraeutic reasons.

The pills I know of you can ask about are Yasmin, Junel Fe, or any low dose hormone. My doctor is prolife, and he reccomended these to me. I have a very crippling medical reason to use these. Without them, I cannot function in a job, school, or anything else.

Talk to your doctor first and foremost. Avoid at all costs IUD, or the shot, as these only serve to prevent implantation.
 
Not if you have constant cervical mucus, wildly irregulat cycles, and an obvious hormone issue that was present before the pregnancy.
There are OTHER NFP methods than mucous-only - Have you tried the Sympto-Thermal method? I experienced exactly those conditions and was able to use NFP successfully. 🤷

I know I’ve mentioned this on your other threads - and you said you’d look into this - is seeing a SPECIALIST - a Reproductive Endocrinologist. A regular OB/GYN is not always fully trained in the underlying conditions that can cause these issues - they will normally just prescribe The Pill and walk away because it covers up all the symptoms - but again doesn’t get to the ROOT of the problem. You even mentioned before in another thread that her current doctor has no respect for NFP and has brushed off her hypothyroidism. Thyroid issues REALLY SHOULD see a specialist. 😉
 
I think that this thread will cause many to play a doctor on the forums.

I will only speak to one example. My wife was told she would never be able to have children due to ovulation problems. This was confirmed by a second doctor. After ten years with our current physician, he suggested a birth control pill for six months as a way of regularizing her. She was pregnant within three months of coming off this medicice. That is why we named him John, after John the Baptist whose mother was considered barren.
 
Ok, a couple of things here:

(a) The pill doesn’t “regulate” a cycle. It supresses a woman’s hormones and creates an artificial “cycle.” It isn’t even a real menstrual cycle.

(b) A priest can’t give you permission to do anything that is intrinsically disordered (i.e., a moral evil, a sin)

(c) Your later posts indicate your reason for trying to “regulate” her cycle have to do with contracpetion, not some medical necessity, based on this statement where someone suggested using NFP, “Not if you have constant cervical mucus, wildly irregulat cycles, and an obvious hormone issue that was present before the pregnancy.”

(d) Contraception is always a moral evil. You cannot use the pill for what you are proposing.

Bottom line: you cannot contracept. You seem to be trying to use the idea of “regulating” her cycle in a way that is for contraception and trying to call it something else.

Unless maybe we are missing something. For what medical purpose are you proposing the pill to “regulate” her cycle as a solution? A medical *necessity *that cannot be treated any other way *may *indeed be morally permissable with a secondary, unintended side effect of infertility. But, that doesn’t seem to be what you are describing here.
 
Ok, a couple of things here:

(a) The pill doesn’t “regulate” a cycle. It supresses a woman’s hormones and creates an artificial “cycle.” It isn’t even a real menstrual cycle.
I do not know your medical credentials, but I know one doctor that disagrees with you and his information proved accurate in one case.
(b) A priest can’t give you permission to do anything that is intrinsically disordered (i.e., a moral evil, a sin)
Again, the OP knows of one situation where a priest disagreed with you. There is a possibility where one can be allowed to commit an intrinsically evil action. If one commits a postive good simultaneous with a negative good, and if the positive good is greater than the negative, the the law of double effect allows such an action. One must not forget why contraception is intrinsically evil, that is, that it offends the fecundity, or fruitfulness of marriage.
 
My wife is also on the pill for medical reasons and it has helped her out a lot.

Take any medical advice that you get on CAF with a grain of salt. It isn’t true that the pill is an abortifacient and the pill does help many women with their health. Just get medical advice from your doctor and moral advice from a good priest. The Church does allow the pill for medical reasons, so so if you have a legitimate reason and it is the best treatment then you’re ok.
 
I do not know your medical credentials, but I know one doctor that disagrees with you and his information proved accurate in one case.
I’m sure there are doctors willing to ignore the science and the information provided by the pharmaceutical companies who manufacture the pill and who will state that the pill “regulates” a cycle. It doesn’t change the pharmacology or the facts.
Again, the OP knows of one situation where a priest disagreed with you.
This is not accurate. The OP knows his priest gave him “permission.” That does not lead to the conclusion that the priest had the ability to do so or rightly applied Catholic moral teaching in doing so.

Knowing of a priest who will give such permissions does not make the permission valid. There are numerous posters on CAF who know a priest-- in fact many posters who were actually told by priests-- to contracept, get sterilized, get married down the street at the Episcopal church because of their prior marriage, and many other intrinsically evil acts. That does not alter the morality of the act, it may alter the person’s culpability since they received bad information. However, with the ease of finding the real truth via the Catechism and other Church documents, it does not entirely absolve the party from responsibility.

Bottom line: A priest cannot give permission to commit an intrinsically evil act, a sin.

Now, perhaps the priest misunderstood the question. Perhaps the OP has not fully explained the situation. That is why I said it **seems **that the permission was misplaced in this situation. Again, we don’t have all the facts only what the OP said. We should certainly give the priest the benefit of the doubt. If there is a legitimate medical need, then certainly the priest was correct as far as double effect goes. However, there are other Church documents that *lend weight *to the requirement to abstain due to the abortifacient potential of the pill. The Church hasn’t made a definitive statement in that area.
There is a possibility where one can be allowed to commit an intrinsically evil action. If one commits a postive good simultaneous with a negative good, and if the positive good is greater than the negative, the the law of double effect allows such an action. One must not forget why contraception is intrinsically evil, that is, that it offends the fecundity, or fruitfulness of marriage.
This is not accurate. You have misstated the criteria required for the principle of double effect to be legitimately used. One can NEVER do evil so that good may come of it. That is a teaching readily found in the Catechism (see below). First, here are the criteria necessary to employ the principle of double effect:

First, that the action contemplated be in itself either morally good or morally indifferent; second, that the bad result not be directly intended; third, that the good result not be a direct causal result of the bad result; and fourth, that the good result be “proportionate to” the bad result.

Catholic moral teaching on doing an intrinsically evil action, see here for the full text of the section:

1750 The morality of human acts depends on:
  • the object chosen;
  • the end in view or the intention;
  • the circumstances of the action.
The object, the intention, and the circumstances make up the “sources,” or constitutive elements, of the morality of human acts.

1755 A morally good act requires the goodness of the object, of the end, and of the circumstances together. An evil end corrupts the action, even if the object is good in itself (such as praying and fasting “in order to be seen by men”).

The object of the choice can by itself vitiate an act in its entirety. There are some concrete acts - such as fornication - that it is always wrong to choose, because choosing them entails a disorder of the will, that is, a moral evil.

1756 It is therefore an error to judge the morality of human acts by considering only the intention that inspires them or the circumstances (environment, social pressure, duress or emergency, etc.) which supply their context. **There are acts which, in and of themselves, independently of circumstances and intentions, are always gravely illicit by reason of their object; **such as blasphemy and perjury, murder and adultery. One may not do evil so that good may result from it.

Therefore, according to 1756 one can NEVER choose an intrinsically evil act (contraception) even for a good intention. If one does so, one is misapplying the principle of double effect.
 
Your wife wouldn’t be taking a contraceptive, she’d be taking “legitimate” medicine to help with a medical problem. The fact that said medicine would render her unable to conceive is an unfortunate side effect- is chemotherapy sinful because it might cause such issues?
 
Ok, a couple of things here:
(a) The pill doesn’t “regulate” a cycle. It supresses a woman’s hormones and creates an artificial “cycle.” It isn’t even a real menstrual cycle.
pnewton;5755875:
I do not know your medical credentials, but I know one doctor that disagrees with you and his information proved accurate in one case.
I don’t think medical credentials are required to use google…

knowyourperiod.com/pill_main.htm
Important Differences
The withdrawal bleeding women typically experience during the Pill-free or placebo week of the Pill regimen tends to be comparatively more predictable and lighter than a menstrual period. This symptom relief is most likely the result of the fact that women on the Pill are not ovulating or experiencing a real “biological” menstrual period.
knowmycycle.com/menstrual-questions.aspx
Women on the Pill experience a withdrawal bleed, which usually lasts 3 to 4 days, as opposed to a normal menstrual period, which lasts, on average, 5 days, and averages less blood loss than a normal period.2. Mishell, p. 904A
contraception.about.com/od/additionalresources/g/WithdrawalBleed.htm
Definition: The bleeding a woman experiences each month while using a hormonal birth control method, such as the Pill, the patch, or the NuvaRing. Monthly withdrawal bleeding is not the same thing as having a real menstrual period.
A withdrawal bleeding episode occurs during this week because the change in hormone dosage causes the uterine lining to weaken just enough to allow for some bleeding to occur. It is important to point out that withdrawal bleeding is due to the change in hormone levels, not a true period.
 
Actually, the church does allow the pill to be used solely for the purpose of regulating a woman’s cycle. However, you have a problem here because I assume you and your wife will continue to have marital relations, and therefore, the pill will either prevent pregnancy, or cause a chemical abortion. If your wife is going to use the pill, you must not have marital relations during that time.
The above opinion is correct. Let me explain why.

Intrinsically evil acts, according to Veritatis Splendor, are always immoral, and are never justified by good intention, or by circumstances. The circumstance of needing to regulate cycles for health does not justify the use of an intrinsically evil means to that end. The end does not justify the means.

So if a woman is not sexually active, she may use the pill to regulate her cycles (although I am not giving a medical opinion as to whether such a use is the best treatment for that problem).

But if a woman is married and is having marital relations, the choice to have sexual relations that is contracepted is the choice of an intrinsically evil act. This is a mortal sin regardless of whether it is contraception or abortifacient contraception.

My understanding is that all chemical contraceptives, including all hormone contraceptives and even some spermicides, are sometimes abortifacient.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top